What's missing?

A friend of mine has just moved in to a new flat. It's 6 years old and only has fibre.

Can anyone tell me how fibre works in an MDU? Does each owner have their own ONT or is there some building wide thing. This is all he has (see pic), and it looks like the previous owner has taken something with them?

The green connector just looks like a fibre connector to me.

https://imgur.com/uq68zk2

Edited by zebb_edi (Wed 29-Jun-22 14:30:55)

If it's Openreach, as it is in this case, then yes, every MDU has its own fibre and ONT. (Other providers, like Hyperoptic, may work differently).

The previous owner has stolen the ONT. It should have been left there. You can see the space on the wall where it was

Your friend will need to contact their ISP, explain this and get an engineer visit booked in. The engineer will install a new ONT, and also hopefully clean the end of the fibre using the correct tools.

Brilliant, many thanks for the help. I suspected as much and BT just wanted to send out a homehub. I'll get him to order over the phone.

It will need to be raised to Openreach so someone can come out and re-splice the fibre and supply a new ONT.

Might as well place the order online so you get the cashback etc. and then once the router arrives just raise a fault.

Unless there has been some invisible damage, I don't think it will require resplicing. Just a wipe of the end on a fibre cleaning cassette, and plug into ONT.

In reply to a post by zebb_edi:

Brilliant, many thanks for the help. I suspected as much and BT just wanted to send out a homehub. I'll get him to order over the phone.

BT don't supply ONTs, they only supply the hub/router/wifi box. The ONT is supplied by the network operator and is the equivalent of the "master socket". Getting the ISP to contact Openreach and request a 'repair' to replace is the interesting part. They may want the previous owners details to contact them about paying for the Openreach owned ONT !

I'm looking at the amount of fibre that has been pulled out the splice closure compared to the length of the jacket, I would be surprised if it's not damaged.

In reply to a post by jchamier:

In reply to a post by zebb_edi:

Brilliant, many thanks for the help. I suspected as much and BT just wanted to send out a homehub. I'll get him to order over the phone.

BT don't supply ONTs, they only supply the hub/router/wifi box. The ONT is supplied by the network operator and is the equivalent of the "master socket". Getting the ISP to contact Openreach and request a 'repair' to replace is the interesting part. They may want the previous owners details to contact them about paying for the Openreach owned ONT !

How’s that work? Any previous owner would do a shaggy and say “it wasn’t me”. Cost would fall to the current owner.

Yeah, the Eezee bend cable should have been securely fixed in the CSP. Maybe it was, and Edward Scissorhands just the bejeezus out of it …..

Real annoying, as will require an Openreach visit to fit and register the new ONT. Otherwise it would have just been a matter of plugging in the supplied router, and bingo !

In reply to a post by Buggs8:

There is photographic evidence that the ONT has been stolen - the previous owner would be liable unless they can prove otherwise I would imagine.

The original post makes no mention of photographic proof. Unless someone has a photo of them running out of the flat with it under their arm then there’s no chance. Openreach aren’t the police, and even the police need evidence. Something being there at a certain point isn’t evidence the previous owner took it. Now, if this is a rented property then there’s a much higher chance of it being logged on the inventory, and if it was there upon checking in but gone by check out then the landlord or agent would have a case and could deduct from the bond.

In reply to a post by gary333:

Unless someone has a photo of them running out of the flat with it under their arm

Wasn't me 😎 another job for Inspector Clouseau 🤣

The OR system will know when it was in use - even with no router connected. The records will show when it stopped - if that co-incides with the departure date. Potentially enough proof.

In reply to a post by MHC:

The OR system will know when it was in use - even with no router connected. The records will show when it stopped - if that co-incides with the departure date. Potentially enough proof.

If that’s proof enough then I’d hate to be in your courtroom 😛

It's not worth arguing over. This is new customer to the premise, it's cheaper for OR to send out an engineer to fix the service than to do a whole new installation (dragging cable to CBT, drilling through wall, splicing etc). They'll just do it.

In reply to a post by candlerb:

It's not worth arguing over. This is new customer to the premise, it's cheaper for OR to send out an engineer to fix the service than to do a whole new installation (dragging cable to CBT, drilling through wall, splicing etc). They'll just do it.

Of course it is, thus the point that they’ll never chase a previous “customer” to charge them for it.

Arguing lol, it’s hardly an argument, and if it was you are also entering it with these comments. 😉

I had this problem when I moved into my current house. Someone had taken the ONT.

After a bit of confusion when signing up with the provider telling me to keep looking for the ONT which wasn't here, they eventually booked an Openreach visit.

They will install a new ONT and repair anything that looks suspect without too many questions. I was just asked why I had half an install job at my house 🤣

Edited by FakeJake (Wed 29-Jun-22 19:03:22)

I believe new ONTs have a "leave this in place when you move house" sticker on them.

The latest ONT’s are so small, I suspect the writing on your suggested sticker would be microscopic.

Some of the older installs had them on, back in the four port Huwawei days

This is from one of the Plusnet support videos.

https://i.imgur.com/bqcj7Zr.png

I apologise, ya live, ya learn.

I'm not convinced it will help. People will probably just take the power supply with them when they move.

Yeah. If it’s not nailed down….besides which folk will take the view that it’s much like a modem or router and just take it with them.

It’s just hassle for the next occupier.

In reply to a post by gary333:

reply to post by garry333:

In reply to a post by MHC:

In reply to a post by MHC:
The OR system will know when it was in use - even with no router connected. The records will show when it stopped - if that co-incides with the departure date. Potentially enough proof.

If that’s proof enough then I’d hate to be in your courtroom 😛

It could only be used as proof of powering off. It not any proof when it was removed. These events are very different. Hopefully I would go in to garry333 courtroom.

Yeah BT were originally just going to send a homehub nextday but after calling them were apparently fine sending an engineer to sort it as well. No charge from what I've been told.

I imagine most people see it as something that's plugged in to a wall socket and don't really realise it's not theirs. Probably just think it's part of their 'broadband'.

The premise was rented out before and is now purchased. No idea if it was the landlord or previous tenant who took it.

ps) replying in general rather than to zarjaz specifically.

In reply to a post by amiga_dude:

It could only be used as proof of powering off. It not any proof when it was removed. These events are very different. Hopefully I would go in to garry333 courtroom.

Arguably, even if dying gasp is enabled and logged, it can only be considered proof that the device lost power, not that a person operated the power switch. There could have been a power failure in that property at the time.

The only “proof” would be if someone was caught taking it red-handed. Even then they’d probably say it was a mistake. Ooops!!

Some of the folks that think there’s even the remotest possibility OR are going to pursue a former occupier for a missing ONT (which probably costs around a tenner wholesale) are living in cloud cuckoo land 😀

Yes, only the first two posts in the thread are relevant. The ONT is missing, Openreach will fit a new one and sort out fibre cable. End of story.

Yep. It’s like missing NTE for a leased circuit. Nobody really cares. There’s lots of ex Openreach ADVAs for example that land on fleabay. No use to man or beast, but there you go.

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

Some of the folks that think there’s even the remotest possibility OR are going to pursue a former occupier for a missing ONT (which probably costs around a tenner wholesale) are living in cloud cuckoo land 😀

There I thought I was finally going to make my millions. I was going to go to Channel 5 with "You took ONT, next stop her majesty national hotels for you!"
A griping on series where a very distresed Openreach staff are devastated about the worst crime that happen the removal of ONT.
It will the in depth inverstagion (of course some wiggly line with number filling past with some html code also in mix with showing some E=mc2 for good measure, we then all know high tech then and it very complex) https://youtu.be/msX4oAXpvUE.
Next police rades where no limits to how hard hit these mastermind crimbos https://youtu.be/IFIyQe5QdYI with a least one eposide where police make epic fail ie https://youtu.be/kGSEFrzB7og

😂

Considering some crazies were baying for blood during Covid when someone had a surprise birthday cake presented to them, anything is now on the table for an ONT theft.

Edited by deleted (Thu 30-Jun-22 22:02:14)

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

😂

My first reaction too, first thing I see coming on here for the first time in weeks.

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

Yeah. If it’s not nailed down….besides which folk will take the view that it’s much like a modem or router and just take it with them.

It’s just hassle for the next occupier.

It is a strange thing to take to be honest, but as you said maybe they think it is the same thing as a router. But then unless the router is my own, i would not take it if I move.

If you have ever viewed a recently reprocessed property for sale you will understand that anything not bolted down with security bolts will be gone. It will be up on ebay shortly.

I'm surprised OR haven't yet developed integrated routers with the major providers - I.e. an integrated BT homehub.

Then all the occupier needs to do is connect the green connector and volia - rather than faffing with an ethernet cable.

The ONT portion of the router could then auto provision itself with the OLT - esp if the router came pre-linked.

Would save gear as you could change the provision ID if a householder moves, but also saves OR forking out for an ONT in an empty, un-used property.

A "one-box" solution is not a good compromises for a wholesale network in which the ISP needs/wants the freedom to be able to differentiate their product offering or just simply source their own CPE.

On a single provider Altnet network it probably makes more sense, but the trend I've noticed recently is the move to a 'split' ONT + router solution with a lot of those guys.

Then there's also the 'elf and safety and reliability angle with exposed fibre connectors, left in situ....

Yeah... Could you imagine the amount of faults from people who try to push in the LC connector wrong and either ends up breaking it or getting a load of dust on it?

Connecting an Ethernet cable is far less troublesome than fitting an SC connector (well fitting it well)

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

Connecting an Ethernet cable is far less troublesome than fitting an SC connector (well fitting it well)

As someone who fully put his mucky fingers over an SC connector making it not work, touche

A practical problem is that if the router had to be swapped for any reason, it would require the new serial number re-registering on the OLT. Ditto if the user wanted to use their own router.

In reply to a post by Whitehall11:

I'm surprised OR haven't yet developed integrated routers with the major providers - I.e. an integrated BT homehub.

Then all the occupier needs to do is connect the green connector and volia - rather than faffing with an ethernet cable.

The ONT portion of the router could then auto provision itself with the OLT - esp if the router came pre-linked.

Would save gear as you could change the provision ID if a householder moves, but also saves OR forking out for an ONT in an empty, un-used property.

Nah, not a good idea, some people may want to use their own router, if they did that then there would also have to have a WAN socket on it and a way to disable the router part.

In reply to a post by Whitehall11:

I'm surprised OR haven't yet developed integrated routers with the major providers

👎

Hopefully this never happens. An ONT secured to the wall as the demarc between Openreach and the customer/ISP equipment is the way to go. It also enables testing of the Openreach part of the service and avoids pointless engineer visits for problems that are in the providers network.

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

Yeah. If it’s not nailed down….besides which folk will take the view that it’s much like a modem or router and just take it with them.

It’s just hassle for the next occupier.

It is a strange thing to take to be honest, but as you said maybe they think it is the same thing as a router. But then unless the router is my own, i would not take it if I move.

A friend of mine moved into a house where the previous owner took all the light bulbs with them, OK they owned them, but seemed a bit weird to me.

In reply to a post by burble:

A friend of mine moved into a house where the previous owner took all the light bulbs with them, OK they owned them, but seemed a bit weird to me.

They might have been expensive light bulbs. If I moved I would take mine as they are Philips Hue, but I have a box of incandescent bulbs, so I would stick some of them in