Previously and separately I had contacted 24Talk.They have just come back to me again. This is a summary of the exchanges.

20/12/12 I reported low TB speedtest results for the last month.

27/12/12 No response yet. I reported more low TB speedtest results.

07/01/13 No response yet. I chased.

08/01/13 Response: "Thank you for your email our engineers believe they have resolved this issue. Please can you reboot your router and pc and then once they are logged back on to the internet run 5 speed tests using www.speedtest.btwholesale.com."

08/01/13 I gave BT results 1.49Mbps, 1.32, 1.19, 1.38, 1.19 and TB 0.4. I said "It still feels slow. Watching a 2 minute video clip on BBC news site, it stopped to reload every 14 seconds."

These different speedtest results prompted me to start the current thread here - see very first post.

10/01/13 24Talk responded
Our carrier has asked for the following checks to be completed as they can find no fault:
1. Check the speed after disabling Firewall or Antivirus if any, installed on the system.
2. Test at main BT socket, remove extension cables if any, swap filters and check the entire setup.
3. Optimize browser, delete cookies, Temporary Internet file, and scan with anti-virus for virus and spyware removal.
And also check speed at http://www.speedtester.bt.com at three different times and get back to us with the details.
Note:--> According to BT Wholesale, your phone line should be able to support a 1Mbps or greater ADSL connection"
The speed tests you have already returned are on or near 1Mbps.
Please let us know the results within 72 hours to avoid the ticket being closed by our carrier.

10/01/13 I replied:
1. Sorry, I don't know how to disable Firewall and antivirus.
2. Difficult given location of pc, router and master socket. I will try to do this Friday.
3. I already do this frequently.
http://www.speedtester.bt.com results:
08/01/13 2000 = 1.3 Mbps
09/01/13 1830 = 0.49
10/01/13 1030 = 1.48
10/01/13 2050 = 1.05
Right now, 2115, and every evening, a 2 minute video clip on BBC news website stops to reload every 15 seconds. 1Mbps should be better than this? This is what I'm experiencing, in practice, every day.

I will dismantle my system Friday evening and test performance directly via the BT master socket - unless you guys advise me otherwise.

MHC has explained about the poor wiring. There should be only one master, but the Openreach engineers who post here don't get too upset if there are two. I imagine if any of them see your description they will not be impressed .

As MHC says, the actual cabling used is just as important.

Re real performance increases, do you remember about IP Profiles, see the link in this earlier post of mine. That explains that a real speed increase could take a few days, and the table there gives you an idea of how big the increase could be.

Re the Quiet line test, whilst audible noise doesn't affect broadband signals, if it is present there is very often broadband frequency noise as well. Sky boxes, even new ones (though the older ones were much worse), can emit broadband and audible noise, as can anything - such as a DECT phone with a faulty power supply. (The bulky power plug).

This is why I asked you to add items back one at a time and check the stats after each. I hope you checked all the stats, not just the connection speed, as that would not change. The noise margin was the key thing when doing that.

In reply to a post by veryslow:

I will dismantle my system Friday evening and test performance directly via the BT master socket - unless you guys advise me otherwise.

I'm not sure it's worth it, but probably best to do what they say. Just so you can say you've done that. Given the fairly useless responses from them you just posted, (my post above was waiting to go for half an hour as a friend rang, so I hadn't seen this one), mainly stock and occcasionally wrong responses from a script, plus the blatant cop-out 1Mbps estimate quote, I'd be thinking about leaving on principle, never mind practicality.

On the other hand, all might now be a bit better in a few days. So might become irrelevant.

I forget, have we asked how much you are paying for phone and broadband, and what usage allowance you have?

Edited by RobertoS (Thu 10-Jan-13 22:20:05)

if you don't retrain the modem you won't see the benefit of wiring changes - frequencies that could not be used initially that become available can't be used without a retrain and the noise margin only picks up frequencies that are in use.

May I ask, out of ignorance again, what causes the concern?

Each master socket provides an AC signal path from t3 of attached wiring or plugged in equipment onto t2, via its capacitor. So having multiple masters provides a set of antennae to pick up interference like AM radio and feed it into your wiring.

Having wiring that is in a T configuration with the modem on a branch is less than optimal, allows reflections or signal loss to the unused (for ADSL) parts. Google for "bridge tap" which describes what this does when it occurs in the telephone network (usually US) - it degrades ADSL performance.

So I would re-state that the best solution for any line, especially a marginal one, is to terminate the incoming line at a socket that feeds the modem and anything else is connected via a filter to that socket. In this way no unnecessary wiring is exposed to the ADSL signal or vice versa.

Answers to some of the questions posed earlier:

Yarwell said "I wasn't clear if you removed the excess master sockets and wiring or just took the wire off T3 ?" - I just took the wire off T3.

MHC asked "Dare we ask for the colours of the wire and which ones are connected to which terminals!"
T2 = white/blue
T5 = blue/white
Not connected:
orange
white/orange
green/white
white/green
brown/white
white/brown

RobertS, on the Sky boxes, I didn't understand how/where to do the quite line test "Do a quiet line test now. 17070, option 2" - is this via the sky box menu?

RobertoS said "Re real performance increases, do you remember about IP Profiles, see the link in this earlier post of mine. That explains that a real speed increase could take a few days, and the table there gives you an idea of how big the increase could be." - I will be patient!

RobertoS said "This is why I asked you to add items back one at a time and check the stats after each. I hope you checked all the stats, not just the connection speed, as that would not change. The noise margin was the key thing when doing that." - Yes, I did. Line attenuation and noise margin were each the same after every reconnection.

RobertoS asked "I forget, have we asked how much you are paying for phone and broadband, and what usage allowance you have?"
Last year I was paying monthly (all incl vat)
Line rental = £7.30
Broadband = £13.00
10GB limit
Prices have just increased but it's not completely clear from latest bill what the new charges are.
I also have calls with 24Talk.
In November I agreed a further 18 month commitment.


Yarwell said "if you don't retrain the modem you won't see the benefit of wiring changes" - is that the same as "reboot"?

RobertS, on the Sky boxes, I didn't understand how/where to do the quite line test "Do a quiet line test now. 17070, option 2" - is this via the sky box menu?

No, your phone.

Rebooting the router is one way to retrain the modem on the line, you may also have options on the graphical interface to it.

In reply to a post by yarwell:

if you don't retrain the modem you won't see the benefit of wiring changes - frequencies that could not be used initially that become available can't be used without a retrain and the noise margin only picks up frequencies that are in use.

Errrm - yes. But if the modem is connected and noisy items are added, particularly Sky boxes, noise margin is likely to fall. No retrain necessary in that scenario, which is what the OP was doing.

Well at least the wiring might be OK!

The right twisted pair has been used - although it should be Blue/Wh on 2 and Wh/Blue on 5 but that will not matter in this context.

Well, I did as 24Talk requested. Results at 2010 before moving anything:
ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 2016 kbps 448 kbps
Line Attenuation 63.5 db 31.5 db
Noise Margin 9.9 db 10.0 db

TB = 0.61
BT = 1.33
2 min video = reload every 15 secs

Dismantle system, move downstairs, plug router into BT master socket. At 2030:
ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 1984 kbps 448 kbps
Line Attenuation 63.5 db 31.5 db
Noise Margin 9.6 db 10.0 db

TB = 0.16
BT = 0.73
2 min video = reload every 10 secs