FTTP Installation Question

Hi all,

FTTP has finally gone live for our property! Woo! We placed an order on the 8th and have an installation date of the 22nd. The BT Broadband Availability Checker states; "Single Dwelling Unit Residential OH Feed joint user pole." Should I be at all concerned about the pole being "joint user"? Because normally it says "no anticipated issues", instead.

Cheers,

Will

‘Joint user pole’ means that the CBT is mounted on a pole which is owned by the power company, but Openreach have an agreement to site their copper/fibre equipment on it.

The installer will require a 2nd safety man for when they climb the pole. It’ll most likely say this on the job notes. If not, it’s no biggie, it is a tried and tested process to access these poles.

Don’t fret.

Hope you don’t get a contractor

Thanks, Zarjaz!

You may remember a thread of mine a while back, where I mentioned that there is a pole between the one with the CBT on and our property (our copper feed goes overhead to the nearest pole then DIG to the property). It looks like the fibre will be going OH between these poles and then continuing in the same vein, onto the property, instead of going underground, like the copper does. The pole nearest the property has definitely got a power cable on it, but not so sure about the one with the CBT on. Maybe there is one on it, but it's not easily identifiable. I think I'm overthinking this, haha!

The only contractor I have seen working around here with OR is BNE, but I think they only do the actual "rollout stuff", not the installs. Are contractors known to mess these types of installs up?

Edited by Grimers (Sun 12-Sep-21 20:15:08)

I can't be 100% certain but I thought I've seen some forum threads in the past where they've had either Kelly's Communications or M.J. Quinn instead of Openreach. If you don't get an actual Openreach engineer doing the installation, instead of one of the above, you may find problems with your installation or perhaps no job done at all. These two companies appear to be notorious for messing things up or not doing the job right, so hopefully you'll get someone who's actually from Openreach to do your installation.

Good luck! Have some coffee/tea and biscuits on standby, unless COVID 'stuff' doesn't allow this that is.

Cheers! Fingers crossed! Don't worry, I'll make sure that they're fed and watered, if like you say, it's allowed! Should be now, I would've thought!

I hope you do not get the cowboy from M J Quinn I had, because they will reject it.

Why would they reject it?

I'm sure they will think of something.

The BT Openreach chap I was talking to last week had no good word for them (Quins) at all and Kelly's, He been sent out to do a job that Quins had rejected as there were tree branches in the way, He had no problem doing the FTTP install at all for a neighbor .

M J Quinn and Kellys are paid per job for FTTP installs by Openreach, so if the job looks like it might take a bit longer they find a reason to reject it and go off to the next quick job to get their cash.

Mine was rejected due to a blocked duct, it wasn’t but look a lot of work and time to get the rope in and then the fibre fed, so far more time than the fixed rate would have paid for with Quinn’s.

Kellys work for some of the altnets doing installs and the feedback there seems much better, both ways too as their guys seem happier working with them too.

The fact that you are fed from a joint user pole, i.e. phone and electricity supply may be in your favour, Openreach have particular safety rules for working on these poles, I suspect that the contractors would not be allowed near them. If you do get a contractor they will probably turn the job down.

I've specifically asked the person that has recently worked on my case, for Openreach. They have been incredibly helpful, so hopefully it won't be too much to ask.

Edited by Grimers (Tue 14-Sep-21 21:40:56)

Good luck!
Mine was due to be installed on the 22nd Sept too, but OpenReach called on Monday and asked if I wanted it earlier. Now being installed on Friday afternoon.
My only concern is where they'll put the cable to be able to route it to where I'd like (odd shaped house with bay windows and an open porch).

Anyway, I will be ready and waiting with tea and biscuits and hopeful for an OpenReach engineer 🙂

In reply to a post by MilesR:

My only concern is where they'll put the cable to be able to route it to where I'd like (odd shaped house with bay windows and an open porch).

I also have concerns about cable routing please post your experience on how accommodating the engineer is and what "rules" they have for routing the cable. Thanks

Yep, will do.

I like to think if you're kind and polite to people, and respect their role / experience then they will be accommodating. I even have a pre-drilled hole ready 😄
(To be fair this is just from where I ripped out the VirginMedia cabling that's not been used for a year and will never be used again).

I'm also not averse to running my own network cabling (already have a bit of it around the house), so I'm sure we will work something out.

The last OpenReach engineer who came here a year ago (for a FTTC set up) was a lovely guy who went out of his way to make sure it was all as good as it could be. Hopefully my install on Friday will be just as good.

Thanks! Ooh, that would be nice if they offer to do it earlier! Fingers crossed that your install goes well, too!

The OpenReach rep (Kelly Group) turned up at 4:15 today...and said it was a 3-4 hour job and so would not be able to complete it. I thought that would be the case.
So now I have to wait until tomorrow and try to call TalkTalk again and go through the process of re-booking a new appointment 🙁

Unlucky, good luck with the next appointment. Hopefully it'll be someone who's actually from Openreach.

In reply to a post by MilesR:

So now I have to wait until tomorrow and try to call TalkTalk again and go through the process of re-booking a new appointment 🙁

Is that how it works? Surely if Kelly's cancell the appointment, it is up to them or OpenReach to come up with a new one. Also, shouldn't Kelly's/OpenReach inform TalkTalk? Since it is TT whp is paying OR/K to do the job? Your part in all this is to pay whatever TT charge you.

Cheers!

As frustrating as it is, the TalkTalk rep said unless I push it then it will just take longer to sort out. They said that their systems will trigger a message and contact me to arrange a new appointment but I'm simply better off calling them today.

That sucks, man! I spoke to an Openreach engineer who was working nearby, yesterday. He said that it would be highly unlikely that a contractor would be doing our install. Also, we have an AM appointment, so there shouldn't be any time issues. Maybe make sure that the next appointment you have is an AM one. Good luck!

Edited by Grimers (Sat 18-Sep-21 09:05:54)

Yeah, sucks big time. The earliest they can do is the 7th October now 🙁
Though it is a morning appointment.

Just means that it will now cost me another month of my JohnLewis FTTC connection (£40~), which is a pain.

In reply to a post by Grimers:

That sucks, man! I spoke to an Openreach engineer who was working nearby, yesterday. He said that it would be highly unlikely that a contractor would be doing our install. Also, we have an AM appointment, so there shouldn't be any time issues. Maybe make sure that the next appointment you have is an AM one. Good luck!

It's irrelevant if it's an AM or PM appointment.

OpenReach engineers are paid a salary.
OpenReach contractors are paid per job.

Any job that's going to take 3-4 hours is dropped like a hot stone by OpenReach's contractors.

They simply cannot make a living by doing 4 hour long jobs. They would manage 2 jobs per day and that would make their job very low paid.

The contractors are literally told to leave the complicated jobs. They are reassigned to OpenReach engineers.

The contractors get a lot of stick. Some of them do deserve it.
Their pay is structured in such a way though that they don't get paid to spend 4 hours doing a complicated installation or to go fault finding at every junction on an FTTC circuit.

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

In reply to a post by Grimers:

That sucks, man! I spoke to an Openreach engineer who was working nearby, yesterday. He said that it would be highly unlikely that a contractor would be doing our install. Also, we have an AM appointment, so there shouldn't be any time issues. Maybe make sure that the next appointment you have is an AM one. Good luck!

It's irrelevant if it's an AM or PM appointment.

OpenReach engineers are paid a salary.
OpenReach contractors are paid per job.

Any job that's going to take 3-4 hours is dropped like a hot stone by OpenReach's contractors.

They simply cannot make a living by doing 4 hour long jobs. They would manage 2 jobs per day and that would make their job very low paid.

The contractors are literally told to leave the complicated jobs. They are reassigned to OpenReach engineers.

The contractors get a lot of stick. Some of them do deserve it.
Their pay is structured in such a way though that they don't get paid to spend 4 hours doing a complicated installation or to go fault finding at every junction on an FTTC circuit.

Yeah...I didn't blame the guy for not doing mine. It was 16:15 on a Friday afternoon...and I knew it wouldn't be a simple job, but it seems OpenReach didn't bother to do the initial site assessment (as I was told they would).

The issue I now have is OpenReach's failure to sort it out in a "reasonable" timeframe.

I've been in touch with OpenReach's help account on Twitter, and they have put notes on my order about how to escalate. I'm now on hold to TalkTalk to ask them to follow it up, because they're the ones who have go to call OpenReach's Service Management Centre to escalate on my behalf.

Edit: it seems OpenReach have been quick to escalate. I'm now told they are coming on Wednesday 22nd September (in the afternoon 🤷🏻‍♂️).
We'll see how this one goes!

Edited by MilesR (Sat 18-Sep-21 14:45:35)

If TalkTalk gave you a date for the start of service* and they have failed to do so you are entitled to automatic compensation https://www.ofcom.org.uk/phones-telecoms-and-interne... - it may be worth reminding them of this.

* this may not be the same as the engineer appointment date, for a 1-stage install it should be.

In reply to a post by tdw42:

If TalkTalk gave you a date for the start of service* and they have failed to do so you are entitled to automatic compensation https://www.ofcom.org.uk/phones-telecoms-and-interne... - it may be worth reminding them of this.

* this may not be the same as the engineer appointment date, for a 1-stage install it should be.

Thanks, all they provide is the OpenReach installation date...not a service start date 🙁

I've just read the details of it, I think I would be entitled to it.
If they don't install on Weds 22nd (which is the originally agreed installation date), then I think it will be £5.04 a day.
Thanks for bringing it to my attention!

Not completely irrelevant, a PM slot, especially at this time of year, could be cut short. That's a shame, though. Fingers crossed that Openreach turn up on Wednesday (for both of us).

Edited by Grimers (Sat 18-Sep-21 18:51:15)

I hope you do better than me @grimers!
I've just been told that the info I was given on Saturday afternoon was duff.
My appointment is now 7th October 🙁

I raised the issue of compensation, given the initial install date was supposed to be today. Was told that it should be valid for £5 a day until provision of service commences.
At least that covers the additional costs I face with keeping my FTTC connection active for a while longer.

Hope yours is going / goes well!

Oh, no! Sorry to hear that, Miles. Well, as you can see for my signature, all went well. We got Openreach and they bent over backwards to install. I really cannot fault them, they're a brilliant company!

In reply to a post by Grimers:

Oh, no! Sorry to hear that, Miles. Well, as you can see for my signature, all went well. We got Openreach and they bent over backwards to install. I really cannot fault them, they're a brilliant company!

Excellent, pleased to hear yours is working. Enjoy the new found speed 🙂

In reply to a post by Grimers:

Oh, no! Sorry to hear that, Miles. Well, as you can see for my signature, all went well. We got Openreach and they bent over backwards to install. I really cannot fault them, they're a brilliant company!

Finally installed this morning...took the guys just an hour to do.
They were from the Kelly Group, but I have to say they did a decent job of running the cables nicely and tidying up afterwards.

It's so nice to have decent speeds again (500/75) after my year with 36/10...not that anyone else in my house will notice