G.Fast

Been watching the DSL checker recently as it was showing G.Fast planned against my number, however its disappeared this morning, then I happened to be walking the dog and noticed some contractors working on the cabinets just down the road from me and looks like they are installing G.Fast pod onto the PCP.

Hopefully it will be live soon and I will be able to upgrade. Would be happy to share my experience between their install and go live to upgrade timescales.

So contractors spent the whole day there yesterday so I assume the pod is up and running as they where feeding all the cable through. I assume the next stage is for someone at openreach to come and commission the box.

Most likely, good luck with it. I think I'm just slightly out of range to even get G.fast sadly so I'm stuck with the archaic and troublesome ECI DSLAM (VDSL2/FTTC) .

Not sure if its related but Openreach guy working in a manhole just down the road from cabinet. May or may not be related to the new G.Fast pod.

Unlikely

He has been there pretty much all day going between the man hole a few houses away from the cabinet, back to the cabinet and the manhole covers in front of the cabinet etc.

Which cabinet? The PCP or the VDSL2 one?

The PCP one.

In reply to a post by ansam:

The PCP one.

Sounds more like an extension pod for the PCP so that it can handle more lines rather than a g.fast pod.

In reply to a post by robertcrowther:

In reply to a post by ansam:

The PCP one.

Sounds more like an extension pod for the PCP so that it can handle more lines rather than a g.fast pod.

I am almost certain its a g.fast pod. Unless Huawei do PCP extensions as it was in a Huawei box before they installed it.

Looks exactly this like: https://imgur.com/a/HS0BYc5

It might be a good idea to post an actual photo of the pod, that way it can be identified if it's an extension or a g.fast pod.

The reason why I mentioned an extension rather than a g.fast pod is because you described the engineer doing the following: "going between the man hole a few houses away from the cabinet, back to the cabinet and the manhole covers in front of the cabinet".

This is something that they might do for an extension pod rather than for a g.fast pod.

Like I say it looks exactly like the one in that picture, I should say the pod has been in for days and the guys did the cabling between the fibre cabinet and the pod from what I could see and they spent the full day in it. I am utterly convinced this is not a PCP extension as we only in the last year or two got a newer bigger PCP. When the guys installed it they took it out a Huawei box, it�s exactly like the one I posted. it�s off the ground, slants at the bottom is darker green and quite chunky looking. It�s definitely the same one as in the picture.

Both the extension pods and the g.fast pods are slanted at the bottom to avoid having to get planning permission in order to install them.

I doubt if extension pods have vents.

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

I doubt if extension pods have vents.

That's part of the reason why I wanted them to post a pic as what is happening is more like what they do with an extension pod, but describing a g.fast pod, so a photo of the pod would solve the mystery. Unfortunately they seem reluctant to do so.

I will grab an photo tomorrow but I am not sure why it�s required as like I said the evidence supports it a g.fast pod.

1 the box they attached was in a huawei branded box.
2. When they installed it they where going between the PCP and the fibre cabinet.
3. It�s the exact same as the one I pictured previously and that is a g.fast post. It does have the vents etc. It�s the exact same.

Edited by deleted (Sat 02-Jun-18 08:58:29)

If it has the vents that a g.fast pod - simplez

The physical pod needs a fibre and power from the existing VDSL2 cabinet, so some ground work can be expected. So not so sure why others seem convinced its not.

It is potentially possible the work you saw was for something else, but also given recent addition of the pod seems a higher probability that it is associated with the pod

So I managed to get information from OpenReach but they are saying my line is over the 300M from the cabinet which I am not really convinced about. I can see the cabinet from my windows (and yes I know thats not an indication of length).

My current connection is around 71Mbps which would suggest I am closer to the cabinet than they are saying is it not?

Went around this loop with someone else, and they could see cabinet but road distance was 370m to 400m in the end.

71 Mbps sync is possible on lines of 400m to 500m on VDSL2. As G.fast is higher frequency that VDSL2 if you are already seeing VDSL2 dropping speeds it is possible that you might only see a small jump with G.fast, hence below the magic 100 Mbps cut off that runs currently.

I'm at 600m line run from the FTTC cabinet and my current sync is 70.3Mbps with max attainable varying as high as 73.3Mbps. So yes, you are very possibly more than 300 metres from yours. (Have you checked it is an FTTC cabinet, not some other BT or VM one?)

What is your upstream sync? That may be a better guide.

Edited by RobertoS (Wed 06-Jun-18 14:01:32)

If I use Google Maps to measure the distance between my house and where the cabinet is I see 220m.

https://imgur.com/a/9snsFDA

Initially on the DSL checker I was showing a speed of 267Mbps (Planned) although Planned has now been removed. Now not any house (I tried around 6 (two from one end, two from middle, two from other end) and I do not see any G.Fast service available despite them saying the work is done and its active.

Not sure if stats will help...

=====
# xdslcmd info --stats
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Last initialization procedure status: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 33603 Kbps, Downstream rate = 86176 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 20000 Kbps, Downstream rate = 79999 Kbps
Bearer: 1, Upstream rate = 0 Kbps, Downstream rate = 0 Kbps
Link Power State: L0
Mode: VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile: Profile 17a
TPS-TC: PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis: U:ON /D:ON
Line Status: No Defect
Training Status: Showtime
Down Up
SNR (dB): 5.9 14.4
Attn(dB): 12.6 0.0
Pwr(dBm): 12.4 2.1
VDSL2 framing
Bearer 0
MSGc: -6 20
B: 81 239
M: 1 1
T: 0 64
R: 6 0
S: 0.0324 0.3819
L: 21746 5028
D: 16 1
I: 88 120
N: 88 240
Q: 16 0
V: 10 0
RxQueue: 135 0
TxQueue: 27 0
G.INP Framing: 18 0
G.INP lookback: 27 0
RRC bits: 0 24
Bearer 1
MSGc: 186 -6
B: 0 0
M: 2 0
T: 2 0
R: 16 0
S: 5.3333 0.0000
L: 48 0
D: 3 0
I: 32 0
N: 32 0
Q: 0 0
V: 0 0
RxQueue: 0 0
TxQueue: 0 0
G.INP Framing: 0 0
G.INP lookback: 0 0
RRC bits: 0 0
Counters
Bearer 0
OHF: 0 1028994
OHFErr: 827 6246
RS: 2665153776 101324
RSCorr: 854713 0
RSUnCorr: 0 0
Bearer 1
OHF: 220777462 0
OHFErr: 0 0
RS: 2649328809 0
RSCorr: 412 0
RSUnCorr: 0 0

Retransmit Counters
rtx_tx: 205945 0
rtx_c: 61288 0
rtx_uc: 6838 0

G.INP Counters
LEFTRS: 0 0
minEFTR: 80001 0
errFreeBits: 31422901 0

Bearer 0
HEC: 0 0
OCD: 0 0
LCD: 0 0
Total Cells: 107191989 0
Data Cells: 2467953167 0
Drop Cells: 0
Bit Errors: 0 0

Bearer 1
HEC: 0 0
OCD: 0 0
LCD: 0 0
Total Cells: 0 0
Data Cells: 0 0
Drop Cells: 0
Bit Errors: 0 0

ES: 749 4712
SES: 0 2
UAS: 26 26
AS: 3546280

Bearer 0
INP: 55.00 0.00
INPRein: 1.00 0.00
delay: 0 0
PER: 0.00 6.13
OR: 0.01 33.91
AgR: 80737.89 20033.74

Bearer 1
INP: 4.00 0.00
INPRein: 4.00 0.00
delay: 3 0
PER: 16.06 0.01
OR: 95.62 0.01
AgR: 95.62 0.01

Bitswap: 412257/412261 61/61

Total time = 1 days 1 hours 5 min 6 sec
FEC: 854713 0
CRC: 827 6246
ES: 749 4712
SES: 0 2
UAS: 26 26
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Latest 15 minutes time = 5 min 6 sec
FEC: 39 0
CRC: 0 1
ES: 0 1
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Previous 15 minutes time = 15 min 0 sec
FEC: 46 0
CRC: 0 2
ES: 0 2
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Latest 1 day time = 1 hours 5 min 6 sec
FEC: 346 0
CRC: 0 6
ES: 0 6
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Previous 1 day time = 24 hours 0 sec
FEC: 8757 0
CRC: 2 144
ES: 2 112
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Since Link time = 41 days 1 hours 4 min 39 sec
FEC: 854713 0
CRC: 827 6246
ES: 749 4712
SES: 0 2
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
====

So no one is showing G.fast availability now? if so it may be they are waiting for something e.g. some power or copper or fibre wiring or worse the line card had a fault and needs to be swapped out.

Local workers saying work is done invariably mean their bit of the job is done, very rare to find team doing all the various jobs.

Hello,

No one ever was showing available, only planned. Here is what I got back from OR this morning.....

====
I have been in contact with our Fibre Delivery Manger who has confirmed the GFast project has been completed. In order benefit from the GFast service there is a network / cable distance limitation. I have checked the network / cable serving your premises to cabinet 4 and unfortunately the distance is over the limitation of 300m . Therefore you would not be able to have the GFast service.

However the cabinet is fibre enable and you would be able to place an order with your service provider for Fibre to the cabinet (FTTC).
====

Can they do a line distance check without access to the property (don't they need their machine plugged into the phone line)?

They then said order FTTC and thats what sparked me to think this was just a duff didn't bother to check reply cause I already have FTTC on the line, wouldn't they have seen this already?

In reply to a post by ansam:

If I use Google Maps to measure the distance between my house and where the cabinet is I see 220m.

https://imgur.com/a/9snsFDA

Initially on the DSL checker I was showing a speed of 267Mbps (Planned) although Planned has now been removed. Now not any house (I tried around 6 (two from one end, two from middle, two from other end) and I do not see any G.Fast service available despite them saying the work is done and its active.

Not sure if stats will help...

=====
# xdslcmd info --stats
xdslcmd: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Retrain Reason: 0
Last initialization procedure status: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 33603 Kbps, Downstream rate = 86176 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 20000 Kbps, Downstream rate = 79999 Kbps
Bearer: 1, Upstream rate = 0 Kbps, Downstream rate = 0 Kbps

Hmmmm. That's all rather different from what you posted 67 minutes previously .

In reply to a post by ansam:

My current connection is around 71Mbps which would suggest I am closer to the cabinet than they are saying is it not?

It's hard to give advice when provided with duff info by you. It's also very annoying to have wasted the time in doing so. Two of us did.

Edited by RobertoS (Wed 06-Jun-18 15:23:24)

Sorry can you elaborate? I have no idea what your talking about.

https://imgur.com/a/gwdz6Wu

Edited by deleted (Wed 06-Jun-18 15:26:13)

Ye gods and little fishes!

Max: Upstream rate = 33603 Kbps, Downstream rate = 86176 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 20000 Kbps, Downstream rate = 79999 Kbps

Bearer 0 is your FTTC connection speeds. (Downstream rate? Is that so abstruse? I'm sure you aren't a newbie to the world of line stats).
Bearer 1 is 200kbps so shows as zero, but is the G.INP control link. I'm not criticising your not knowing that.

My current connection is around 71Mbps which would suggest I am closer to the cabinet than they are saying is it not?

To which we both replied saying it didn't suggest any such thing. That you were drawing the wrong conclusion from it, thus making your complaint about not being offered G.Fast not supported by it.

Edit: The Max line shows what you could get if Openreach didn't cap the product at 80/20Mbps.

Edited by RobertoS (Wed 06-Jun-18 15:35:51)

Probably the head end isn't ready for CP Orders yet. This is pretty common AFAIK. Lots of g.fast pods installed but many cannot order.

They have access to the DP records and that is what the availability will be based on, so question is which cabinet and exchange, then we can look at other addresses and check (a) it is available to order (b) where the service seems to run out.

Telephone wiring can cross streets unexpectedly, ie. when duct was put it may be a slightly road arrangement today

G.fast is at that stage where they are being cautious as they don't want to bother installing and find people are not getting the best speeds, maybe once there are a couple of hundred thousand people live then things may change.

As for plugging in Openreach own and run the DSLAM so can see existing line stats is they wanted to without entry to the property.

PCP 4 / Drumchapel Exchange

This is the reason why I gave up on this person as they kept posting contradicting information and now I've noticed they have posted a so called email from OpenReach. I say so called because not sure that someone from OpenReach would send an email with simple spelling mistakes.

That would make sense, another option is that just prior to going live we have seen estimates vanish

So for now it is sit tight and see what happens

Hello,

I am only going to address this once so we can clear this up because I am still at a loss about what the hell your talking about. What contradicting information did I post? I clearly posted that my speed test showed I was getting around 71mbps and then I posted the stats from the modem to see if they would help determine if the speed/stats could help as an indication about distance to the cabinet and that has been a clear no that it does not, so thats the end of that. In response to your previous post yes I am a "newbie" at the stats but I do understand what the Downstream rate means but I still have no idea how that contradicts what I said earlier against speed vs stats.

As for the e-mail I can assure you this is a legitimate e-mail from OR (Infrastructure Solutions Customer Service) which I am happy to forward a screenshot to the moderators for verification (just won't post publicly here).

Edited by deleted (Wed 06-Jun-18 16:52:15)

Blimey things have escalated.

The 71 Mbps was not originally communicated as a speed test result, particularly as the connection speed is a lot more important than a speed test in evaluating possible G.fast availability.

End of story is this....do nothing else until such time as someone with 20m of the cabinet is able to order g.fast

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

Blimey things have escalated.

The 71 Mbps was not originally communicated as a speed test result, particularly as the connection speed is a lot more important than a speed test in evaluating possible G.fast availability.

End of story is this....do nothing else until such time as someone with 20m of the cabinet is able to order g.fast

Ah ok gotcha so its a case of not being clearer on the language or technical terms I used. So I apologies if that original 71mbps came across as a line stats and not a speed test result as it originally was.

Edited by deleted (Wed 06-Jun-18 17:01:29)

In reply to a post by ansam:

Fibre Delivery Manger

Not sure that someone from OR would get the word Manager wrong, just saying.

I sent a screenshot to MrSaffron of the e-mail thread to confirm its authenticity.

Ok, I will wait and see if this gets activated. As you said @MrSaffron perhaps the "Planned" was removed ready for activation so I will keep an eye on it with properties closer to the cabinet see what comes up and when I see G.Fast available on their lines I will check my line again.

I hope you included the source information with that screenshot and not just pic of the email as it's very easy to have an email from any email address and only the source information will validate where it's from.

In reply to a post by robertcrowther:

I hope you included the source information with that screenshot and not just pic of the email as it's very easy to have an email from any email address and only the source information will validate where it's from.

Isn't it better to give the benefit of the doubt? I think it more likely that someone in BT typing a quick email has made spelling mistakes than that a forum user would make up an email that doesn't give any benefit to them in this forum.

Normally I would give benefit of the doubt, but in this instance it's just seems weird that when they are asked for information it then contradicts what they have previously said.

I also know from my experience with OR that mostly they do have pre-written emails (template emails) that they just changes some of the details (as it saves typing out a whole email).

Also it does seem weird that they are not prepared (on several occasions) not to post things that could prove their point

I am not going to go down the road of having to chase numerous people in Openreach to verify an email, i.e. would take my time and their time for zero actual benefit.

I will say this, one of the reasons there has been a shrinking back of projects from the public comment side of things is arguments over emails and promises that were often not a promise but an aspiration but people took it as a promise. Also sometimes staff may something in an email that was private to a correspondent and repeating this can cause problems, so for others consider what you publish online carefully.

I'll close this thread now, and will say this I know people get upset about confusing language used in posts but we all do need to be accommodating towards others. How we ask the questions to get to the underlying reality is always a difficult game, but when we all do probe and question can we attempt to remain welcoming.

Calling out someone like me on poor grammar/spelling is par for the course but expect people to be more tolerant of others.