Don't want either ... but no choice. So ... BT or SKY ?

Just moved to central London, W1J and for some stupid reason the damn exchange is full for Be and certain other providers so I'm unable to move my existing 24MBit service

Looks like the only options are therefore the dreaded BT or *shudder* SKY.

Three questions:

1. Do SKY throttle at all ?
2. Is the SKY service truly 'inlimited'? ... we're talking TBs, not GBs per month.
3. Is there an alternative provider I might have overlooked for Postcode W1J 5JU?


Thanks

A fair few options on that exchange- http://www.samknows.com/broadband/exchange/WEWMAY

Indeed, until you look at the fine print.

Pipex/TalkTalk isn't actually 'Unlimited', nor are the paltry capped offerings from Edge Telecom.

Can ANY ISP other than Be provide a truly unlimited/unthrottled service?

Be resellers, but if Be is full up that won't help.

There are several TalkTalk Business Wholesale, (that's what Opal is now called), resellers. Vivaciti for one has an option to remove the allowance/FUP and traffic management on that.

VERY interesting Roberto, thank you!

http://www.vivaciti.net/product/1/home-internet/25/l... might be ideal:

LLU unlimited is an upto 24mb service with up to 1.2mb upload. This service is fully unlimited with no traffic management or traffic shaping, ideal for people who want a no thrills no fuss service away from BT profiling

Can anyone confirm what the TalkTalk experience is generally like?

Sky Unlimited broadband is unlimited and you don't have to have TV so long as you take the phone line rental from them. Sky is the best and cheapest option.

In reply to a post by lg56xbp:

VERY interesting Roberto, thank you!

http://www.vivaciti.net/product/1/home-internet/25/l... might be ideal:

LLU unlimited is an upto 24mb service with up to 1.2mb upload. This service is fully unlimited with no traffic management or traffic shaping, ideal for people who want a no thrills no fuss service away from BT profiling

I think that is a C & W based service. Not the one I was thinking of. It may be OK, but I was meaning this one.

Expensive, but the few people I have seen posting here that are on it are happy.

I suggest you talk to vivaciti about the difference in real life.

Edited by RobertoS (Wed 28-Dec-11 23:32:00)

Thanks again. 100GB is nowhere near suitable for my needs, so that's one option I have to rule out.

I'm guessing the C&W based service is inferior ... ?


I'm not sure which ISP the previous occupant used, but my connected BeBox reports the following:

Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 6.5 / 15.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 6.0 / 12.0

Does that look promising?

Edited by deleted (Wed 28-Dec-11 23:56:42)

In reply to a post by lg56xbp:

Thanks again. 100GB is nowhere near suitable for my needs, so that's one option I have to rule out.

I'm guessing the C&W based service is inferior ... ?


I'm not sure which ISP the previous occupant used, but my connected BeBox reports the following:

Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 6.5 / 15.0
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 6.0 / 12.0

Does that look promising?

I am on a c&w service with ADSL24, speed wise it is not great, but that is because I got a long cable between me and the exchange. But it is unlimited and no traffic management and also no profiling or line management system.
a mate of mine who lives a bit closer to the exchange than me gets 16 megabits on a c&w network

I am happy with the service, no major problems for over 12 months and it is away from Talk Talk.

Sky network is not too bad, the main problem is like Talk Talk it is fully unbundled, so you have to move your phone over tot hem as well, something which is not required for Cable and wireless.

You didn't get as far as the last paragraph then?

A file share bolt on is also available for this package removing the traffic shaping and rendering this package fully unlimited for an additional £20.40.

I think it is perhaps their best package. I haven't seen many posts recently by customers using the C & W based one, but it used to be well-reported.

As for your stats, 20-24Mbps connection depending on whether or not your chosen ISP caps it at 20Mbps.

Let us know what you decide, and how it goes.

zyborg47,

Very interesting to read, thank you!


Roberto,

My apologies; I did indeed overlook that paragraph. That said, the additional cost makes TalkTalk unlimited double the price of the C&W offering.

Can it really be so much better?

I prefer sky!

In reply to a post by lg56xbp:

Can it really be so much better?

That's why I suggest you discuss the real word differences with them.

If you aren't in a hurry then wait till next week. The boss comes here but I think he is on hol till then. I don't think he would bull-[censored] you, but you never know with staff.

There's a chance that users of both will see the thread once everyone is over the New Year period.

You've also got to decide who to put the line rental with.

BT line is ready and waiting for the right service.

Still can't believe that in 2012 neither BT Infinity nor Virgin nor Be are available smack bang in the middle of London

I have recently gone to Sky on a fully unbundled network and they are truly unlimited. In my exchange I have doubled my download speed and tripled my upload speed from BT's service. I have also found it more reliable and the sky engineers are extremely helpful in making sure everything is right. It is also a damn sight less per month than BT. There are 3 people using computers all the time - 2 for gaming and one for you tube, and I also have Sky Anytime service which downloads films over the net with absolutely no problems at all.

Definitely one for sky

You order it. The router comes

Plug it in, forget about it

Works fine everyday. Never ever needs a reboot

Never throttling, never peak time slowdowns

Torrents go full wack

Overall absolutely outstanding for the price

No "shudder" involved. You'll be so surprised with it

Of course it's a BT line so distance to exchange affects speed

Problem with Sky is the full unbundling. The OP states the BT line is ready - that may well mean they are in a 12 or 18 month contract with BT which could be expensive to buy out in order to move it to Sky.

Maybe the OP can confirm the contract on the landline with BT and whether they are locked in? If they are Sky is a definite no-no.

I'm not locked in as I could just pay off the BT contract and migrate to another provider.

SKY per se is not the issue; I simply have no desire to contribute to the Murdoch empire in any way whatsoever.

I am with C&W and cant fault them
They do set your SNR to 9, but i just put it back to 6 with DMT and have better speeds than with BT.
Also the speeds have been great every hour of the day and i get to keep my phone line with whoever i want. and as far as i know if am not happy then i just pay £20 to get out my 12 month contract.
Best option ever in my own opinion

In reply to a post by lg56xbp:

I'm not locked in as I could just pay off the BT contract and migrate to another provider.

SKY per se is not the issue; I simply have no desire to contribute to the Murdoch empire in any way whatsoever.

OK, so contract not an issue. My biggest gripe with Sky is the full unbundling they now require and I would not sign up with them on that basis (I like to have the option to easily move away from a company when I wish and not faff about with full LLU problems).

However, your other reason for staying away from Sky seems the clincher (Murdoch and all that).

Saying that Sky broadband itself is very good but if FTTC comes my way next year I will be off like a shot.

I'm waiting for sky's fibre

I'm quite happy with them & won't be moving.

I still suggest it however I can understand their reasons for going elsewhere

C&W is very good too. Xilo etc aren't bad

When I can get fibre and sky have a product it may not be such a jump for me to take phone to them - but at the moment I want the easy ability to move so that if something better for fibre comes along I do not have too much issue moving (only just been added to the fibre list and date is currently just 2012 so could be another 12 months or more yet - but if I was being an optimist it could be June or July next year, shame I'm a realist then).

It gets worse:

It appears that the exchange to which you are connected (Mayfair) has a "BT lockdown" at present which is preventing any new LLU connections being provided due to a major capacity problem. They have not given any ETA on this but say it has been like this for over 3 weeks and it's still full.

Guess I'm really stuffed now ...

Oops, wasn't logged in before:


It gets worse:

It appears that the exchange to which you are connected (Mayfair) has a "BT lockdown" at present which is preventing any new LLU connections being provided due to a major capacity problem. They have not given any ETA on this but say it has been like this for over 3 weeks and it's still full.

Guess I'm really stuffed now ...

Depending how much you are willing to pay, which can be quite low if you can schedule some heavy downloads to 2am-6am where you get 1GB per £3.90, have a look at AAISP, this page. The overnight 1GB rate is on the page you reach by clicking the How it works link there.

When using the estimator, you select BT 21CN for now. It's a monthly contract so you are not tied in, and their reputation is superb. See this comparison.

They are also Be resellers, so you could stay there once LLU is available on that exchange.

Thanks Roberto,

I'm usually into the TBs per month


Is there any way I could find out which provider is actually connected on my line right now ... ? It's synched as follows:

DSL Type: G.992.5 annex A
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 1,183 / 12,359
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/kB]: 0.00 / 0.00

If you are getting an IP address on the WAN side of the router then you can do a RIPE lookup to see who owns it. However, if it requires any form of user ID authentication for the ISP then you probably won't be getting the IP address.

Try using bt_test_user@startup_domain as a log in with no password, if it gives an IP address it'll be a BT Wholesale based product, if so,
try [email protected] again, no password. If this works you'll know......

Bah .. it's a Be Thomson TG585 v7 with Be's own 8.2.7.7. firmware.

Offers either a Static IP or Bridge mode only.

Any way I can change the user.ini and/or firmware to something generic?

Flashed down to a generic firmware, but although it's now looking for a dynamic IP address I'm getting:

DSL Connection

View more...

Uptime: 0 days, 0:06:17
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 1,191 / 12,348
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/kB]: 0.00 / 0.00
Internet Connection Error
Dynamic_IP

View more...

Link Status: Contacting DHCP server...
Type: ETHoA

Any ideas folks?

if you have moved are you no an eabled NGA exchange and this might help/ hinder your decisioning

You could wait this one out & get a 1 month rolling contract for the moment?

Just to add my 2p, I was on the c&w network for a year or so. In my experience it was the same performance as the Be*\Sky llu networks are quoted as having; unlimited usage and fast performance with no throttling.

So if/when this capacity issue at the exchange is resolved then I would suggest you strongly consider c&w.

... Of course, be might have capacity on their dslam at that exchange but be unable to connect you on account of these tie pair capacity issues. In light of these, how easy is it for you to shift your downloading to the wee small hours? There are many providers offering a limit on usage in the waking hours but that have an unlimited overnight period. They normally have a 1 month contract too, so you'll be able to move on easily when the capacity issues ease sufficiently.

Hi,
The CW package is OK, no real problems with it although we do see some issues with compatibility between some routers and the exchange.
The bolt on for the package you have looked at does make it a little more expensive but does remove every restriction and places the data on a higher priority and makes it completely unrestricted with no FUP at all. It is also a monthly rolling contract so if and when the exchange gets opened up then it will be easy to either move to another package with us (we will be providing services over BEWholesale shortly, all our current test connections are showing very good results)
Also you can keep your line rental where it is so you would not have the issue with having to pay off your BT contract.

Well, it finally appears to have worked out.

I ordered the LLU Unlimited C&W service from Vivaciti and it's due to be activated on Friday 6th January.

Thanks everyone for the advice and guidance and thanks Vivaciti for the super fast service!

Let us know how things go , and good luck.

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

Depending how much you are willing to pay, which can be quite low if you can schedule some heavy downloads to 2am-6am where you get 1GB per £3.90

Obviously a bit late now but for others reading the thread, think this should have read 1TB per £3.90.

OOps! Damn!

That is what I meant. As in "Instead of the normal off peak tariff, between 2am and 6am usage is metered at 1000GB/unit."

Pity, as the poster uses several TB per month. I doubt if he followed the link within the link though - why should he when I had said 1GB .