EchoLife GPON Terminal and Second Router

Hi

My friend has just converted their garage and their current wifi doesn't stretch from the house so they want to extend the network in some way. He has BT Fibre in the house and also an EchoLife GPON Terminal (HG8010H5-20) which I've not really heard of before. It has 2 ports - Ethernet and Optical. The ethernet port is connected to his main router. The Optical port was never in use.
When his garage was being done someone came along and installed an Optical cable from the GPON terminal to his garage where it ends in a standard looking RJ11 wall socket. He was told he could just run a cable from this socket to a second router and that would give him wifi in the garage.

Would this actually work? I know nothing about the GPON terminal or this optical socket. In my world it would have to be the ethernet/data port that is extended into the garage (either via a switch/integrated ethernet cabling or powerline adapters) - can the network be extended via this optical cable or is that used for something else?
I've extended networks before with second routers, disabling DNS and assigning a static IP address so I know what to do there. I just don't know if this optical cable is able to extend the network or if that'll never work?

heathmount

In reply to a post by heathmount:

When his garage was being done someone came along and installed an Optical cable from the GPON terminal to his garage where it ends in a standard looking RJ11 wall socket. He was told he could just run a cable from this socket to a second router and that would give him wifi in the garage.

Are you sure it is an optical cable? You need electronics to convert from fibre to ethernet wire cable. It would be more sensible for it to be an RJ45 socket connected to an 8 wire ethernet cat 5e (or whatever) cable. What is at the other end of the cable?

Hi

All I've got to go on are some photos. The EchoLife box has 2 ports.There's an ethernet port which has a cable linking it directly to the main BT home hub router. Then there's the optica/green port which has never been used. Now from the photos I see a new green cable coming from the optical port on the EchoLIfe box and I'm told this terminates in the garage in a wall socket which accepts an RJ11 connection.

My friend has now used a standard RJ11 cable to connect this scoket in the garage to a secondary router and expects a wifi connection.

I have no idea what is happening internally between the EchoLife Optical Out and the RJ11 socket in the garge. I have no idea if this is standard practise to extend a home network or if this will never work?

Sounds wrong to me.

The optical port is to receive the fibre feed coming in from the external fibre network (from the exchange as it were)

Which sorts of makes sense. But that port on the EchoLife box has apparently been empty for 2 years and clearly there's been no issues. It's only since a new garage was built that someone supposedly connected a new cable from the EchoLife/Optical to a new RJ11 socket in the garage. From what I'm hearing, doesn't sound like that's going to do anything.

In reply to a post by heathmount:

Then there's the optical/green port which has never been used. Now from the photos I see a new green cable coming from the optical port on the EchoLife box

I think you have received incorrect information from your friend, the green connecter is the incoming service from the Openreach network (as another member has stated), without a connection from the Openreach network into this port there would be no broadband. I suspect the ethernet cable in the garage is going to a ethernet port on the router.

Ah ok, There is no ethernet cable in the garage, just an RJ11 connection which, let's be honest, I have no idea where it comes from! Sounds like you've answered my questions though which is that the green/optical connection is incoming rather that outgoing.

Thanks for the responses, think I'll fall back to the standard powerline adapters which should do the trick.

heathmount

It sounds like someone has obtained a ONT from ebay and is trying to use that to extend the WAN to the Garage.

If he has FTTP rather than FTTC he should have another ONT that connects to the OR fibre.

So complete setup as described sounds like.

OR Fibre (FTTP)Yellow - ONT ( OR)- Ethernet to router ( Green) - Ethernet to additional ONT (Green)- Fibre to garage ( Yellow) - RJ11 ??. This will not work.

What he should have is

OR Fibre (FTTP)Yellow - ONT ( OR)- Ethernet to router ( Green) - Ethernet to Garage - 2nd router./ WIfi access point etc.

Post deleted by dect

Edited by deleted (Thu 21-Apr-22 17:19:46)

In reply to a post by kitcat:

It sounds like someone has obtained a ONT from ebay and is trying to use that to extend the WAN to the Garage.

Which couldn't possibly work, because an ONT can only talk to an OLT.

In reply to a post by candlerb:

In reply to a post by kitcat:

It sounds like someone has obtained a ONT from ebay and is trying to use that to extend the WAN to the Garage.

Which couldn't possibly work, because an ONT can only talk to an OLT.

I think kitcat is over thinking it with the suggestion of a second ONT as we know its been there for at least 2 years probably well before the garage conversion.

My friend is 50 miles away so unfortunately I can't verify everything he says. And although I'm reasonably techy literate I'm not up to speed on the newer fibre technology acronyms.

He's had BT fibre professionally installed in his house for 2 years and this included the EchoLife GPON terminal which I assume is the ONT. There's a yellow ethernet cable coming from that to the BT Home Hub which I understand (all internet in the hosue is fine). He says "there never used to be a green cable in the optical port" but this now sounds incorrect as it's the incoming fibre cable - if that wasn't there then there would be no internet in the house right?

The basic question is how does he get wifi extended into his garage. From what I'm hearing the easiest way would be to take an ethernet cable from his main router in the house into a powerline adapter and then in the garage go from the other powerline adapter into a second router and configure that second router accordingly.

Any chance of some photos of the existing router, front and rear with connections?

I suspect your friend actually has an FTTC / VDSL2 copper broadband connection directly into the router. Sometimes confusing referred to as fibre broadband - well it is sort of, but not the part that comes into your home. The unconnected Huawei ONT feels like it’s a bit of a red herring…

The other link to the garage is a bit of a mystery. It’s definitely not an optical connection, as an RJ11 is a copper port (typically for a copper/voice extension). As is an RJ45 (for an Ethernet connection using Cat5e/6/etc data cabling.

In reply to a post by heathmount:

He's had BT fibre professionally installed in his house for 2 years and this included the EchoLife GPON terminal which I assume is the ONT. There's a yellow ethernet cable coming from that to the BT Home Hub which I understand (all internet in the hosue is fine). He says "there never used to be a green cable in the optical port" but this now sounds incorrect as it's the incoming fibre cable - if that wasn't there then there would be no internet in the house right?

Typically the incoming fibre to the Huawei ONT is a white cable, around 3mm in diameter, with a small green coloured rectangular connector about 8mm square on the end that is connected into the Huawei ONT.

Get your friend to double check and report back.

The basic question is how does he get wifi extended into his garage. From what I'm hearing the easiest way would be to take an ethernet cable from his main router in the house into a powerline adapter and then in the garage go from the other powerline adapter into a second router and configure that second router accordingly.

Unless the cable distance is greater than 90 metres, the most reliable connection which would allow a gigabit connection would be using a 4-pair Cat5e/6 copper data cable.

Happy to post some photos, just not sure how! Couldn't see anythig obvious or anything in the FAQ...

Use a third party photo hosting / sharing website and post the links to the photos as needed.

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

Typically the incoming fibre to the Huawei ONT is a white cable, around 3mm in diameter, with a small green coloured rectangular connector about 8mm square on the end that is connected into the Huawei ONT.

The ONT could also be sitting inside an outer housing, which hides the cable and green connector. It will have a hinged door if they want to look inside.

Good point, but odd that somebody has gotten the model ID of the ONT which is only printed on the reverse side of the actual ONT not the larger housings or BBU housing….

Hopefully photos will help to clarify what’s what.

dect

Could be over thinking it. But couldn't think of any other way he could have an ONT with no optical plugged in and still have a service. (I have heard of people trying to use them as optical extenders which never works. ).

Here's the 3 photos he sent me, hopefully they work

https://www.flickr.com/photos/52428889@N03/with/5202...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/52428889@N03/520213486...
https://www.flickr.com/photos/52428889@N03/520203089...

So the ONT is fed by the green ended fibre - as it should be

The output is taken to the router which supplies the connection details via the ethernet cable plugged in next to it.

There must be an existing router plugged in somewhere else on the property making the connection and probably doing the current wifi.

It is the output (LAN) of this router you need to extend to the garage.

Well the ONT is 100% definitely connected to the incoming fibre. Refer to the second photo; the green fibre connector (SC/APC) is clearly visible.

Black cable with yellow connector is the ethernet cable from the ONT to the router.

So at least that is resolved.

Next up - confirming what cabling in place at the garage....

[cross posted with Zarjaz above]

Edited by Pheasant (Fri 22-Apr-22 11:44:50)

"It is the output (LAN) of this router you need to extend to the garage."

This is in line with what I would have expected and the easiest way is probably with a couple of powerline adapters which I can do.

My mate is convinced that the green cable was never there and it has been added as an output from the ONT and terminates in the garage in the RJ11 socket in the photo. From everything I've read here that's just not the case. I'm not going to worry too much about what's been done, like I say I can fix this for him with a couple of powerlines.

thanks for you help everyone

In reply to a post by heathmount:

"It is the output (LAN) of this router you need to extend to the garage."

… I can fix this for him with a couple of powerlines.

thanks for you help everyone

Powerline adaptors have mixed reports, some find them OK, others have many problems.

Just to be clear, the first photo is in the garage, and the others (with the ONT) are in the main house?

The RJ11 socket in the garage will have copper, not fibre, coming out of the back. Most likely it's a phone extension.

If it's two-pair telephone cabling then you really shouldn't use it for data. It may work at 100Mbps, if you wire the two pairs correctly to RJ45 plugs (pins 1+2 on one pair, pins 3+6 on the other pair). But you'd first need to find the other end in the house - and it most definitely isn't the Openreach incoming fibre with the green connector!

Your idea of powerline sounds fine, as long as both buildings are fed from the same consumer unit, and doesn't cost too much to try.

In reply to a post by heathmount:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/52428889@N03/52021864800/

Out of interest what is plugged into the socket on this picture?

"Just to be clear, the first photo is in the garage, and the others (with the ONT) are in the main house?"
Yes

"Out of interest what is plugged into the socket on this picture?"
An RJ11 cable into a second router. There's been no work done on this second router to disable DNS, assign a static IP address etc. However even if this had been done it sounds like it would never work. Sounds like "something" has been run into the garage but not something that will work. I'll be round there this weekend to sort out the powerline method.

Possibly a builder with no idea what they are doing has run a phone extension and said "plug another router in here".

Your best hope is that they used a Cat5e cable to do it.

In reply to a post by jpm:

Your best hope is that they used a Cat5e cable to do it.

Eeeh yeah; sparkies and data cabling is bad enough....but builders. Shudder.

For the OP - If there's enough slack in the cable behind that plate, they could be re-terminated onto RJ45 jacks/sockets. Would need a suitable replacement faceplate to be fitted, but fairly straightforward.

On the other hand if the builder has just plonked into CW1308....give up now and try a pair of powerline adapters or possibly run in a new 4-pair Cat5e/Cat6 cable or two.

My mate is convinced that the green cable was never there and it has been added as an output from the ONT

Best insist your mate stays well away from it all then, most especially that incoming fibre connection. They are reasonable robust, but getting the ends dirty or scratched can cause issues.

An easily avoided stumbling block, is that the router location in the main building, and the external garage, are in different ring mains. Quite possible.

In reply to a post by heathmount:

"Out of interest what is plugged into the socket on this picture?"
An RJ11 cable into a second router

You do not use the RJ11 input for the second router that should be *configured as an WiFi Access Point* .
you use one of the RJ45 sockets for the input from the main router.

* = you can see plenty of internet posts how to re-configure the second router.

In reply to a post by APTMAN:

In reply to a post by heathmount:

"Out of interest what is plugged into the socket on this picture?"
An RJ11 cable into a second router

You do not use the RJ11 input for the second router that should be *configured as an WiFi Access Point* .
you use one of the RJ45 sockets for the input from the main router.

* = you can see plenty of internet posts how to re-configure the second router.

You make a good point but it did cross my mind that whoever put the RJ11 socket in should have explained to the OP's friend where the cable (on the back of the socket) goes too as it currently seems to be a mystery.

Edited by deleted (Sat 23-Apr-22 23:29:07)

In reply to a post by dect:

You make a good point but it did cross my mind that whoever put the RJ11 socket in should have explained to the OP's friend where the cable (on the back of the socket) goes too as it currently seems to be a mystery.

To me eyes it looks like an RJ11 plug in an RJ45 socket. Perhaps easier to see if you magnify the picture.

OP is discounting (for now at least) the existing link:

“Sounds like "something" has been run into the garage but not something that will work. I'll be round there this weekend to sort out the powerline method.”

To be fair he’s right there: without checking what grade of cable has been installed and to where, then it’s fairly useless as a viable data link, irrespective of the jack type on the faceplate.

Here is what I would do..

* remove that Huawei 8010 ONT from its current position.
* install a fibre terminal box in place of the ONT
* [replace blue SC-UPC connectors with green SC-APC equiv.]
* extend incoming SC-APC fibre, with looooong APC/APC fibre patch lead
* connect APC patch lead to newly-sited Huawei ONT, and onwards via ethernet to home network
[or better, keep it all fibre with ONU and OLT SFP sticks in dual-SFP+ PCIe NIC in OpenWRT x86 box]

Cost [excluding x86 router box] less than £50.

Very tidy future-proof full-fibre solution.

https://imgur.com/a/kdDpyw5

Seems quite a lot of messing about to relocate the ONT (and router) when all they only wanted was a network extension to the garage…😎

Not to mention making Openreach unhappy that you've messed with their end of the network.

Probably easier and safer to run some Cat6a