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Standard User beefcakechipz
(newbie) Sun 08-Sep-19 12:43:26
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Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[link to this post]
 
Up until 3 months ago i have always been able to stream/download movies /boxsets via sky+hd box. I dont understand why but since changing from my isp dns to https://1.1.1.1/dns/ im now able to stream again.
Before i switched to 1.1.1.1 sky movies downloaded at 1.5meg since switching they now download at 20+meg.
I have netflix from smart tv and this has never been affected it always worked fine on isp dns ips.

Anyone have any idea why ?

Edited by beefcakechipz (Sun 08-Sep-19 12:46:23)

Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sun 08-Sep-19 13:13:03
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: beefcakechipz] [link to this post]
 
Before i switched to 1.1.1.1 sky movies downloaded at 1.5meg since switching they now download at 20+meg


Have you got the speeds the wrong way around, as this reads like speeds for downloads have improved since you switched.

Assuming things are slower now, most likely is Sky was spotted the Sky box requests via its DNS and serving content from a faster source. Using the external DNS is skipping that intercept and maybe being sent to a different box.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User beefcakechipz
(newbie) Sun 08-Sep-19 13:39:09
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Hi mate

When i was on isp dns and downloading movies they would only download at 2meg and would not go any faster.
Then i read that other people had same issues on sky forums, someone said to try switching dns to 1.1.1.1
As soon as i switched dns ip sky movies were now downloading at 20 meg

i dont understand how changing dns ip speeds up my sky downloads ?

Its only the speed from sky servers im talking about, my internet speeds are 62/15 daily wink

Edited by beefcakechipz (Sun 08-Sep-19 13:41:10)


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Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sun 08-Sep-19 13:53:04
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: beefcakechipz] [link to this post]
 
Ah so why has speed changed...

All down to how Sky manages traffic and/or with a different DNS server you may be being sent to a different server

e.g. it may be that if you use Sky DNS you end up on a content server for a region that is very busy, but by luck the other DNS is resolving to an IP address somewhere else that is not so busy.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User beefcakechipz
(newbie) Sun 08-Sep-19 14:10:09
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Yes i explained this to sky and they blamed my isp, and my isp (idnet) said my connection was fine with no issues my internet has always worked fine with all other devices netflix etc...
Something changed at sky in last 3 months, i wonder if they are trying to screw up the old boxes and hope people like me using them will jump to the newer sky Q box.

Edited by beefcakechipz (Sun 08-Sep-19 14:14:32)

Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 08-Sep-19 14:11:41
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: beefcakechipz] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by beefcakechipz:
i dont understand how changing dns ip speeds up my sky downloads ?


Your Sky+HD or SkyQ box asks the DNS server for the IP address of the server for downloads by name. In the same way your web browser asks the DNS server for the IP for google.com or forums.thinkbroadband.com

MrSaffron's guess is that you are using Sky as your internet provider, and they have set up their DNS server to reply with the IP address of a server that is slow. (its either broken, or deliberately slow).

MrSaffron also guesses that because you change the DNS to 1.1.1.1 (which is operated by CloudFlare) when your Sky+HD or SkyQ box asks for the IP address, it is given a different IP address for a different server.

This server is faster.

If you are not using Sky as your internet provider, then talk to your internet provider.

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m; high sync history: 64/9 (Sep/17), 54/6 (Jan/19), 51/6 (Mar/19), 47/6 (Aug/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM
Standard User beefcakechipz
(newbie) Sun 08-Sep-19 14:18:01
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
I spoke to idnet and they said there is nothing wrong with my connection but they also dont suggest anything other than there is nothing wrong ... goodbye! ....... so whos at fault are idnet dns servers playing up or skys ?

Edited by beefcakechipz (Sun 08-Sep-19 14:21:03)

Standard User gmangt4
(regular) Sun 08-Sep-19 14:37:05
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: beefcakechipz] [link to this post]
 
I must admit I can't remember the last time I used any ISP's DNS servers when on home broadband, I always use 1.1.1.1 and 8.8.8.8 as secondary, my guess is that IDNet's DNS are a bit flaky, videos on you tube on an xbox for example showing same symptoms you had, game downloading slowly on ISP DNS (not IDNet), changed XBox DNS to 8.8.8.8 and game download maxed out his connection.
Don't think IDNet's poor customer service is unique to them, have you tried Virgin's? Not even worth calling them lol
Standard User beefcakechipz
(newbie) Sun 08-Sep-19 14:51:02
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: gmangt4] [link to this post]
 
Maybe its time for a change in isp crazy

Can i ask why is it that people prefer to use third party dns over your isp dns ?

Edited by beefcakechipz (Sun 08-Sep-19 15:07:28)

Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 08-Sep-19 15:42:07
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: beefcakechipz] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by beefcakechipz:
Maybe its time for a change in isp crazy

IDnet generally have good customer service, over the usual mass market choices so that is a surprise.

Can i ask why is it that people prefer to use third party dns over your isp dns ?

I use Quad 9 on 9.9.9.9 and their website explains why you might want to use them:
https://quad9.net/
I personally don't use CloudFlare or Google as they only want us to use them for the data they can get from this.

Normally it is better to use your ISP as many Content Distribution Networks (CDN's) are optimised when DNS queries come from the ISP.

I suspect in this case there is a fault with some Sky owned hardware.

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m; high sync history: 64/9 (Sep/17), 54/6 (Jan/19), 51/6 (Mar/19), 47/6 (Aug/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM
Standard User Alucidnation
(member) Sun 08-Sep-19 16:14:12
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
Must admit, that after swapping mine for 1.1.1.1, things have become a little snappier than the ISP DNS.

Draytek 2862.
Standard User beefcakechipz
(newbie) Sun 08-Sep-19 19:11:11
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
I suspect in this case there is a fault with some Sky owned hardware.


Maybe on sky side as sky replaced my dish and box and cables last week for free! And it didn't fix it until i changed the dns. Atleast i got free replacements wink

Edited by beefcakechipz (Sun 08-Sep-19 19:13:00)

Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 08-Sep-19 22:49:44
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: beefcakechipz] [link to this post]
 
On a slightly related point, Sky routers now rewrite DNS packets so that if you change the DNS servers on your PC to another provider's, DNS queries are still answered by Sky.

You can circumvent this by using a VPN or encrypted DNS.

In reply to a post by beefcakechipz:
Can i ask why is it that people prefer to use third party dns over your isp dns ?

By and large, ISP DNS servers are as good as any other, but some DNS providers offer other features like ad-blocking. Some also offer parental control & malware blocking, but again, most ISPs offer in-house solutions for this too these days.

Oliver.
Standard User ukhardy07
(knowledge is power) Mon 09-Sep-19 00:59:15
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: beefcakechipz] [link to this post]
 
Likely to be your ISP not Sky at fault. I have a SKY fibre connection and have never seen your issues.
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 09-Sep-19 04:39:58
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
On a slightly related point, Sky routers now rewrite DNS packets so that if you change the DNS servers on your PC to another provider's, DNS queries are still answered by Sky.

Ouch, that's not nice. Another reason to avoid Sky as an ISP!

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m; high sync history: 64/9 (Sep/17), 54/6 (Jan/19), 51/6 (Mar/19), 47/6 (Aug/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 09-Sep-19 09:11:51
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jchamier:
Ouch, that's not nice. Another reason to avoid Sky as an ISP!

I've always found Sky to be a decent ISP, but I agree this move is questionable. Rewriting DNS packets is a good idea for enforcing their DNS-based parental control system, but there should be an on/off toggle in the router's GUI.

Oliver.
Standard User danielhyde
(learned) Mon 09-Sep-19 10:01:03
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jchamier:
In reply to a post by beefcakechipz:
Maybe its time for a change in isp crazy

IDnet generally have good customer service, over the usual mass market choices so that is a surprise.

Can i ask why is it that people prefer to use third party dns over your isp dns ?

I use Quad 9 on 9.9.9.9 and their website explains why you might want to use them:
https://quad9.net/
I personally don't use CloudFlare or Google as they only want us to use them for the data they can get from this.

Normally it is better to use your ISP as many Content Distribution Networks (CDN's) are optimised when DNS queries come from the ISP.

I suspect in this case there is a fault with some Sky owned hardware.


I'm not sure where you get your information from but one of the key benefits of Cloudflare's DNS is that they don't record your information.
See extract below taken from their website:

"We will never log your IP address (the way other companies identify you). And we’re not just saying that. We’ve retained KPMG to audit our systems annually to ensure that we're doing what we say.

Frankly, we don’t want to know what you do on the Internet—it’s none of our business—and we’ve taken the technical steps to ensure we can’t."

Website
Standard User Andrue
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 09-Sep-19 13:49:02
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: gmangt4] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by gmangt4:
I must admit I can't remember the last time I used any ISP's DNS servers when on home broadband, I always use 1.1.1.1 and 8.8.8.8 as secondary, my guess is that IDNet's DNS are a bit flaky, videos on you tube on an xbox for example showing same symptoms you had, game downloading slowly on ISP DNS (not IDNet), changed XBox DNS to 8.8.8.8 and game download maxed out his connection.
Don't think IDNet's poor customer service is unique to them, have you tried Virgin's? Not even worth calling them lol
Nowt wrong with IDNet's DNS servers that I've noticed. My Sky Q box downloads content plenty fast enough.

---
Andrue Cope
Brackley, UK
Standard User Andrue
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 09-Sep-19 13:55:13
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: beefcakechipz] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by beefcakechipz:
Yes i explained this to sky and they blamed my isp, and my isp (idnet) said my connection was fine with no issues my internet has always worked fine with all other devices netflix etc...
Something changed at sky in last 3 months, i wonder if they are trying to screw up the old boxes and hope people like me using them will jump to the newer sky Q box.
To be fair, now that it's matured it is a better box, especially if you need the extra tuners. I'm often recording four or five things at the same time during the evening. Having access to Netflix through the box is nice as well.

The only thing that irks me is the UHD support. They still haven't decided which version of HDR they are going to support and they still only allow you to have UHD if you go multiscreen (which I don't want or need).

---
Andrue Cope
Brackley, UK
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 09-Sep-19 15:44:33
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: danielhyde] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by danielhyde:
See extract below taken from their website:

That is good to know. Not sure I trust them (I run my own caching DNS) but having a decent policy helps.

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m; high sync history: 64/9 (Sep/17), 54/6 (Jan/19), 51/6 (Mar/19), 47/6 (Aug/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM
Standard User PaulKirby
(knowledge is power) Tue 10-Sep-19 00:02:10
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
In reply to a post by jchamier:
Ouch, that's not nice. Another reason to avoid Sky as an ISP!

I've always found Sky to be a decent ISP, but I agree this move is questionable. Rewriting DNS packets is a good idea for enforcing their DNS-based parental control system, but there should be an on/off toggle in the router's GUI.

Sky as an ISP are very bad, well they were when they bought BE, on BE we had a very stable +6Mbps on ADSL 2+ no reconnects nothing (brother used that for work stuff), Sky took over and our connection dropped to 2.5Mbps and Sky saying that's all our line could handle.

Our BE connection was our spare backup connection for when out Zen (main) connection (which moved to BT) went down which at the time was hardly, so we use to just swap back and forth when using the internet.

When brother moved out (he took his Zen Connection with him, hence the move to BT) we dropped that BE -> Sky connection due to not paying all that when Sky limits your connection by over half its speed.

So overall Sky are rubbish as an ISP also as a TV Provider, they charge so much for their HD Services and their boxes die on you over time and to get a new one you have to renew for another 12 to 18 months, and their support staff try all the tricks in the book to keep you there for another year.

Paul

BTBroadband - Ultrafast Fibre 2 Plus + FVA
Exchange Name: Ilford Central (LNILC) Cabinet: 24
TBB Speedtest IPv4 | TBB Speedtest IPv6 | Ookla Speedtest (Single Threaded) | Linksys WRT 3200 ACM (BQM)
Standard User baby_frogmella
(knowledge is power) Tue 10-Sep-19 10:57:18
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
So you won’t be migrating to Sky FTTP by the end of the year then? wink

Fluidata FTTPoD 330/30 Mbps
Openreach 4+2 ONT Huawei HG8240
Netgear RAX200 AX11000
Standard User broadband66
(knowledge is power) Tue 10-Sep-19 18:03:24
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Andrue] [link to this post]
 
Sky have also changed their Sky Go viewer and it demands that, when using windows 7, Aero display is enabled. This uses more CPU and RAM.

Sky are changing things for the sake of it!

Was Eclipse Home Option 1, VM 2Mb & O2 Standard
Now Utility Warehouse (up to 16mbps) via Talk Talk
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 10-Sep-19 18:30:13
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: broadband66] [link to this post]
 
I thought if Aero was disabled that Windows disabled the GPU and hence any "protected path" from the software to the display.

Without protected path, Sky Go won't play on any device. Hence why you can't "cast" Sky Go content on a mobile, or even connect an HDMI cable. Very irritating.

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m; high sync history: 64/9 (Sep/17), 54/6 (Jan/19), 51/6 (Mar/19), 47/6 (Aug/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM
Standard User PaulKirby
(knowledge is power) Tue 10-Sep-19 20:25:50
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:
So you won’t be migrating to Sky FTTP by the end of the year then? wink

Erm, NO LOL

Paul

BTBroadband - Ultrafast Fibre 2 Plus + FVA
Exchange Name: Ilford Central (LNILC) Cabinet: 24
TBB Speedtest IPv4 | TBB Speedtest IPv6 | Ookla Speedtest (Single Threaded) | Linksys WRT 3200 ACM (BQM)
Standard User PaulKirby
(knowledge is power) Tue 10-Sep-19 20:32:54
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jchamier:
I thought if Aero was disabled that Windows disabled the GPU and hence any "protected path" from the software to the display.

Without protected path, Sky Go won't play on any device. Hence why you can't "cast" Sky Go content on a mobile, or even connect an HDMI cable. Very irritating.

Most media content providers require HDCP (High-bandwidth Digital Content Protection) to be enabled for their players to work, that's why when we stream from our consoles etc we have to disable HDCP and that causes a load of media software to not work.

I know Netflix was one that requires it.

Its to stop you from recording it via HDMI etc.

Paul

BTBroadband - Ultrafast Fibre 2 Plus + FVA
Exchange Name: Ilford Central (LNILC) Cabinet: 24
TBB Speedtest IPv4 | TBB Speedtest IPv6 | Ookla Speedtest (Single Threaded) | Linksys WRT 3200 ACM (BQM)
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 10-Sep-19 23:52:54
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
That’s what I thought didn’t work on Win7 without aero desktop.

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m; high sync history: 64/9 (Sep/17), 54/6 (Jan/19), 51/6 (Mar/19), 47/6 (Aug/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM
Standard User PaulKirby
(knowledge is power) Wed 11-Sep-19 00:04:15
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
Yeah, some cheap HDML Splitters (not supporting HDCP) also cause the players to fail to play those types of content too.

Paul

BTBroadband - Ultrafast Fibre 2 Plus + FVA
Exchange Name: Ilford Central (LNILC) Cabinet: 24
TBB Speedtest IPv4 | TBB Speedtest IPv6 | Ookla Speedtest (Single Threaded) | Linksys WRT 3200 ACM (BQM)
Standard User Andrue
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 11-Sep-19 20:52:10
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by PaulKirby:
So overall Sky are rubbish as an ISP also as a TV Provider, they charge so much for their HD Services and their boxes die on you over time and to get a new one you have to renew for another 12 to 18 months, and their support staff try all the tricks in the book to keep you there for another year.
I've been a subscriber since before Sky+ existed. The only box failure I ever had was my first Sky+ when the disk failed. It was out of warranty and they charged £50 and sent someone out with a replacement. It was actually a better box. Sky have never ever required subscribers to renew their contract to get a fault fixed. I don't know how you've come up with that but - sorry - it's utter [censored]. Of course they might offer to renew/upgrade your contract in exchange for waiving the call out fee but that's just good business sense and if you enjoy the service it makes sense to you as well. The terms of their replacement service are damn' good. Who else would sell you a set top box and then repair/replace it forever for just £50 each time (it might be higher now, £65 possibly)?

With Sky Q it's different. We no-longer own the boxes. When we're done with the service we have to give them back. But now if they fail there is no repair cost. We just call up and within a day or two a replacement box is installed.

I haven't heard many bad things about them as an ISP and if I didn't need a static IP address I'd switch to them tomorrow and save even more money.

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?...

"the Sky call out charge is £60. That's to fix your Sky TV. Doesn't matter what's wrong with it, what has to be replaced, whatever - £60. If they waive it, they waive it, and your repair is free. It's not your job to tell them what's wrong."

What is your complaint?

---
Andrue Cope
Brackley, UK

Edited by Andrue (Wed 11-Sep-19 21:02:28)

Standard User PaulKirby
(knowledge is power) Thu 12-Sep-19 00:29:03
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Andrue] [link to this post]
 
We have been with sky when the only had 2 or so channels on Astra when it was analogue, so we have been with them right from the start.

With our Sky Boxes, we have had one HDD fail (loud clunking and high pitch screeching), 3 PSU die on us requiring all new caps to be replaced (not paying £249 for another one and that's skys discount with +12 resub), one card reader failed after 2 weeks.

The only discount we got was where we live in a conservation area we had to move our dish to the back of the house so that you cannot see it.
Sky said some high stupid price to take down and re-install, we said forget it and to cancel all our boxes and then we was put on hold where we was then told £5 for it, we said ok, and we got a brand new full install.

Now all those bad boxes, we now get the lockups on all 4 HD boxes all at the exact same time (within 10 mins) so Sky must be causing this, this issue requires a full unplug and plug back in.

Sky have never ever required subscribers to renew their contract to get a fault fixed. I don't know how you've come up with that but - sorry - it's utter [censored].

Well I am sorry to say that you are very incorrect here, I know what we was told on the phone and that we had to resub before they would even progress to the ordering of the new replacement box that we still had to pay for.
That was why I repaired our boxes when the caps in the PSU went.
There was no callout even offered, we was just offered a new box, which was sent out in the post and we had to install it.


When we have issues with our boxes and phone them up, Sky are all apologetic etc and then try to sell Sky-Q on us for more than what we are all ready paying which is way too much as it is.

Also Sky-Q sound good on paper but to have a single point of failure i.e. the main box with the drive on it.
I would of rather of have a HDD in each box, not a fan of all mini boxes having access to all recordings, but saying that it could come in handy if a movie is recorded and can watch in all rooms with a mini box.

But all those years we have been with sky, the only discount we would get if we was to move over to Sky-Q was a one off £30 discount, REALLY SKY.

But yeah, I think the move with Sky owning the boxes was a good move on their part, they would never of done that with their HD Boxes due to they die all the time or have loads of issues like the Ethernet Port stops working and fails until once again a reboot.

As them as an ISP, back when they brought BE they was very rubbish, didn't care about us users that was on BE, so we dropped then as soon as we could.
Maybe they have gotten better, I wouldn't know and don't plan to know.

Don't get me wrong, when everything works its all good, like with everything, but you just get some people that work at Sky that just have a bad attitude and you get treated like [censored] even though you are being polite and just trying to get an issue resolved.

Paul

BTBroadband - Ultrafast Fibre 2 Plus + FVA
Exchange Name: Ilford Central (LNILC) Cabinet: 24
TBB Speedtest IPv4 | TBB Speedtest IPv6 | Ookla Speedtest (Single Threaded) | Linksys WRT 3200 ACM (BQM)

Edited by PaulKirby (Thu 12-Sep-19 00:32:28)

Standard User dect
(committed) Thu 12-Sep-19 08:42:32
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
Thinking back to the very beginning of Sky TV they didn't encrypt their channels so you didn't need to use a Sky box (I used a NEC rather than the Amstrad and Pace models they supplied), once they decided to encrypt you could get a standalone Videocrypt decoder from them that plugged in via the COM port and like Sky Q boxes you never owned it.

Edited by dect (Thu 12-Sep-19 09:00:26)

Standard User PaulKirby
(knowledge is power) Thu 12-Sep-19 09:55:38
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
Yep, they started to use Videocrypt when their new Movie Channel started.

Our first receiver was that Amstrad Fidelity 16 channel box that we won in a competition, arrived in the post and had to install the ugly white dish ourselves.

The decoder plugged into the high density 15 way d sub socket at the back and used the baseband signal, I still have the service manual for that decoder here some place.

Then Amstrad brought out a receiver with I think was it 32 or 64 channels (such a while back) with the decoder built in.

TBH I don't recall where we got our decoder from, might of been a shop or a friend, it was a bit banged up, but worked.

That brings back the days of the extra dish pointing at another satellite for a certain channel tongue and using an old 486 PC with a RS232 TTL Converter and a modified phone card, ah those were the days LOL

One of my first companies I work for back then made Filmnet and RTL Decoders.

When they went digital we then moved over to a grey Sony Digibox, which were ok, they had some issues but overall they were ok.

And we used 4 of the Sony boxes until we got the HD Boxes.

Paul

BTBroadband - Ultrafast Fibre 2 Plus + FVA
Exchange Name: Ilford Central (LNILC) Cabinet: 24
TBB Speedtest IPv4 | TBB Speedtest IPv6 | Ookla Speedtest (Single Threaded) | Linksys WRT 3200 ACM (BQM)
Standard User Andrue
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 12-Sep-19 16:59:53
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
As I wrote. The call out to fix any technical problem is currently £65. There is no requirement to extend your contract and the work will be warranted for 3 months.

What you may or think you may have experienced is another matter but the fact is if your box stops working for any reason you just call Sky and they'll fix it for free within the first 12 months (though you might end up with a refurbished box) or £65 after that.

It is a perfectly reasonable, in fact a very good deal.

Yes, they might try and encourage you to extend your contract. Doing so will likely save you money (at least by waiving the call out fee) and might get your service upgraded in a way that you want at a discount (ie; free Movies for a month).

Such offers are entirely optional and are perfectly reasonable. You just have to say 'No thanks, just send the engineer'. Even better if you get uppity about the price they reduce and even waive it anyway.

---
Andrue Cope
Brackley, UK
Standard User PaulKirby
(knowledge is power) Thu 12-Sep-19 22:54:35
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Andrue] [link to this post]
 
Don't take this the wrong way I am not trying to be rude or anything, BUT you can keep saying what should of happened, but sadly that wasn't the case for us that time.

The offers all fall down to the person that you speak to on the phone on the day, sadly it seems we was miss informed and was told we had to pay for a new box and to get a discount we had to resub, there was absolutely no mention of an engineer visit or else we would of taken it.

This only happened to us the once, ever since that issue I have repaired the boxes myself which are mostly due to bad caps in the PSU, or bad solder joints that were resolved after a course from my hot air gun smile

But its good to know NOW that they should offer a £65 callout fee for an engineer to come out to either fix or replace the box with either a new or working box.

Paul

BTBroadband - Ultrafast Fibre 2 Plus + FVA
Exchange Name: Ilford Central (LNILC) Cabinet: 24
TBB Speedtest IPv4 | TBB Speedtest IPv6 | Ookla Speedtest (Single Threaded) | Linksys WRT 3200 ACM (BQM)
Standard User Andrue
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Fri 13-Sep-19 21:52:32
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by PaulKirby:
Don't take this the wrong way I am not trying to be rude or anything, BUT you can keep saying what should of happened, but sadly that wasn't the case for us that time.
Then your experience was very unusual and not at all typical. You should have raised a complaint with Sky.

I don't have any particular love for Sky but my dealings with them have always fair and professional. I don't think it's right that other people might be dissuaded from signing up with them on the basis of what I'm pretty sure was a very rare situation. I'm pretty sure that if you'd complained to Sky at the time they would have been very apologetic and probably given you six months free subscription or a box upgrade.

Mind you I do think their handling of static IP address is/was stupid. If they just said 'sorry, we don't do it' it'd be one thing. But the two times I enquired they told me it might be possible but they wouldn't know until the service went live. That's a pretty asinine thing to say. It makes little to no technical sense and who is going to sign up with an ISP in the hope that they will get a static IP address that they need?

---
Andrue Cope
Brackley, UK
Standard User PaulKirby
(knowledge is power) Sat 14-Sep-19 10:37:23
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Andrue] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Andrue:
Then your experience was very unusual and not at all typical. You should have raised a complaint with Sky.

I don't have any particular love for Sky but my dealings with them have always fair and professional. I don't think it's right that other people might be dissuaded from signing up with them on the basis of what I'm pretty sure was a very rare situation. I'm pretty sure that if you'd complained to Sky at the time they would have been very apologetic and probably given you six months free subscription or a box upgrade.

Oh I totally agree, there has been times when we had a nice person on the phone, like when my Sky card died, it was a very old card that had loads of scorch marks on it with some deformed plastic which was used on one of the boxes that the PSU died on it.
Any how they were very apologetic on the phone and asked for the viewing card number and the box it was for, so that it will already be paired up.

The card came put the card in seemed to work fine on Sky's entertainment channels, but failed to work on the movie and sports packages.
It said something about a technical issue and to phone sky, so I did.

It turns out according to the person that I spoke to 2 days later that all our cards were in the wrong boxes, yet they all was working fine and they were already paired up, so I had to write down all the serial numbers for the cards and boxes where between us went through correctly pairing up the cards (once again) and then everything was working.

But all through the conversation they were polite, not like that time we had that box issue.

So yeah its probably an isolated issue that happened.

In reply to a post by Andrue:
Mind you I do think their handling of static IP address is/was stupid. If they just said 'sorry, we don't do it' it'd be one thing. But the two times I enquired they told me it might be possible but they wouldn't know until the service went live. That's a pretty asinine thing to say. It makes little to no technical sense and who is going to sign up with an ISP in the hope that they will get a static IP address that they need?

Yeah, I think we had a Static IP on our BE -> Sky connection at the time it was a requirement for some reason my brother might of needed for doing work at home, I cannot remember.

The amount of times I have asked BT for a static IP due to I have been unlucky several times connected to a remote server when BT decided of renewing the routers IP, and I lost a 3 to 5 hours of programming due to the filing being locked and forcing a closure resulted in an empty file.

So I am like open file edit it, save it and close it LOL
I have started to do all of it now locally on another VM Box and when all the cone is complete and stable enough for public use I then take the servers down an upload the code, then restart the servers and let it do its update and then enable it for the public.

But I have noticed that the dynamic renewal seems to happen a lot less now that I am using a 3rd party router, not a fan of the Smart Hub.
So not sure if BT have extended our lease time or the router stays up longer than BT's Hubs.

I have also recently noticed that BT's Business packages now include the Ultrafast 2 speeds, before you had to go for either a slower package or go for the leased line for huge price.
Sure the new packages costs a lot more so I assume there is more that you get that you don't on the home version, like the 1 free Static IP, but I don't think that price for me just to get a Static IP is worth it, but that's just me.

All in all, most home users won't need a Static IP or a block of them, I know I don't need one, but it would help when doing remote programming at strange hours LOL

Paul

BTBroadband - Ultrafast Fibre 2 Plus + FVA
Exchange Name: Ilford Central (LNILC) Cabinet: 24
TBB Speedtest IPv4 | TBB Speedtest IPv6 | Ookla Speedtest (Single Threaded) | Linksys WRT 3200 ACM (BQM)
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 14-Sep-19 11:38:35
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
wink
A static IPv4 address is a one-off cost of £5 with Plusnet.
wink

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 14-Sep-19 12:01:13
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: PaulKirby] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by PaulKirby:
All in all, most home users won't need a Static IP or a block of them

I'd agree with that, especially as every ISP router I've had supports dynamic DNS providers.

Oliver.
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 14-Sep-19 15:55:49
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
A static IPv4 address is a one-off cost of £5 with Plusnet.

but the downside is ZERO support for IPv6.

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m; high sync history: 64/9 (Sep/17), 54/6 (Jan/19), 51/6 (Mar/19), 47/6 (Aug/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 14-Sep-19 15:56:09
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
In reply to a post by PaulKirby:
All in all, most home users won't need a Static IP or a block of them

I'd agree with that, especially as every ISP router I've had supports dynamic DNS providers.

DDNS works great for incoming, but not so good for connecting outbound.

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m; high sync history: 64/9 (Sep/17), 54/6 (Jan/19), 51/6 (Mar/19), 47/6 (Aug/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 14-Sep-19 16:31:06
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jchamier:
DDNS works great for incoming, but not so good for connecting outbound.

Keeping an IP address static for the purposes of home-working via a corporate firewall is generally outside the scope of what is within the T&C of home broadband providers.

Oliver.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 14-Sep-19 16:43:32
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
This is true.

However, if making a living in programming or any serious IT support working from home, the extra cost of a decently set up connection by taking a business one with BT or ANO would seem to be wiser than penny-pinching.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 14-Sep-19 16:57:16
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
In reply to a post by jchamier:
DDNS works great for incoming, but not so good for connecting outbound.

Keeping an IP address static for the purposes of home-working via a corporate firewall is generally outside the scope of what is within the T&C of home broadband providers.


Why do you say that? Surely if an ISP offers static IP (and of course many do not) then there is no difference in the connection to a dynamic IP. Other than it remains the same. (It is of course EASIER for the ISP, once they realise this, for an always on internet connection. That was BE's logic).

I have a Plusnet static IP because of my hobbies, and connecting through firewalls that I configure for my hobbies. No money involved, and this is nothing to do with my employer. Does that break T&C ?

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m; high sync history: 64/9 (Sep/17), 54/6 (Jan/19), 51/6 (Mar/19), 47/6 (Aug/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 14-Sep-19 16:58:40
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
However, if making a living in programming or any serious IT support working from home, the extra cost of a decently set up connection by taking a business one with BT or ANO would seem to be wiser than penny-pinching.

Depends if you're self employed, and hence (might) make a lot of money, or you're an employee of a very large multinational IT company that pays below market rates. (most of them).

I don't agree there is any guaranteed link between static IP and working at home for a large company. It could be a reason, but it is not the only reason. Some ISP's are wrong in this respect. By its nature, IPv6 will not be dynamic, and eventually the whole stupid idea of paying for a Static IP goes away.

People seem to think a dynamic IP is a security feature. Er.... they're wrong.

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m; high sync history: 64/9 (Sep/17), 54/6 (Jan/19), 51/6 (Mar/19), 47/6 (Aug/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM

Edited by jchamier (Sat 14-Sep-19 16:59:34)

Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 14-Sep-19 17:02:33
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
I was talking about Paul's setup in particular, where it would seem the extra cash for a business connection looks to me to be not of huge significance compared to the overall cost.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 14-Sep-19 17:03:34
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jchamier:
By its nature, IPv6 will not be dynamic

Not correct, the IPv6 prefixes handed out by BT and Sky are not static.

Oliver.
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 14-Sep-19 17:10:48
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jchamier:
I have a Plusnet static IP because of my hobbies, and connecting through firewalls that I configure for my hobbies. No money involved, and this is nothing to do with my employer. Does that break T&C ?

No. But the main reason for people wanting a static IP address will most likely be when they work from home and their employer wishes to put one, and only one, hole in their firewall for them.

Home applications such as remote monitoring webcams, or even hosting a local web/mail server are easily handled by DDNS.

I can see why ISPs do this as a form of "soft" discouragement from using home broadband for commercial purposes, even though in reality this is rarely if ever enforced within the T&C.

Oliver.
Standard User dect
(committed) Sat 14-Sep-19 17:31:25
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
the main reason for people wanting a static IP address will most likely be when they work from home and their employer wishes to put one, and only one, hole in their firewall for them.
Interesting, these employers I would think are likely to be small companies as most of the multinationals I know provide RSA tokens either physical or app based (e.g. blackberry/Android) and have done so for the last 20 years.

Edit: You also can't take a static IP address on the road, so no good on the train or at a hotel.

Edited by dect (Sat 14-Sep-19 17:34:23)

Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 14-Sep-19 17:35:40
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by dect:
Interesting, these employers I would think are likely to be small companies as most of the multinationals I know provide RSA tokens either physical or app based (e.g. blackberry/Android) and have done so for the last 20 years.

Do both for maximum security. Opening a server to the entire internet when it only needs to serve specific clients is an unnecessary risk.

Oliver.
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 14-Sep-19 17:37:43
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
Opening a server to the entire internet when it only needs to serve specific clients is an unnecessary risk.

Opening any hole in a firewall is a calculated risk. Using a properly configured VPN provides authentication, authorisation and ongoing data authenticity. Vastly superior to a hole in a firewall to a Static IP - that could be spoofed.

The idea a static IP is a security feature is madness.

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m; high sync history: 64/9 (Sep/17), 54/6 (Jan/19), 51/6 (Mar/19), 47/6 (Aug/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 14-Sep-19 17:38:53
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
That sounds as if BT & Sky have decided to do this for political reasons rather than technical common sense. There is no need with the volume of addresses in v6.

plusnet 80/20 (2/jun/14) at 470m; high sync history: 64/9 (Sep/17), 54/6 (Jan/19), 51/6 (Mar/19), 47/6 (Aug/19)
20 years of broadband from 1999's ntl:cable modem trial - Live BQM
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 14-Sep-19 17:47:56
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jchamier:
There is no need with the volume of addresses in v6.

Dynamic IP addressing hasn't been about IPv4 address conservation for many years. Pretty much everyone leaves their router on all the time, "hogging" an IPv4 address 24/7.

Oliver.
Standard User dect
(committed) Sat 14-Sep-19 17:48:30
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
Do both for maximum security. Opening a server to the entire internet when it only needs to serve specific clients is an unnecessary risk.
Well most of the multinationals I know don't do both so they must consider it an acceptable risk specially when some of them have 10s of thousands of employees working away from their offices.
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sat 14-Sep-19 17:55:42
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: dect] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by dect:
Well most of the multinationals I know don't do both so they must consider it an acceptable risk specially when some of them have 10s of thousands of employees working away from their offices.

I agree that what is most secure isn't always practically feasible when dealing with a very large number of clients.

Oliver.
Standard User Andrue
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 15-Sep-19 20:09:53
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jchamier:
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
In reply to a post by PaulKirby:
All in all, most home users won't need a Static IP or a block of them

I'd agree with that, especially as every ISP router I've had supports dynamic DNS providers.

DDNS works great for incoming, but not so good for connecting outbound.
I run an email server. I'd rather have a static IP address.

---
Andrue Cope
Brackley, UK
Standard User Andrue
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 15-Sep-19 20:11:16
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
wink
A static IPv4 address is a one-off cost of £5 with Plusnet.
wink
comes as standard with IDNet, as does a /48 IPv6 block wink

---
Andrue Cope
Brackley, UK
Standard User Andrue
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 15-Sep-19 20:13:11
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jchamier:
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
A static IPv4 address is a one-off cost of £5 with Plusnet.

but the downside is ZERO support for IPv6.
I left PN because they took the time to rebuild their network (in 2017 I think) and failed to build IPv6 support in at the same time. Absolutely amazing that they did all that work and still didn't create an ISP fit for the 21st century.

---
Andrue Cope
Brackley, UK
Standard User baby_frogmella
(knowledge is power) Sun 15-Sep-19 20:34:45
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Andrue] [link to this post]
 
I'm guessing you're some sort of IT worker who can't work without IPv6? Otherwise IPv6 isn't an absolute necessity for the average internet user, which is why not all mass CPs have adopted it at present. I'm sure all CPs will be suitably prepared on the day IPv4 stops working.

Fluidata FTTPoD 330/30 Mbps
Openreach 4+2 ONT Huawei HG8240
Netgear RAX200 AX11000

Edited by baby_frogmella (Sun 15-Sep-19 20:35:41)

Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sun 15-Sep-19 23:40:27
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: Andrue] [link to this post]
 
Like AAISP then tongue.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Three 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up.
==================================================
If you never think of anything off the wall, you'll never think of anything original.
Standard User Andrue
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 16-Sep-19 20:43:51
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Re: Question about sky+hd Box and dns


[re: baby_frogmella] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:
I'm guessing you're some sort of IT worker who can't work without IPv6? Otherwise IPv6 isn't an absolute necessity for the average internet user, which is why not all mass CPs have adopted it at present. I'm sure all CPs will be suitably prepared on the day IPv4 stops working.
Not supporting it on an existing network is one thing. A bit naff in this day and age but understandable for residential use. But PN undertook a major network rebuild. An ideal opportunity one would think to ensure that their network was up to date with all the latest technology and designed for the future. All they actually did was announce the end of their IPv6 beta programme because the servers weren't compatible with the new network.
So their network rebuild was actually a step backward.

That and their rapidly deteriorating technical support meant that I lost all confidence in them so I decided to jump ship.

Whether I need IPv6 or not isn't the point. Whether I can trust the competency of my ISP very much is.

---
Andrue Cope
Brackley, UK
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