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Standard User mikepaterson
(regular) Mon 30-Dec-13 17:56:06
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Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[link to this post]
 
I have recently moved from TalkTalk to EE, and it has been a bit of a disaster.

Firstly their online signup system glitched and did not include my email address and telephone number so I received no confirmations, then when the switch happened, they lost our telephone number, tried to point the blame firstly at me, then at TalkTalk before realising that they had messed up.

I switched only when EE told me that I would get the same speeds and connection as I was getting on TalkTalk, but frankly that just is not the case.

With TalkTalk I regulaly got from 4.5 - 6M download and .76M upload with latency of between 15ms and 28ms - also with no apparent throttling at any time.

With EE I achieve from 2- 4.3M down and only ever .38M up (it appears to be capped though they deny that this is the case). Latency is around 60 - 90 ms and p2p is massively throttled.

The router needs to be rebooted regularly as the connection seems to hang up and gaming is very difficult.

Their customer support is atrocious, even worse than TalkTalk and they have dismissed my speed issues stating that they are good.

Does anybody know why the service could be so much worse, or at least how to improve the latency?

We were connected over 3 weeks ago so the line training should have been finished by now.

Cheers
Mike
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 30-Dec-13 23:49:46
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: mikepaterson] [link to this post]
 
Post your router stats. Which exchange?

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 20 Meg WBC
Standard User baby_frogmella
(experienced) Tue 31-Dec-13 04:59:50
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: mikepaterson] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by mikepaterson:
Does anybody know why the service could be so much worse, or at least how to improve the latency?


You've gone from an ADSL2+ (up to 24 meg) service to a bog standard ADSL max (up to 8 meg ) service as indicated by your upstream speed of 0.38meg on EE. Why on earth did you move to an inferior service?

TalkTalk Plus LLU ADSL2+ 18383/1020 kbps
Pioneer Kuro 428XD ISF'd
iPhone 5S 16gb
ThinkPad X220


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Standard User mikepaterson
(regular) Tue 31-Dec-13 18:13:59
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
Thanks baby_frogmella. That would explain things!

As to why I switched to an inferior service, that would be because EE lied to me when they told me that i would be able to receive exactly the same speed as I was currently receiving with TalkTalk.

Looks like I am going to have to fight this out with them!
Standard User mikepaterson
(regular) Tue 31-Dec-13 18:29:00
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
Hi XRaySpex,

The exchange is EANBF

The only stats I can find are:

Broadband Type: ADSL
Broadband State: Connected
Internet State: Connected
Time Connected: 05:39:31
Downstream Rate: 5504kbps
Upstream Rate: 448kbps
Cheers
Mike
Standard User baby_frogmella
(experienced) Tue 31-Dec-13 18:32:16
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: mikepaterson] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by mikepaterson:
Thanks baby_frogmella. That would explain things!

As to why I switched to an inferior service, that would be because EE lied to me when they told me that i would be able to receive exactly the same speed as I was currently receiving with TalkTalk.

Looks like I am going to have to fight this out with them!

Never ever treat isp speed estimates as gospel...they'll say anything to get your custom. Even BT sales staff have a habit of telling porkies....they say i can get 15 meg speeds on my non-21CN exchange LOL

Best thing to do is to write to EE UK customer services (forget phone support, you need someone higher up) and politely explain to them that you were mis-sold the service and ask them to let you leave penalty-free.

EDIT: Looking at your exchange you may be able to get fibre (FTTC) might be worth asking EE if they could transfer you to their fibre service if its available at your address.

TalkTalk Plus LLU ADSL2+ 18383/1020 kbps
Pioneer Kuro 428XD ISF'd
iPhone 5S 16gb
ThinkPad X220

Edited by baby_frogmella (Tue 31-Dec-13 18:37:41)

Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 31-Dec-13 19:55:19
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: mikepaterson] [link to this post]
 
No, not that page; not detailed enuf!

The full stats from Advanced Settings / System / ADSL Status please?

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 20 Meg WBC
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 31-Dec-13 19:58:39
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse! *DELETED*


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
Post deleted by XRaySpeX
Standard User mikepaterson
(regular) Tue 31-Dec-13 20:40:16
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
Thank You,

Status
Configured Current
Line Status --- SHOWTIME
Link Type --- Interleaved Path
Operation Mode Automatic G992.1(G.DMT)
Data Rate Information
Stream Type Actual Data Rate
Upstream 448 (Kbps.)
Downstream 5504 (Kbps.)
Defect/Failure Indication
Operation Data Upstream Downstream
Noise Margin 24.0 dB 6.9 dB
Line Attenuation 27.5 dB 45.5 dB
Indicator Name Near End Indicator Far End Indicator
Output Power 12.1 dBm 19.6 dBm
Fast Path FEC Correction NA NA
Interleaved Path FEC Correction 152902 2
Fast Path CRC Error NA NA
Interleaved Path CRC Error 244 2
Loss of Signal Defect 0 0
Fast Path HEC Error STR NA NA
Interleaved Path HEC Error 1246 1
Error Seconds 112 0
Statistics
Received Cells 5273944
Transmitted Cells 12194976
Standard User mikepaterson
(regular) Tue 31-Dec-13 20:43:56
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
Thanks again.

Unfortunately FTTC is not planned for the cabinet I am attached to.

I made sure to specifically state the speeds that I was getting and was repeatedly assured that I would achieve the same speeds.

Their support do not even understand the terms ADSL MAX and ADSL 2+ though they have told me that they will make some changes to my connection.

Cheers
Mike
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 31-Dec-13 20:48:31
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: mikepaterson] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by mikepaterson:
Operation Mode Automatic G992.1(G.DMT)
Downstream 5504 (Kbps.)
Yes, it confirms that EE have put you on old ADSL1 instead of ADSL2+ which you should be on and from which you'd get 6 Meg sync, 5 Meg throughput. You should insist that they upgrade you to what they promised.

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 20 Meg WBC
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 01-Jan-14 00:25:39
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: mikepaterson] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by mikepaterson:
Their support do not even understand the terms ADSL MAX and ADSL 2+
Then they are not qualified to even talk about their own router. A formal letter of complaint is called for.

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 20 Meg WBC
Standard User E7er
(knowledge is power) Wed 01-Jan-14 12:46:33
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: mikepaterson] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by mikepaterson:
Thanks baby_frogmella. That would explain things!

As to why I switched to an inferior service, that would be because EE lied to me when they told me that i would be able to receive exactly the same speed as I was currently receiving with TalkTalk.

Looks like I am going to have to fight this out with them!
Unfortunately broadband it is not always straightforward. crazy Arm yourself with information before contacting EE customer service. wink

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/faq/sections/radsl.htm...

http://speedtest.btwholesale.com/

For straight line distance select Locality http://www.samknows.com/broadband/broadband_checker

Check for your street cabinet number and more http://www.dslchecker.bt.com/pls/adsl/ADSLChecker.Ad...

EE broadband WBC 20 Mbps unlimited. Sync 15282 kbps Downstream, 1276 kbps Upstream. thinkbroadband/SpeedTest
Bright Box ADSL2+ wireless N Router supplied by EE/Orange
BT Business Hub 2Wire 2700HGV v2 ADSL2+ Dual SSID wireless Router
Standard User mikepaterson
(regular) Wed 01-Jan-14 18:05:11
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
I spoke to them again today as thay requested yesterday to have my line re-graded.

The chap today told me my line could not be re-graded as ADSL2+ is not available at my address. I told him that I have been on ADSL2+ for the last 3 years at least and he just repeated that it is not available. He then transferred me to the miss-selling team who are going to look into it,

There is a weird error on the BT/EE system though as when you put my postcode into the ee broadband checker https://broadband.ee.co.uk/home.do it lists my address spelled correctly Springview with an estimate of 4Mbps, but it also lists my address incorrectly Spring View with an estimated speed of 2Mbps

Rather oddly, If I put in my telephone number and postcode, both the correct and incorrect spellings give me an estimate of 3.5 Mbps

Cheers
Mike
Standard User XRaySpeX
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 01-Jan-14 19:16:38
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: mikepaterson] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by mikepaterson:
The chap today told me my line could not be re-graded as ADSL2+ is not available at my address.
Duh! He's right and I was wrong earlier. North Benfleet Exchange does not have 21CN WBC ADSL2+, which is what EE would supply. I forgot to check having 1st checked that Orange used to have LLU there frown.
In reply to a post by mikepaterson:
I told him that I have been on ADSL2+ for the last 3 years at least
Yes, but that's TT LLU ADSL2+ which is not the same thing.

All you can do is claim you were missold by them saying they can match TT's ADSL2+ speeds. As it is you are getting the correct speeds for ADSL Max, which is all EE can offer you there and in excess of their site's estimates for your line.

1999: Freeserve 48K Dial-Up => 2005: Wanadoo 1 Meg BB => 2007: Orange 2 Meg BB => 2008: Orange 8 Meg LLU => 2010: Orange 16 Meg LLU => 2011: Orange 20 Meg WBC
Standard User mikepaterson
(regular) Mon 06-Jan-14 13:21:29
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: XRaySpeX] [link to this post]
 
Thanks,

That is what I have pursued.

I am now in their 21 day mis-selling process, and as I had several calls with them, it should be clear cut though I have no doubt they will try to wiggle out of it.

Skype does not work properly, video streaming is problematic, gaming is very difficult. The service is next to uselless compared with what I had from TalkTalk.
Standard User brandscill
(member) Tue 07-Jan-14 14:51:36
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: mikepaterson] [link to this post]
 
Hopefully they'll do the right thing and allow you to cancel. Then, back to Talk Talk for the speeds.
Standard User mikepaterson
(regular) Tue 07-Jan-14 15:20:31
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: brandscill] [link to this post]
 
I hope so too!

Cheers
Mike
Standard User glossywhite
(member) Wed 22-Jan-14 04:43:34
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: mikepaterson] [link to this post]
 
The sentence "Worse than TalkTalk" is one rarely spoken. I find that rather difficult to believe ^_^
Standard User Mike_Williams
(committed) Wed 22-Jan-14 14:01:09
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: glossywhite] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by glossywhite:
The sentence "Worse than TalkTalk" is one rarely spoken. I find that rather difficult to believe ^_^
"Worse than TalkTalk" is NOT POSSIBLE smile

Regards
Mike Williams

Info :-
Line: Length 250 metres
Modem router: Buffalo wbmr-hp-g300h + LinkSys wg54g both running dd-wrt firmware
IP Profile = Down 19418 kbps Up 1019 kbps

2012: EE WBC 20Mbps Down: 22010 kbps Up: 1019 kbps
2003: Demon ADSLMax 8Mbps Down: 8128 kbps Up: 448 kbps
Standard User mikepaterson
(regular) Sat 01-Feb-14 14:28:42
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: Mike_Williams] [link to this post]
 
EE appear to be far worse from my limited experience. They support team and Fault Managers appear to know far less about broadband than I do (which is not a whole lot, though I have been in IT for 30 years).

They are jokers - shoddy service and shoddy support. I wish I was back with TalkTalk!
Standard User mikepaterson
(regular) Sat 01-Feb-14 14:40:18
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Re: Moved form TalkTalk to EE - everything is worse!


[re: mikepaterson] [link to this post]
 
Well, it appears that none of the calls I had with ee were recorded so they cannot confirm that I was mis-sold. They give me a free month and close the case!!

On calling back, it would appear that their advisers have no idea that moving from a TalkTalk LLU connection could be a retrograde step. The advisor obviously didn't lie, when they told me that I would get the same speeds as I was receiving with Talk Talk because it was the same line, but they obviously were ill-educated and unable therefore to answer correctly.

Looks like I will have to push this through with Ofcom now, but I am having 1 last stab with EE customer service, before doing so.
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