Exchange or internal problem?

I have been suffering from low connection speeds lately.

It all started in the beginning of the week with frequent disconnections. The connection speed stayed the same after the first few disconnections, but then it started to drop. My average connection was 6MB, now it is 135KB. I have of course reported this to my ISP (ADSL24), and they have checked with their supplier (Murphx) and apparently there are no problems there. So my ISP asked me to check my wiring and cabling, microfilter, do a quiet line test, see if the wireless is secure, etc, etc.

Well, for starters, I'm connected with a cable to the router, so no wireless there. As for the wiring of the socket, it has never changed since I first connected. And yes, I did check the BT Master Socket. Only 2 wires are connected, white and blue. The cable from the microfilter to the router is the same, so is the microfilter. But, just to satisfy them, I changed the microfilter and cable on Friday just in case.

No change. Maybe it is the router (Belkin), but as my support contact said it can take up to 3 days for the IP Profile to sync itself, it is best to leave the router on for 3 days. I do have a spare router which I will use come Monday when the 3 days are over, if needed.

Technical data.

I did various BT Speedtests during the week, and checked the router stats.

Tuesday 15th:

Your DSL Connection Rate :1344 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 448 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 1000 Kbps
Download speedachieved during the test was - 882 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 200-1000 Kbps.

Wednesday 16th:

Your DSL Connection Rate :5792 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 448 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 1000 Kbps
Download speedachieved during the test was - 885 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 200-1000 Kbps.

Data Rate Upstream: 448
Data Rate Downstream: 5792
Noise Margin Upstream: 27 dB
Noise Margin Downstream: 9 dB
Attenuation Upstream: 58 dB
Attenuation Downstream: 47 dB

Thursday 17th:

Your DSL Connection Rate :6208 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 448 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 500 Kbps
Download speedachieved during the test was - 458 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 50-500 Kbps.

Data Rate Upstream: 448
Data Rate Downstream: 6208
Noise Margin Upstream: 26 dB
Noise Margin Downstream: 8 dB
Attenuation Upstream: 58 dB
Attenuation Downstream: 47 dB

Same day but in evening:

Download speedachieved during the test was - 92 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 50-135 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Assured Rate IP profile on your line is - 135 Kbps

Data Rate Upstream: 448
Data Rate Downstream:160
Noise Margin Upstream: 16 dB
Noise Margin Downstream: 19dB
Attenuation Upstream: 60 dB
Attenuation Downstream: 45 dB

Friday 18th:

Download speedachieved during the test was - 83 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 50-250 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :6176 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 448 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 135 Kbps

Data Rate Upstream: 448
Data Rate Downstream: 6167
Noise Margin Upstream: 27 dB
Noise Margin Downstream: 6 dB
Attenuation Upstream: 58 dB
Attenuation Downstream: 47 dB

Today:

Download speedachieved during the test was - 100 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 50-250 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :6208 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 448 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 135 Kbps

Data Rate Upstream: 448
Data Rate Downstream: 6208
Noise Margin Upstream: 26 dB
Noise Margin Downstream: 5 dB
Attenuation Upstream: 59 dB
Attenuation Downstream: 47 dB

----------------------------------------------------

Now I'm seriously beginning to suspect that the problem is at my exchange, unless it is possibily the router?

Any help would be greatly appreciated! Three and a half hours for a 200MB download is no fun.

does your router log sync speeds etc ? looks like it is connecting at a wide range of speeds and the lowest ones have led to the 135k profile which will take a while to lift. Do phone calls or similar make it resync ?

I would leave it off for an hour or overnight to make sure the profiling system spots the high sync speed you currently have.

With the line rate changing from next to nothing, to what you'd expect on the line - it does indicate an issue somewhere on the line, or with your equipment.

Try another router first and then see if the pattern is replicated. Also, use a new filter with that new router.

If the problem goes away, you know what the issue is. If not, it is likely to be between the house and exchange and may need an engineer.

Matt

This is interesting.

As soon as I tried to read your replies, the internet light on the router went out and wouldn't come back on. I plugged the spare router in, and the light came on. Went back to the old router, no light. So it seems that the Belkin router was on it's way out? I'm now using the spare router (Thompson Speedtouch TG585 V7) and will keep an eye on things.

So should I disconnect the router overnight for the sync settings?

The stats from the router:

Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 448 / 6,368
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/kB]: 0.00 / 0.00
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.0 / 19.5
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 29.0 / 46.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 25.0 / 9.5

Edited by DoctorJellybean (Sat 19-Jun-10 20:09:19)

You might as well leave the router in over night.

Matt

Also - what is the sync rate on the new router?

Matt

In reply to a post by uno:

Also - what is the sync rate on the new router?

Matt

Link Information

Uptime: 0 days, 0:12:53
DSL Type: G.992.1 annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 448 / 6,368
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/kB]: 0.00 / 0.00
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.0 / 19.5
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 29.0 / 46.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 25.0 / 9.5
Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / TSTC
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 13 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 1 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): 0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 1 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 335
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 1
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 0

That looks about right.

BT may have only notched up the SNR to 9 - so that isn't too bad. It may go down over time.

Matt

Hmm, sounds like the modem side of your primary router's given up the game!

If you're able, you might like to try the Belkin router on a known-good connection, see if it can connect there? If not, it looks like the belkin will need to be sent somewhere. Depending on its warranty that'll be either to the bin or to the manufacturer

My first look at this thread, and my immediate reaction to the first set of stats was that the upstream attenuation was up the creek and to try a different router.

Later on of course this was forced .

the idea behind leaving it off for an hour, or overnight, is to ensure that the new sync rate is clocked by the systems and results in the profile going up.

This is now all very confusing lol.

I took the Belkin to a friends house this morning, and it worked perfectly. So it made me think it is the exchange. I was planning on hooking the Belkin back up tonight, but I did another BT Speedtest a few minutes ago.
------------------------------------------------------
Download speedachieved during the test was - 1958 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 600-7150 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :5760 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 448 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 5500 Kbps
------------------------------------------------------
So now I don't know if it was

a) The exchange
b) The router
c) IP Profile took a long time to adjust due to the frequent disconnects last week.

If it was the latter, what caused the disconnects? Router developing intermittend faults?

So I'm sticking to the Thompson TG585 V7 for the time being. I just wish I could find updated firmware for it. Current version 7.4.2.6

Current router stats:

Uptime: 0 days, 1:33:26
DSL Type: G.992.1 annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 448 / 5,760
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/kB]: 0.00 / 0.00
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.0 / 19.5
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 29.0 / 46.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 25.0 / 12.5
Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / TSTC
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 72 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 57 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): 0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 86 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 765
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 2
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 2

Edited by DoctorJellybean (Mon 21-Jun-10 14:45:44)

Ideally you need to try leaving the router on for 24/48 hours at a time with each router and see if with both routers, you get a very low sync.

If this happens with both routers, from personal experience, I would say it could be a High-Resistance (HR) Fault. What is your phoneline like itself when on the phone? Have you tried the quiet test? Dial 17070.

The Line Quiet Test appears to be fine, no noises.

I'll be leaving the current router on for the next few days before trying the Belkin again. Plan B is to move next door to my exchange and plug the PC straight into their system!

My money is on the Belkin, they can be 'fluffy' at times.

I've heard about their unreliability. However, in saying that, my friend has one now for 4 years and never had a problem with it. Mind you, his PC does have a problem now and again in picking up the wireless signal from the router. He turns his off when he doesn't use it, whereas mine is on virtually 24/7.

Everyone has their own favourite, but any recommended routers?

Everyone has their own favourite, but any recommended routers?

...I'm not the one to ask, too long in the tooth, I've learned to hate most of them over the years.

When push comes to shove, I suppose I'd go for the humble Netgear, and I used to really hate the old models. I had a mate who had months of vague problems, had tried everything, and eventually found it was his Belkin.

I had a mate who had months of vague problems, had tried everything, and eventually found it was his Belkin.

His parents should have taught him not to do that.

Now this is getting ridiculous.

On Monday the 21st it went back to almost normal

Download speedachieved during the test was - 1958 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 600-7150 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :5760 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 448 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 5500 Kbps

The next day it went down again

Download speedachieved during the test was - 639 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 200-1000 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :864 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 448 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 750 Kbps

Router stats:

Uptime: 0 days, 1:16:39
DSL Type: G.992.1 annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 448 / 864
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/kB]: 0.00 / 0.00
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.0 / 17.0
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 29.5 / 46.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 21.0 / 33.0
Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / TSTC
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 72 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 57 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): 0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 102 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 0
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 0
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 0

My ISP said that the SNR changed, which they can't explain. They also requested their supplier to reduce the SNR.

On the Thursday they advised me that the SNR has been reduced, and to do another speedtest.

Download speedachieved during the test was - 5486 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 600-7150 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :6816 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 448 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 6000 Kbps

Router stats:

Uptime: 0 days, 0:04:05
DSL Type: G.992.1 annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 448 / 6,816
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/kB]: 0.00 / 0.00
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 11.5 / 19.5
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 29.5 / 46.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 24.0 / 6.5
Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / TSTC
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 95 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 66 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): 0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 130 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 0
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 20
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 18

Guess what? It all changed again late this afternoon!

Download speedachieved during the test was - 220 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 50-250 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :320 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 448 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 250 Kbps

Router stats:

Uptime: 0 days, 2:23:03
DSL Type: G.992.1 annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 448 / 320
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/kB]: 0.00 / 0.00
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.0 / 15.5
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 29.5 / 47.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 18.0 / 33.0
Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / TSTC
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 145 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 96 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): 0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 387 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 194
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 25
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 0 / 15

Is it still a dodgy router, bearing in mind that it is the spare one I'm using. There has been no disconnects since using this router, which was 5 days ago.

Or is it, as I'm beginning to suspect, at the exchange or between the exchange and my home?

I might just be better off with 2 tins and a piece of string

I can't solve the problem, but I can say that you are mistaken in thinking you have had no disconnections. The connection speed (on the system you are on) never changes unless there has been a disconnection.

What may help would be if you download RouterStats or RouterStats Lite, further down the same page, and run that 24/7.

They graph what your noise margin and connection speed are doing. I find Lite easier to use but it only does downstream. The full version does upstream as well, and has other features.

Seeing as your upstream seems reasonably stable, I suggest the Lite. Set the sampling interval to 5 seconds, set it to save graphs, and set it to log to file as well.

If you switch off at night, don't! Leave the router and computer on for a few days to log everything.

Edited by RobertoS (Fri 25-Jun-10 23:04:02)

RouterStats Lite is running now. It'll be interesting to see what it shows.

Considering that the router has been running non-stop since the 20th, I'm a bit confused as to why the Uptime stat doesn't state days.

From the captured logs:

Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:14:26, Noise Margin= 33.0, Sync Speed= 320
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:14:35, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:14:40, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:14:45, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:14:50, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:14:55, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:15:00, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:15:05, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:15:10, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:15:15, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:15:20, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:15:21, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:15:26, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:15:31, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 02:15:36, Noise Margin= 6.0, Sync Speed= 6944

The Noise Margin then fluctuated between 5.5 and 7.0, but the Sync Speed stayed the same. There were a gap

Sat 26 Jun 2010 03:13:31, Noise Margin= 6.0, Sync Speed= 6944
Sat 26 Jun 2010 03:13:36, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 03:13:41, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 03:13:46, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 03:13:51, Noise Margin= 6.0, Sync Speed= 6944

And another gap, at which point the Sync Speed improved

Sat 26 Jun 2010 03:16:17, Noise Margin= 6.0, Sync Speed= 6944
Sat 26 Jun 2010 03:16:22, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 03:16:27, Noise Margin= , Sync Speed=
Sat 26 Jun 2010 03:16:32, Noise Margin= 6.0, Sync Speed= 7008

The Noise Margin is fluctuating between 5.5 and 7.0 whilst the Sync Speed has remained at 7008. There are no futher gaps.

According to my account page on my ISP website, my last login was 26 Jun 2010 02:15

Complete logs:

https://docs.google.com/uc?id=0B6MrMFVkyAZlN2ViNWNiN...

Edited by DoctorJellybean (Sat 26-Jun-10 10:16:08)

A useful tip about the graphs, particularly when looking at the log like that, is that when the noise margin (and I think connection speed), graph drops it can be the normal colour - indicating a disconnection/reconnection, or red - indicating the router was busy doing its real job and hadn't time to reply to the request for data from RSL.

That link doesn't work by the way.

Updated link

http://www.4shared.com/document/yD6KD9Hs/Logs.html

I also uploaded a graph, where the speed went up

http://i49.tinypic.com/10nyfc0.jpg

and where the speed adjusted from 6944 to the present 7008

http://i45.tinypic.com/2i25r1s.jpg