Managing a Fibre install (can't be at location)

Hi,

I have general installation questions; some thinking out loud to follow.....

I'm planning to upgrade an existing ADSL connection to FTTC but due to installation timeframe I likely won't be available at location when installation is done. Would have preferred to have been there to hook up / test equipment which depends on router config, port forwarding etc.

Anyone have recommendations on a particular ISP / router combination which would lend itself to having non technical family just plug the other equipment into the router and manage it remotely after the modem installation?

e.g. If I have a static IP on my existing provider, could I potentially keep that along with current login credentials username/password - then preconfigure a router ahead of time for remote management, have it plugged into the modem when the Openreach Engineer does the install?

Or if not, get the new Static IP and creds ahead of the installation and preconfigure? I was going to do that before leaving the property and have the router ready to go. I'd be dependent on current ISP facilitating the above and the chosen router being remotely manageable etc (standard feature I assume?)

Another thought was to migrate to Sky Fibre, mainly for price / service bundling reasons, unlimited time of day usage etc. They post out Sky hub ahead of Openreach visit and you plug n play after modem install? (is it preconfigured?) However the IP address is not static on their service as I understand so it seems someone would have to get on there and alter the configuration, add a dynamic DNS service (if the Sky hub supports this config), set up remote management to allow me in (does SR 101 support or allow this?)

Hopefully the above gives a sense of what I'm trying to do; any advice or gotchas for this type of scenario very appreciated - thanks.

Some ISPs use TR-069 (not TR-101) to remote configure a router - Plusnet can provide this sort of setup with one of their routers. Others use standard credentials in all routers, and rely on data about the circuit to validate the account - I believe BT Infinity is configured this way.

Really, you can choose any ISP you like, so long as you're prepared either to change the router (in which case you pre-configure the new router) or have an existing router that you can reconfigure before you leave the location (in which case there will be an outage until FTTC is installed and working). Most ISPs offer an inexpensive router which will do as a stop-gap until you can configure your preferred router - it can then go in the drawer as a spare in case your preferred router fails.

I'd discuss the situation with your preferred ISP.


At install time, you won't get the chance to mess around testing a great deal. My experience was that the engineer wanted me to establish a PPPoE session and browse to a web site. Once he'd seen that, he was heading for the door. Unless a managed install is ordered (I believe BT Retail are the only ISP who order these), I believe the engineer is within his rights to leave once the DSL light is on solid on the BT Openreach modem.

Hi

Im guessing there will be someone there when they do the install because bt op need to install there modem no matter what isp you have.

If you use sky you would get there new sky hub but sky, bt, plus net talktalk all have there own router they send you and you connect it to the bt op modem using a cat5e cable so you could always plug it in after the install as bt op only plug the bt home hub in as far as i know

maybe someone else on here could tell you if there are any fibre routers on the market you could buy

Thanks David_W for the quick help,

I have ADSL router / modem combo currently which is not fibre compatible - so I was thinking to preconfigure another one and leave it there ahead of install.

If I understand correctly, it seems Plusnet could facilitate exactly what I need here. I'm vaguely aware of TR-069 - would the blank modem effectively "call home" for configuration on first connect? Any idea how remote management would be turned over to me afterwards - and would the ISP retain access after that or its just for their initial provisioning?

Thanks again. Good advice to discuss directly with the ISP.

Plusnet have a FAQ on "Easy Setup", which is their implementation of TR-069. Essentially, the router defaults to TR-069 at hard reset. Once it's got the login credentials via TR-069, which can take a few minutes, you can log in to the router's interface and, if you wish, disable TR-069.


I don't use Plusnet myself - the FTTC connection here is on Zen and our router is a rack mounted server - but I have recommended them to others who can't justify the premium price of Zen and who have found their service to be good. There's an active Plusnet forum here - it sounds like their new Fibre Unlimited product may be worth a look. I believe Static IP is available for a one-off £5 charge if that is useful to you.

Thanks fender1105, yes there will be people there to allow the install etc but the extent of their help would be pretty much limited to plugging in a cable and even that might cause issues

Thanks! I'm definitely going to check PlusNet out, sounds ideal for my circumstances.

When you say, login in via the router's interface, I'm assuming PlusNet would allow me remote access to that (having say configured via TR-069 the remote management feature using static IP / port we agreed on up front)

Hopefully a Plusnet user will come along to answer your questions about the detail of their TR-069 deployment - though I suggest you ask Plusnet directly for confirmation of how to achieve what you want.

If you're considering Plusnet, you need to think whether you wish to move your phone line to Plusnet for a discount. I believe Plusnet's fibre products have an 18 month minimum term, though as BT Openreach set a 12 month minimum term for the FTTC, you won't find any ISP offering less than a 12 month minimum term. Zen offer 12 months minimum term if you pay the install charge, or 24 months minimum term with free installation and router.

Plusnet is by and large a consumer operation that relies on repitition to keep prices low, so a custom TR-069 configuration is unlikely to happen unless you want to pay for test time and deployment time, i.e. a day or two pay + profit for a person. Harsh but most likely answer.

The real question is really what actually needs to configured, i.e. the standard configuration from the big providers gives the customer internet access without much fiddling at all. Why do you need to the ability to fiddle?

The provider supplied routers support port forwarding, and if it is just remote configuration of that, then get the people to install Teamviewer on a PC, and they ring you up once Internet access is working, and give you access codes you connect in and viola you are in control of a PC on their LAN and can configure the router. Other PC remote control options are available too, teamviewer is nice as you don't need to know the IP address of the machine so works nice on dynamic IP solutions and behind NAT

In reply to a post by okanee:

e.g. If I have a static IP on my existing provider, could I potentially keep that along with current login credentials username/password - then preconfigure a router ahead of time for remote management, have it plugged into the modem when the Openreach Engineer does the install?

You cannot transfer static IP addresses between providers.

More importantly, does the target installation require a static IP address for normal running?

In reply to a post by okanee:

Thanks! I'm definitely going to check PlusNet out, sounds ideal for my circumstances.

When you say, login in via the router's interface, I'm assuming PlusNet would allow me remote access to that (having say configured via TR-069 the remote management feature using static IP / port we agreed on up front)

Afternoon,

Our router does permit remote access but only if it's explicitly enabled (which it isn't in the firmware we ship). We offer a static IP on our Unlimited products for a one-off charge of £5.

Our router (a Technicolor 582n) will pre-populate itself with a customer's login credentials shortly after it's plugged in and connected to the Openreach VDSL modem. Once this has happened it is possible to tinker with the router config via our ACS but this isn't something front-line staff are able to do.

So, we could meet your requirements but it is far from a standard procedure and is unlikely to be as seamless as you're hoping for:

1. Account is activated morning of the install
2. Only now can a static IP be activated via our website
3. Openreach engineer arrives, installs service and PPPoE router is connected to the modem
2. TR-069 does it's thing and connects to the Plusnet network (can now access the Internet)

Now comes the tricky bit You'd then need to either:

Talk the end user through the steps required to access the router GUI and enable remote access. It's fairly straight forward but may overwhelm somebody who's not very confident.

Or:

Get somebody here to enable remote access using the ACS and provide you with the username/password and the port it's running across.

I can probably arrange the latter however it depends on my availability on the day of the install. It's unlikely I'd be able to sort it whilst the engineer was still on site.

Rgds,

No need for it to be the same static IP but just preferred to have any static IP.

Been reading the issues some users have had with the Technicolor TG582n (which I believe is my only TR-69 option). Sounds like the wireless performance could be an issue.....have you any experience of it?

My initial idea was to take your recommendation of the Buffalo air station router. If I go with this I will have to forget the TR-69 route and pre-configure the Buffalo to have ready when modem install is done.

Any idea if PlusNet might provide me a router config file to upload and tweak etc after the order is placed and well before Openreach install?

How will the ISP provide a config for a router they don't supply

All you need is the plusnet username and password for the PPPoE session that you use for the Internet connection on the router.

One of the few drawbacks with my Buffalo is that I couldn't get a manual setup to work. The WAN setup wizard, (I abhor wizards), works flawlessly. Detail configuration changes are easy once you find your way round the submenus.

The Plusnet router wireless is poor.

Re your managing the install, doesn't Bob Pullen's post appeal?

Edit - though re-reading your post, if you configure the bits you want, send it to the site, then let the user run the setup wizard, you don't need the Plusnet router connected at all. Though wise to have it there as a spare and a guaranteed connection if anything goes wrong with the Buffalo.

The cable plugs and ports are mostly colour-coded, which helps.

Edited by RobertoS (Tue 22-Jan-13 23:31:26)

In reply to a post by bpullen:

In reply to a post by okanee:

Thanks! I'm definitely going to check PlusNet out, sounds ideal for my circumstances.

When you say, login in via the router's interface, I'm assuming PlusNet would allow me remote access to that (having say configured via TR-069 the remote management feature using static IP / port we agreed on up front)

Afternoon,

Our router does permit remote access but only if it's explicitly enabled (which it isn't in the firmware we ship). We offer a static IP on our Unlimited products for a one-off charge of £5.

Our router (a Technicolor 582n) will pre-populate itself with a customer's login credentials shortly after it's plugged in and connected to the Openreach VDSL modem. Once this has happened it is possible to tinker with the router config via our ACS but this isn't something front-line staff are able to do.

So, we could meet your requirements but it is far from a standard procedure and is unlikely to be as seamless as you're hoping for:

1. Account is activated morning of the install
2. Only now can a static IP be activated via our website
3. Openreach engineer arrives, installs service and PPPoE router is connected to the modem
2. TR-069 does it's thing and connects to the Plusnet network (can now access the Internet)

Now comes the tricky bit You'd then need to either:

Talk the end user through the steps required to access the router GUI and enable remote access. It's fairly straight forward but may overwhelm somebody who's not very confident.

Or:

Get somebody here to enable remote access using the ACS and provide you with the username/password and the port it's running across.

I can probably arrange the latter however it depends on my availability on the day of the install. It's unlikely I'd be able to sort it whilst the engineer was still on site.


Thanks Bob - I had completely missed your Post....just noticed it now.

That's more or less how I was understanding the steps to be taken.

One idea Mr. Saffron had suggested was to use TeamViewer or LogMeIn type access once a LAN machine is able to connect....I've used LogMeIn quite a bit without any issue.

If I were to go with another router and pre-configure etc - rather than the shipped PlusNet TR-69 option, could I get the required parameters sent out after ordering ahead of modem install? I notice about you said "Account is activated morning of the install" - but could the credentials be made available to me before that for pre-config? How soon after order confirmation could these be available?

Thanks again for your help.

Rgds,

Doh, realised what I had written couple mins after posted

Thanks - that's a good idea. Definitely worth a try and as you say have the PlusNet as a failsafe.

Did miss Bob's Post at first - just read.

Perhaps the PN router is ok for me as I'm more concerned about the general connection / speed to one node which will in fact be cabled to the router, rather than the overall wireless range / performance.

In reply to a post by okanee:

Definitely worth a try and as you say have the PlusNet as a failsafe.

I was suggesting similar - get things going using the PlusNet router, then change to your own router later on if you wish.

Thanks. Just weighing my options now before ordering.

How quick do you think PlusNet would have my PPPoE username/password available after order?

I want to have the contingency of a pre-configured alternative router ready to go and get someone to connect it as a preferred first option; should it not work then fall back to the PlusNet supplied router for auto config (TR-69).

In reply to a post by okanee:

How quick do you think PlusNet would have my PPPoE username/password available after order?

Immediately because you're asked for a username/password during the signup journey.

The PPPoE username is in the format <username>@plusdsl.net and the password is identical to the one you specify during signup.

Edit: added the following because your forum profile is configured not to accept private messages so I can't reply to the one you sent me (hope you don't mind) ...

Before I go ahead and place and order, just wanted to validate what might be the steps here if I go ahead and order. By my understanding following the help on the forums, it would be the following:

1. Place the order and take the option of included TR-69 manageable wireless router model.
2. You guys record the shipped unit serial number / MAC etc to recognize the incoming device on TR-69 session
3. Wireless router connected to installed Openreach modem; my existing nodes connected to wireless router, default LAN IP values assigned from PlusNet wireless router etc.
4. I have some TeamViewer or LogMeIn type service on the router connected PC which can be located on net by corresponding client to allow remote login for purposes of reconfiguring the wireless router or enabling the remote management feature.

That should work fine assuming LogMeIn doesn't require any ports opening on the router (I've no first hand experience of using it).

Might it be possible to configure the router with my preferred LAN IP subnet e.g. 192.168.1.x/255.255.255.0. I have another non PC box using this scheme and trying to change its address could be problematic remotely.

The LAN IP of the router is 192.168.1.254 and by default it will assign local devices a DHCP address in the range 192.168.1.64-192.168.1.253.

Hope that helps.

Rgds,

Edited by deleted (Wed 23-Jan-13 10:19:42)

Thanks for your quick reply Bob, appreciate it.

Will the router UI be some default login/password at first? Just wondering how I can get the login for that after the connections is established etc.

A credit card type thing comes with the router, giving the login and password for the GUI. Case sensitive in case you have it given to you over the phone from the site.

Edited by RobertoS (Wed 23-Jan-13 12:09:49)

In reply to a post by okanee:

Thanks for your quick reply Bob, appreciate it.

Will the router UI be some default login/password at first? Just wondering how I can get the login for that after the connections is established etc.

The username is admin and the password is the serial number of the router (on a sticker on the underside of the device).

Rgds,

Bob - I'm scheduled for Fibre installation tomorrow between 1-6 PM.

Will the account be auto activated on the install date e.g. would it be active now after midbnight on the Feb 4?

Or is some manual intervention required for that account activation?

I'm just wondering when I can add the Static IP - and how soon after adding will that be live? Thanks.