Phone and broadband contract question

I just had my phone line activated full llu with Sky and leaving out details i wanna migrate away before my cooling off period runs out asap. How do i go about this i want no to minimal down time. Can i just order a package from a new provider within cooling off period or do i have to contact Sky first?

You should be able to contact another provider to get the ball rolling but I think you would also need to inform Sky you are moving within the calling off period as otherwise it may be too late.

I talked to BT via there online chat and the guy i talked to seemed to think i would need to cancel Sky in this situation and then contact the new ISP and that i would obviously then get downtime. Is that correct because i will do that if needed but it will be annoying.

Migration should in theory be possible, but its in that time frame of a recent move such that something going wrong is much higher

Ok this is the situation i am in. just over two weeks ago i find out that fibre is available in my area and checkers for my line say 50 to 70mb. I phone my isp Sky who i was with for broadband and TV but not phone that was BT. So i phone Sky since i am with them for broadband and ask if i can get fibre. The 1st person i talked to because this becomes important later on said yes but i would need Sky talk first and once it is active i can order fibre he even talked to me about what kind of speed i could expect. So i go ahead and get Sky talk it was a bit cheaper than i paid BT for line rental and there talk package anyway so i can order fibre on the 8th.

Yesterday the 8th it went active i phone Sky to order fibre and 2nd Sky person tells me since Sky talk has just gone active i need to phone back tomorrow so today. Today i phone and basically get told that the 1st and 2nd people were wrong and although fibre is active in my area BT haven't given Sky access to it yet. Um what? i wish they had told me that on the first phone call with them so i could have simply phoned BT and switched my broadband from Sky to BT while i was already with BT for phoneline.

What is even worse of all is since my phoneline went full llu and changed to Sky completely for phone too (i was always with them for broadband alone just not phone part) it has now slowed my broadband down from a 9.8mbit sync to 7.2 that is quite a drop and my line attenuation has increased.

Also fibre checkers since Sky talk went active have changed from 50-70mb for fibre estimates to
47Mb-63Mb

This has left me quite annoyed.

I think i will cancel Sky completely and live with the downtime and go back to BT for fibre and line rental talk etc.

Today i phone and basically get told that the 1st and 2nd people were wrong and although fibre is active in my area BT haven't given Sky access to it yet

I don't believe that "BT haven't given Sky access". Sky work differently to most ISPs in the way they take fibre services and have to themselves do work at the exchange - I suspect they haven't done that yet.

Also fibre checkers since Sky talk went active have changed from 50-70mb for fibre estimates to
47Mb-63Mb

Estimates are estimates - no matter when you sign up it is irrelevant as they fluctuate as do line speeds. It is possible that a number of people have signed up and that the cross talk has increased. Even if you signed up when the estimate was higher you would still only have got whatever your line was capable of.

Sky should have told you when you first spoke to them that they hadn't yet done their bit at the exchange. If you want to go back to BT then I would ring Sky, tell them you are going to migrate within the cooling off period and then contact BT to get the ball rolling. I would also contact Sky via a written medium just to confirm to ensure they can't then say that you hadn't told them.

Thanks for your reply. There is something, I have always liked Sky's network on dsl whatever i sync at i get 24/7 which is why i wanted them at first as my fibre isp still.
If i just waited how long do Sky take normally to install there equipment into the exchange so i can get there fibre?

I don't know how long it takes but I am sure I remember some exchanges where Sky decided not to at all - presumably because of the costs and not enough customers on the exchange. It is also possible they have already done it but for some reason Sky haven't got the right data on your record - do you know if there are other cabs on your exchange that are already FTTC - if so then checking if any of them can get Sky Fibre would be interesting as it is an exchange level change not cab level.

If this is the first cabinet on an exchange it can be a few days to a couple of months or never.

Without knowing the exchange and thus being able to see the history of when other cabinets have gone live and whether we see Sky FTTC speeds from people on that exchange hard to say more.

The most likely scenario is that the FTTC systems that Openreach and BT Wholesale run have updated, and just needs the same to happen at Sky - unless this is the first cabinet on the handover exchange.

This is the exchange

https://www.samknows.com/broadband/exchange/SSSHE

Edit that says fttc not available when BT say i can get it and all checkers do... ok this is getting weirder.

Edited by deleted (Tue 09-Feb-16 15:26:02)

First cabinet went live in November 2015 so it is possible that if Sky is dragging its feet on getting the cablelink order in, and the usual wait for Openreach to do the work then it may not be available.

No obvious Sky or TalkTalk FTTC speed tests on the exchange yet.

Though there are signs that the head end is actually at Stroud where we are seeing Sky FTTC customers, i.e. with FTTC the fibre does not always go to the usual exchange, but often a larger exchange in the area. This saves on the cost of rolling out the head end exchange hardware.

So suspect just Sky being slow on updating internal availability checkers and sales people jumping the gun.

Thanks for the very informative reply. I phoned Sky to make a complaint and something interesting happened that makes it sound like it is a internal Sky issue. When i told him what happened he looked into it and said my area is showing as available for Fibre from them but not on my account. There not sure if it is an issue with my cab or my account due to recent Sky talk activation and cancellation of Sky go extra in progress.
So either my cab isn't enabled with Sky but others are or some internal Sky computer issue is stopping it from showing as available on my line when it is.

The guy i talked to just now said he would phone back by end of this week.
I shall wait and see.

Sky have managed to activate fibre on my account. It seems it was an account issue caused by some changes i had made last month that were still in progress.

One thing now Sky have changed my fibre estimate again this time to 30 to 40mb BT said my line was guaranteed 35mb and is still giving a estimate of 47 to 63mb. Is there anyway to calculate what my line should do by my dsl figures in the Sky hub?

No, only can give estimates based on distance in addition to the ranges given by the BT Wholesale checker.

As for the word guaranteed they cannot use that word as you cannot guarantee the speed

Whats worrying me is since i changed to Sky for talk side of things my normal dsl has dropped from 9.8mb to, well its still getting slower now 7mb pretty much a almost 3mb drop. My dsl line attenuation has also increased and it was not people getting fibre cause it happened the instant i was switched from BT for line rental/phone to Sky.

Screenshot of BT with there "guaranteed speeds"

http://s24.postimg.org/j1frkdied/Capture.png

That image was taken after i entered my number and post code to the BT website checker. Sky are saying 30 to 40 and would not say anything else other than that range.

When you hover the mouse over speed it says it's an estimate, though should be accurate to within 1 or 2 Mb. That gives it enough getouts to be just about meaningless.

The Ofcom Voluntary Code of Practice gives customers some rights in regards to what customers are told about speeds at the point of sale, and what speeds they actually receive. You might want to check that out: http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/telecoms/codes-of-p...

BT, Sky and TalkTalk all signed up to it.

Edited by Oliver341 (Wed 10-Feb-16 17:17:49)

If the jump in attenuation was 3dB then its because they've moved you from BT Wholesale based ADSL, to their own LLU network running on ADSL2+

Thanks Oliver for that link. Sky didn't exactly give me a min speed when i ordered fibre, they just said between 30 and 40mb, does that mean 30mb is my min?

Let's forget fibre and see what may have gone wrong with my normal dsl because i am a bit worried Sky have somehow damaged my line since the takeover of Line rental.
I was on aaisp for dsl and talk talk for line rental/phone then switched to Sky for broadband. Back then Sky allowed you to just get broadband alone and not anything else with it.

I always got with Talk talk and BT who i later on moved to for line rental and phone package between 9.5 and 10.2mbit. Since Sky fully took over my line i'm getting 7048kbit my upload has also dropped from 1.1mbit to well under 1mbit 0.8 i think.

Line attenuation went from 41.5 to 42.5db downstream my noise margin downstream has gone from 3db to 6.2 so that could be the reason, I first thought Sky DLM line training had re activated after the switch however that reconnects the line at night my line is reconnecting more than once every 24 hours including in the day.
Also since the switch to Sky for line rental my voice line actually sounds worse it sounds quieter and not quite as clear although there is no obviase noises or buzzing or hissing it is most definitely quieter.

Sky is cheaper than BT and if i get a good fibre speed say near the max of the standard 40mb package i'll be happy i just hope they have not messed with my line badly. I have not had a sync of less than 8mb for a long time, years.

BT will only drop to a 3dB noise margin when it is satisfied the line is stable.

When you start a new connection, as you have done, I would expect the margin to be the default 6dB - as yours is. Ignore the 0.2 as there will be a small variation second by second.

Attenuation - could be due to a longer line length in the exchange or a minor difference in the driver output impedance.

I have been with Sky for broadband normal dsl for over 4 years. In that time i have only switched line rental/voice part of the line from talk talk to BT and now finally Sky for that too. So my broadband provider has not changed. I think you are right tho Sky have reset my line profile. Talk talks equipment when i was with them for voice/line rental gave me same speed as BT did with Sky broadband.
It's ironic that Sky broadband is slowest with them for line rental/voice compared to Talk talk and BT with Sky broadband running through there line.

I get what you say about the engineer changing me to Sky's equipment for line rental could have made my line longer.

Since fibre depends on the distance to the cab not the exchange am i right in thinking this shouldn't affect what speed i end up with on fibre when its activated in up to 2 weeks as Sky said.