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Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 16-Jun-20 20:29:02
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BT/Openreach migration gateway


[link to this post]
 
I'm switching separate landline and broadband services to BT Fibre 2 on 24th June, everything seems to be going okay apart from one thing - I haven't heard a peep from my old ISP. I have only had a leaving email and letter from the landline supplier.

I know this should all be handled automatically, and I have held back as I don't want to confuse matters, but I'm thinking that I should give my old ISP a nudge. I don't want them to get the wrong end of the stick and put a cease order through.

If I contact them tomorrow and they deny any knowledge of what's going on, is that possible? Ofcom refer to the system that notifies the losing ISP as the "electronic gateway". Does anyone know what this gateway is actually called? I wouldn't mind being able to throw it into the conversation.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Tue 16-Jun-20 22:00:16)

Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 16-Jun-20 21:42:40
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Primary consideration is the landline provider. I'd wait until after migration before contacting anyone if it were me.

Oliver.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 16-Jun-20 21:56:35
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
Cheers. I've left it this long, I did wonder if I might be better off letting things take their course, rather than confuse matters. Landline provider seems happy, and has sent all the relevant paperwork out.

I can see me having to argue the toss over notice periods with the ISP though. It would just be handy to understand the process for them being notified of the migration, and the terminology used.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC


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Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Tue 16-Jun-20 22:00:14
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
Possible problem with no notice given to the broadband provider though.

I seem to remember a recent thread (maybe 3-4 months ago?) about a losing provider who didn't send the required leaving info. Just wondering if it's the same provider, and what happened.

Edit: OP must have posted just after I started drafting the above smile.

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connection - Three B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up. 1+ 8 Pro max 80Mbps down, 24Mbps up.
=========================
To argue with a mindless bigot is foolish.

Edited by RobertoS (Tue 16-Jun-20 22:01:23)

Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 16-Jun-20 22:02:34
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
I'd prefer to argue notice periods after the fact rather than risking a cease! It's been a long while since I had split landline/ISPs but I'm guessing both are informed by Openreach.

Oliver.

Edited by Oliver341 (Tue 16-Jun-20 22:05:06)

Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Tue 16-Jun-20 22:17:39
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
You should get updated on dsl checker: https://www.broadbandchecker.btwholesale.com/#/ADSL

stroll down the page at the bottom as you should see: There are multiple orders open on your line which are due to complete by 24-JUNE-2020

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 16-Jun-20 22:28:57
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by adslmax:
You should get updated on dsl checker: https://www.broadbandchecker.btwholesale.com/#/ADSL

stroll down the page at the bottom as you should see: There are multiple orders open on your line which are due to complete by 24-JUNE-2020


Nothing showing where it usually does, in the notes at the bottom.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Tue 16-Jun-20 22:29:52
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Should be frown

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 16-Jun-20 22:30:33
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
I'd prefer to argue notice periods after the fact rather than risking a cease! It's been a long while since I had split landline/ISPs but I'm guessing both are informed by Openreach.

Ditto, I would sooner argue after than risk screwing it up now.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 16-Jun-20 22:35:43
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by adslmax:
Should be frown

Might it be worth contacting BT and letting them know I haven't heard from my old ISP?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Tue 16-Jun-20 22:42:21
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
yes

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 16-Jun-20 23:29:12
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
I'll do that. Cheers.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Wed 17-Jun-20 17:16:26
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
With things as they are with customer service phone lines, and the notice on the BT home page to try their community forum first before ringing, I split the difference and asked about a BT mod looking at it on the forum.

One of the members who flag stuff up for mods to look at got a bit shirty, saying that mods had better things to do than check something that may or may not be a problem, which I didn't think was too helpful. Another, more helpful member, was puzzled by the lack of open orders... though they did point out that something must have triggered the contact from the losing landline supplier, which all looks in order. The thread's gone a bit quiet now, not sure if they're ignoring me...

Nothing seems to have altered today, still not showing any open orders. I've been googling, and found a few other recent ISP forum mentions of instances where the broadbandchecker site has not updated to reflect open orders. I wonder if this is a possibility?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 17-Jun-20 17:18:29
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
Nothing seems to have altered today, still not showing any open orders. I've been googling, and found a few other recent ISP forum mentions of instances where the broadbandchecker site has not updated to reflect open orders. I wonder if this is a possibility?

I think so, especially if your line is WLR3 to WLR3 and not LLU.

Oliver.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Wed 17-Jun-20 17:37:47
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
Definitely no LLU, small rural exchange.

I'm swaying towards just sitting tight now and see what happens next week.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Wed 17-Jun-20 17:50:01
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
The open order should show up if there was an order placed on your line! If, nothing there mean they haven't act and commited order yet!

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014

Edited by adslmax (Wed 17-Jun-20 17:50:42)

Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 17-Jun-20 17:59:53
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
I'm swaying towards just sitting tight now and see what happens next week.

Yes, I would.

Oliver.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Wed 17-Jun-20 18:09:37
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by adslmax:
The open order should show up if there was an order placed on your line! If, nothing there mean they haven't act and commited order yet!

I can see the logic, but if there had been no order raised, how would TalkTalk (landline supplier) have been notified of the switch to BT?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User busterboy
(committed) Wed 17-Jun-20 18:10:31
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
One of the members who flag stuff up for mods to look at got a bit shirty, saying that mods had better things to do than check something that may or may not be a problem, which I didn't think was too helpful.


I would wager it wouldn't take two guesses who that was Paul. wink

Not the first time he has been rude and actually called someone an idiot two weeks ago.

I had a spat with him before that over another matter where he called me names.

Why he hasn't been kicked off I don't know. Keyboard warriors. HUH.

BTBroadband
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Wed 17-Jun-20 18:31:30
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: busterboy] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by busterboy:
I would wager it wouldn't take two guesses who that was Paul. wink

Not the first time he has been rude and actually called someone an idiot two weeks ago.

That's nice, I didn't know they had form.

I didn't think I was being too unreasonable. I nearly had a bit of a jab back, but thought better of it and toned it down before posting. I wish I'd left it in now! wink

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User forafewbytesmore
(newbie) Wed 17-Jun-20 19:11:22
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
I'm switching separate landline and broadband services to BT Fibre 2 on 24th June, everything seems to be going okay apart from one thing - I haven't heard a peep from my old ISP. I have only had a leaving email and letter from the landline supplier.


Did that this year. Old ISP emailed within a few hours.

Vigor130 -> OPNSense 20.1 -> Fritz!Box 3390
Spare VMG3925-B10C
Claranet -> FreeServe -> Plusnet -> Post Office
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Thu 18-Jun-20 12:13:01
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
Well, I bit the bullet and contacted BT by chat.

They are absolutely adamant that the order will go ahead as planned, but avoided addressing the points about the lack of contact by the ISP and the lack of open orders. No problem they reckon, the move will happen regardless.

I think we'll have to see what happens.

Oh, and another "goodbye" letter from landline provider TT this morning, so they must think it's still going ahead.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Thu 18-Jun-20 12:19:35)

Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 18-Jun-20 13:15:43
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
If nothing else we can use your experience to prove open orders are not always visible on the DSL Checker. 😎

Oliver.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Thu 18-Jun-20 13:37:20
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
Indeed. I'll keep checking it in case anything pops up.

I did consider contacting Andrew, see if he'd heard of anything like that before. He did me a big favour a long time ago, getting my line regraded back in the early days of fixed speed ADSL.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Thu 18-Jun-20 17:20:21
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
If nothing else we can use your experience to prove open orders are not always visible on the DSL Checker. 😎


That's always been the case.

What doesn't help is certain users with a little bit of knowledge who state their experience as absolute fact.


In reply to a post by adslmax:
The open order should show up if there was an order placed on your line! If, nothing there mean they haven't act and commited order yet!


Incorrect, it doesn't always mean that and posting this as an absolute fact is only going to worry the OP unnecessarily.

Most orders do indeed appear on the Wholesale checker, but not always.

The OP shouldn't worry, the migration appears to be progressing normally.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Thu 18-Jun-20 18:32:45
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
Thanks, that's good to hear. It's the BTw checker that's been bothering me more than anything.

I'll deal with the old ISP when it's done and dusted.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User mikel543
(newbie) Thu 18-Jun-20 21:39:17
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
I can confirm that open orders don't always show on the BTW DSL checker website. I recently switched providers and there was no open orders showing on DSL checker at all. The switch went ahead as planned on the date I was given by the new provider.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Thu 18-Jun-20 22:44:15
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: mikel543] [link to this post]
 
Thanks, I think that makes it pretty conclusive.

All systems go next Wednesday, with a bit of luck!

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Wed 24-Jun-20 09:12:59
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Changeover day, and something happening... lost ADSL authentication at 8.50 am. Still syncing though.

Strange things happening yesterday. When I drove past the cab yesterday, there was an Openreach van and a chap with his head in the box. When I got home, ADSL sync speed had gone screwy - DL has plummeted, with a 21dB margin, and UL nearly doubled. Weird.

Do OR ever do any work in advance, when they're "out this way"? Is that even possible with a ADSL to FTTC migration?

Now swapped over to BT Hub... we have an orangey light.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Wed 24-Jun-20 10:15:32)

Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Wed 24-Jun-20 12:51:33
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Just had an email from old ISP Eclipse, well KCOM... confirming migration completed, line number, completion date, etc.. At least I that's confirmed that they knew what was going on, even thought they didn't bother to contact me. Hopefully, the billing should sort itself out.

All seems to be going okay so far, just need OR to do their bit and plug us in!

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Wed 24-Jun-20 16:15:02
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
How much downtime normally?

Lost ADSL authentication this morning at 8.50am, and ADSL is still syncing at 4.15pm?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Wed 24-Jun-20 18:13:45
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Aaaargh! Just had an email from BT,

"We have to change some dates...

We're really sorry but your broadband will now start any time before midnight on 25 Jun 2020."

That's nice.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Wed 24-Jun-20 18:29:03)

Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Wed 24-Jun-20 19:22:34
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
It's a bit late telling you now, isn't it!!!

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connection - Three B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up. 1+ 8 Pro max 80Mbps down, 24Mbps up.
=========================
To argue with a mindless bigot is foolish.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Wed 24-Jun-20 19:53:12
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
You're not kidding, 6.07pm the email was sent. The old ISP had no problem switching us off at 8.50am this morning!

No internet in the house, I'm not very popular... frown

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 24-Jun-20 19:56:08
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
It's usually just a few minutes whenever I've switched, but one has to be prepared for the worst case scenario of a 24 hour outage.

Oliver.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Wed 24-Jun-20 20:12:47
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
It's usually just a few minutes whenever I've switched, but one has to be prepared for the worst case scenario of a 24 hour outage.

In my case, I think 24 hours could be optimistic.

Activation can be any time up to midnight, so it could be up to 39 hours without broadband... that is if they don't fail again tomorrow!

I wonder if they'll start billing me from the 24th?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Wed 24-Jun-20 20:15:16)

Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 24-Jun-20 20:20:36
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
"Midnight" is a little ambiguous but I suppose you're right in thinking they mean up to 27 hours from now.

That said, 0:00 in 3 hours time is technically Thursday. 🤷‍♂️

Oliver.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Wed 24-Jun-20 20:50:12
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
"Midnight" is a little ambiguous but I suppose you're right in thinking they mean up to 27 hours from now.

That said, 0:00 in 3 hours time is technically Thursday. 🤷‍♂️

I'm afraid it's pretty clear from the email that they mean midnight tomorrow night.

We need to change some dates

Hello Paul,

We're really sorry but your broadband will now start any time before midnight on 25 Jun 2020.

ADSL was turned off on the dot this morning though frown

There's also a big 'order reference' on the email in the format AJMAAZZZZ040xxxxxxxx. What's that? It doesn't tally with anything I've had in documentation from BT before. Is its an Openreach order reference?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Wed 24-Jun-20 20:52:19)

Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Thu 25-Jun-20 14:43:57
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Well, a nice chap from Openreach called this morning and said he would be with us in an hour or so, just under two hours later we are up and running.

Now to see how the speeds go, we are pretty close to the cabinet so hopeful it will end up close to max.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Thu 25-Jun-20 14:56:45
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
smile

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connection - Three B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up. 1+ 8 Pro max 80Mbps down, 24Mbps up.
=========================
To argue with a mindless bigot is foolish.
Standard User Oliver341
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 25-Jun-20 15:05:51
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Good to hear, I hope you're more popular in the household now!

Oliver.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Thu 25-Jun-20 15:11:27
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: Oliver341] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Oliver341:
Good to hear, I hope you're more popular in the household now!

I think so, the kids and their long faces have disappeared into their bedrooms.

No more "is it working yet?" smile

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Thu 25-Jun-20 20:30:26
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Good to hear it. Hope u enjoyed max speed 75/19

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Thu 25-Jun-20 22:57:32
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by adslmax:
Good to hear it. Hope u enjoyed max speed 75/19

Be nice, but I don't think the stats look promising.

Hub stats

Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 60.235 Mbps (presume that's sync?)
Maximum data rate:27.056 Mbps / 73.223 Mbps (what's this? theoretical max?)
Noise margin:16.0 / 6.3
Line attenuation:6.9 / 13.4
Signal attenuation:6.8 / 14.5

Speedtest is currently around 19 / 55Mb.

broadbandchecker.btwholesale.com says

VDSL Range A (Clean) 80 - 65.5 / 20 - 19 / 60
VDSL Range B (Impacted) 80 - 63.6 / 20 - 19 / 57.5

(down / up / handback)

Any improvement on 60 would be nice, but cab is approx. 250m away plus drop wire. Voice line back to exchange is probably around 6km. I'm guessing it's not going to get a lot better.

Huawei AIO cab serves a couple of dozen properties only. Will G.INP help in due course?

Another question, about the 'observed' figures on the broadbandchecker.btwholesale.com website. Are these accurate sync figures, as with ADSL? Neighbours lines I've looked at all seem to report 80/20.

Sorry, lots more info and lots more questions!

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Fri 26-Jun-20 00:15:10)

Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Thu 25-Jun-20 23:31:00
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Another question...

Is there anything to be gained by replacing the old BT LJU5/1A (twin outlet) master socket?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Fri 26-Jun-20 00:58:41
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
My stats before G.INP activated: (back in 2018)

DSLAM type / SW version: BDCM:0xa48c (164.140) / v0xa48c
Modem/router firmware: AnnexA version - A2pv6F039g1.d24m
DSL mode: VDSL2 Profile 17a
Status: Showtime

Downstream Upstream
Line attenuation (dB): 12.0 0.0
Signal attenuation (dB): Not available on VDSL2
Max speed (kbps): 80556 26797
Connection speed (kbps): 67526 19999
SNR margin (dB): 6.2 15.1
Power (dBm): 12.5 0.9
Interleave depth: 1321 1
INP: 3.00 0
G.INP: Not enabled Not enabled
Vectoring status: 5 (VECT_UNCONFIGURED)



My stats after G.INP activated: (2018)

DSLAM type / SW version: BDCM:0xa48c (164.140) / v0xa48c
Modem/router firmware: AnnexA version - A2pv6F039g1.d24m
DSL mode: VDSL2 Profile 17a
Status: Showtime

Downstream Upstream
Line attenuation (dB): 12.0 0.0
Signal attenuation (dB): Not available on VDSL2
Max speed (kbps): 82489 27617
Connection speed (kbps): 79999 19999
SNR margin (dB): 6.2 15.1
Power (dBm): 12.5 0.9
Interleave depth: 8 1
INP: 48.00 0
G.INP: Enabled Not enabled
Vectoring status: 5 (VECT_UNCONFIGURED)

My stats right now (2020)

DSLAM type / SW version: BDCM:0xa4a1 (164.161) / v0xa4a1
Modem/router firmware: AnnexA version - A2pvfbH043q.d26u
DSL mode: VDSL2 Profile 17a
Status: Showtime

Downstream Upstream
Line attenuation (dB): 11.9 0.0
Signal attenuation (dB): Not available on VDSL2
Max speed (kbps): 81206 23052
Connection speed (kbps): 79999 19999
SNR margin (dB): 5.7 14.6
Power (dBm): 12.4 1.4
Interleave depth: 16 1
INP: 48.00 0
G.INP: Enabled Not enabled
Vectoring status: 5 (VECT_UNCONFIGURED)

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014

Edited by adslmax (Fri 26-Jun-20 01:03:32)

Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Fri 26-Jun-20 03:39:33
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Leave the line synced.
Try not to reboot or disconnect the modem if possible for the 1st week.

DLM will apply G.INP in the next few days if you are on a Huawei cabinet, increasing your sync speed.

In the days/weeks following that if the line is stable then DLM will lower the SNRM to increase sync further.

The max attainable rate you see is inaccurate and artificially high as Interleaving is enabled.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Fri 26-Jun-20 08:30:21
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for that, I can see your sync improved considerably. Hopefully, I will see some improvement too.

This is all you can see on the Smart Hub 2 "Technical log" (current stats now)

DSL uptime:0 days,20 Hours24 Mins25 Secs
Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 60.235 Mbps
Maximum data rate:26.980 Mbps / 73.235 Mbps
Noise margin:15.9 / 6.3
Line attenuation:6.9 / 13.4
Signal attenuation:6.9 / 14.8
VLAN id:101
Upstream error control:Off
Downstream error control:Off

The rest of it is not relevent to the connection.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Fri 26-Jun-20 08:53:24)

Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Fri 26-Jun-20 08:42:43
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
Thanks John, more good info.

In reply to a post by j0hn83:
Leave the line synced.
Try not to reboot or disconnect the modem if possible for the 1st week.

I'm not touching anything for the next few weeks, let DLM do it's stuff.

Hopefully, no power cuts - we do get them occasionally out here in the sticks, fortunately rarely in summer.

I'm not sure how much it would affect FTTC, but the voice line back to the exchange is long. It is quiet though, at the moment - the lines are generally poor here, but I had a fault repaired on it a few months ago.

I was thinking about the LJU5 at some point in the future. It's an old one, double socket with the BT piper on it. Is there much to be gained by swapping it out for a NTE5A plus MK3 faceplate, or a NTE5C?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Fri 26-Jun-20 10:50:03
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Mine is Openreach MK4 faceplate for FTTC https://ibb.co/7pXNp6X

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Fri 26-Jun-20 10:53:12
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
Thanks for that, I can see your sync improved considerably. Hopefully, I will see some improvement too.

This is all you can see on the Smart Hub 2 "Technical log" (current stats now)

DSL uptime:0 days,20 Hours24 Mins25 Secs
Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 60.235 Mbps
Maximum data rate:26.980 Mbps / 73.235 Mbps
Noise margin:15.9 / 6.3
Line attenuation:6.9 / 13.4
Signal attenuation:6.9 / 14.8
VLAN id:101
Upstream error control:Off
Downstream error control:Off

The rest of it is not relevent to the connection.


Yeah best to leave it alone, let DLM do it own things first will apply G.INP if your fibre cabinet are huawei, after that, will try apply SNR at 5dB, 4dB and 3dB to stable your line for maximum max rate.

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Fri 26-Jun-20 13:26:29
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
Cab is an AIO, combined PCP/FTTC - Huawei according to codelook.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User jpm
(newbie) Fri 26-Jun-20 13:42:31
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
I think you'll end up very close to the full 80/20 once the 3dB target SnR is reached.
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Fri 26-Jun-20 14:04:12
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
Cab is an AIO, combined PCP/FTTC - Huawei according to codelook.


That's good to hear. Wait for G.INP then target SNR 3dB. Do not reboot or mess with hub router, let the DLM do it own things.

I am using Zyxel XMG 3927-B50A VDSL2/G.fast AC2400Mbps wireless router for my FTTC 80/20.

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Fri 26-Jun-20 14:05:10
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: jpm] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jpm:
I think you'll end up very close to the full 80/20 once the 3dB target SnR is reached.


Should be!

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Fri 26-Jun-20 19:12:37
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
Thanks all, that's made me a bit more hopeful smile

I'll keep thread updated if anything changes, I always find it useful to hear other people experiences.

To put to bed an earlier query, I can confirm that WLR line rental / BTw ADSL to BT retail FTTC did NOT produce any open orders on the BTw checker, in my case.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Fri 26-Jun-20 19:48:07
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Was told by openreach email that new dsl checker are no longer to show open order. Only the ISP can verify this to customer on BTw system. Meaning no chance for customer to check via new dsl checker anymore.

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sat 27-Jun-20 10:24:59
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
One other odd thing I noticed about the BTw checker.

After I ordered FTTC, the checker showed a new 'Last test date' of 10-06-2020, presumably an automated line check as part of the ordering process.

If I look now, that's gone - and the LTD has reverted back to the previous date 28-04-2020.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sun 28-Jun-20 13:30:20
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
Aaaaargh! POWER CUT! frown

Reconnected at 56Mb and SNR up to 7.6dB

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Sun 28-Jun-20 13:34:41
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
If it one off power cut (it won't affect DLM) best leave it alone but if the power cut kept going off and on continue. Power down modem and unplugged the socket until the power cut has restored fully solid then switch on modem.

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014

Edited by adslmax (Sun 28-Jun-20 13:35:35)

Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sun 28-Jun-20 14:52:38
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
After several failed automatic reconnection attempts, far too quick for the router to boot up, power came back up after about 10 minutes. Been okay since, wind seems to have dropped. Hope they haven't got any repairs to do, or it will be off again in the next few days.

You would think that the cab would ignore any disconnections whilst on backup power.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Sun 28-Jun-20 14:54:18)

Standard User TrevorSP
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 28-Jun-20 14:59:38
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
The wind is quite strong in our area of Essex too at the moment. The sea is hitting well over the normal doggie walk areas, not that I have a dog at the moment as I am having a rest between dogs.

I look after "End of Life" dogs, rather than them being in National Animal Welfare Trust kennels until they die, they come to me or a few other volunteers who look after them at home and we have been taught to look after them "medically wise" until the end.

It's a good idea as they don't end their days in kennels but at home and going for walks when they want, if they want etc. smile

Regards,
Trevor

BT 80/20 and Mobile phone package. Happy with both
"Aquila non capit muscas uel timet latrantem canem"
Standard User ian72
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 29-Jun-20 09:50:08
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
The kit in the cab may not know it is on backup power - there may be no signal connection between the battery and the equipment so as far as the equipment is concerned it has continuous power. Also, in many cases the end user equipment may be suffering a power cut but the cab may still be powered as it could well be on a different part of the grid unaffected by the power cut.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Mon 29-Jun-20 10:52:35
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: ian72] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ian72:
The kit in the cab may not know it is on backup power - there may be no signal connection between the battery and the equipment so as far as the equipment is concerned it has continuous power. Also, in many cases the end user equipment may be suffering a power cut but the cab may still be powered as it could well be on a different part of the grid unaffected by the power cut.

I'm not saying the cabinet does know that it's on backup power, just that's it's possible for it to be flagged - similar to a PC UPS triggering a soft shutdown in the case of a power cut.

In our case, the whole village went off during the power cut, but it's quite possible to lose smaller groups of supplies, or those connected to on one phase, for example. Perhaps the cab could spot multiple simultaneous line failures and flag it as an event... and not muck about with the DLM!

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User ian72
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 29-Jun-20 11:25:19
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
It's possible for it to be flagged but only if the hardware and software supports it - quite likely that this is costed out as it would add additional cost to the equipment that has relatively low gain for the supplier. It's also possible they have never even considered that it might be worthwhile doing so just haven't looked at even what it would cost to do it. For a server in a data centre a controlled power down before the power fails is critical to protect the server from data corruption - for a node in the DSL network it is much less critical from the suppliers perspective.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Mon 29-Jun-20 12:13:41
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: ian72] [link to this post]
 
To be honest, I would still be surprised if the battery backup was completely dumb. Surely a power failure is logged by the system, if only as a diagnostic aid... or even reported back to OR. Would be interesting if any OR engineers could confirm. I have plenty of experience with industrial control systems, but little with telecoms, beyond working on PABX many years ago.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User ian72
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 29-Jun-20 13:19:35
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
They may well log the power outages but might do it using an SNMP connection to the UPS rather than to the switch - still doesn't mean they have any direct connection between the DLM systems and the UPS logging. I don't disagree that it could be done but the work to make it happen and change the DLM system for it is likely to cost money. The fact they seem not to have done it either means they have never considered it or they don't consider the investment to be worth the results.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Mon 29-Jun-20 13:43:57
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: ian72] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ian72:
The fact they seem not to have done it either means they have never considered it or they don't consider the investment to be worth the results.

I don't disagree with that. Most aren't afflicted by power cuts like we are in the sticks, and it's sporadic at that. Add to that the fact that it only really affects those who are also in the clutches of DLM training, and that's not going to be many.

Perhaps I'm getting bored.

Even so, I have thought about one of the really cheap 12v UPS devices you can now buy that will supply 1A for an hour, just to maintain the router.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 30-Jun-20 09:12:22
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
Right, something's happened overnight,

DSL uptime:0 days,07 Hours56 Mins13 Secs
Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 70.688 Mbps
Maximum data rate:25.118 Mbps / 72.268 Mbps
Noise margin:15.0 / 6.1
Line attenuation:7.3 / 13.1
Signal attenuation:7.2 / 14.6
VLAN id:101
Upstream error control:Off
Downstream error control:Off

Down sync 60.2 >> 56 >> now 70.6Mb

Is that as a result of G.INP? SNR is back to 6.1 and things seem to be heading in the right direction.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Tue 30-Jun-20 09:28:05)

Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Tue 30-Jun-20 09:36:22
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Yes as it seem G.INP has added 10Mbps on your line now as this the max sync rate now. Next steps DLM is to tries lower SNR target 3dB as it might reduced 1dB as a time all the way down to 3dB from 6dB. As I think max sync rate could go up around 73-74 Meg for sync rate @ 3dB.

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014

Edited by adslmax (Tue 30-Jun-20 09:42:59)

Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Tue 30-Jun-20 09:39:25
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
Just to clarify, "next step is to see if DLM tries ....".

OP should not try anything except waiting smile.

__________________________________________________________
Sovereignty Means Sovereignty

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connection - Three B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up. 1+ 8 Pro max 80Mbps down, 24Mbps up.
=========================
To argue with a mindless bigot is foolish.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 30-Jun-20 12:33:52
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
Just to clarify, "next step is to see if DLM tries ....".

OP should not try anything except waiting smile.

Indeed, leaving well alone. I'm just praying for no more power cuts!

FWIW, neighbours on either side are at 80/20, according to the observed figures on the BTw checker. I know they have both had new NTEs fitted in the last 2 years, and one of them a new drop wire, in an attempt to cure line noise. I'm still on an old LJU5, but the quiet line test is good, after a repair by OR back in April for complete loss of dial tone - one leg down I think, as ADSL still functioned with crippled speeds.

I've also read a few anecdotes of a significant (10% or so) drop in sync when hubs were replaced by a SH2, which is what BT have issued me with. I think both the neighbours are still using HH6 hubs.

I might consider replacing the LJU at some point in the future, when everything has settled, see if it makes any difference.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Tue 30-Jun-20 12:49:57)

Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 30-Jun-20 15:35:35
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by adslmax:
Yes as it seem G.INP has added 10Mbps on your line now as this the max sync rate now. Next steps DLM is to tries lower SNR target 3dB as it might reduced 1dB as a time all the way down to 3dB from 6dB. As I think max sync rate could go up around 73-74 Meg for sync rate @ 3dB.


You think 3dB SNRM target drop will give them a 3-4Mb increase in sync?
You making that up in your head?
They might even get that from a drop to 5dB alone.

A drop to 3dB will see them hit 80Mb without a doubt.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 30-Jun-20 19:05:04
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by j0hn83:
A drop to 3dB will see them hit 80Mb without a doubt.

I hope you're right! smile

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Tue 30-Jun-20 19:20:17
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
In reply to a post by j0hn83:
A drop to 3dB will see them hit 80Mb without a doubt.

I hope you're right! smile


I be very surprise a large jump from 70Mbps to 80Mbps for an extra 3dB lower snr if it has happen (I think stick to 73-74Mbps)

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 30-Jun-20 20:16:48
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
Each 1dB is worth 3-4Mb on lines that make good use of the D3 band.

Any line syncing at 70Mb at 6dB SNRM is making good use of the D3 band.

He'll likely sync higher than 73Mb on the drop to 5dB.

My line goes from 35Mb at 6dB to 44Mb at 3dB and my line is too long to use all of the D3 band.

The higher the sync, the more sync increases with each 1dB of SNRM.

Don't worry Max I'll be here to say I told you so if his line drops to 3dB smile
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 30-Jun-20 20:38:38
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
Good info, thanks. I guess we'll find out who's right in due course wink

With regard to the SNR reducing to 3dB, is this likely to happen over the first two weeks, or are we talking over a longer period?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Tue 30-Jun-20 20:47:33)

Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Tue 30-Jun-20 22:16:30
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
Good info, thanks. I guess we'll find out who's right in due course wink

With regard to the SNR reducing to 3dB, is this likely to happen over the first two weeks, or are we talking over a longer period?


Sometimes days, sometimes weeks, sometimes never.

It's entirely dependant on how stable the line is and what stability DLM profile the ISP uses.

Ideally the line is left untouched (no rebooting the modem) and DLM make the changes in a few days.

Please keep the thread updated.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 30-Jun-20 22:47:20
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by j0hn83:
Please keep the thread updated.

I will, any movement will be reported here. I'm sure someone will find it interesting...

We could have a sweep on the final figure wink

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Tue 30-Jun-20 22:52:17
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
As John says, except it isn't quite that bad.

The initial drop from 6dB to 5dB can take a couple of weeks. My experience following that, on more that one occasion, is the subsequent 1dB drops (if justified) can occur after successive periods of 3-5 days.

__________________________________________________________
Sovereignty Means Sovereignty

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connection - Three B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up. 1+ 8 Pro max 80Mbps down, 24Mbps up.
=========================
To argue with a mindless bigot is foolish.
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Tue 30-Jun-20 23:05:52
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
My parents on FTTC 80/20 was sync at 56Meg at 6dB snr and then increase to 61Meg at 3dB (not much improvement) then soon later DLM decided to change their line due very bad crosstalk and over 500metres away drop their line to lower at 47Meg with snr 6.7dB. They actually downgraded to 40/10.

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014

Edited by adslmax (Tue 30-Jun-20 23:11:37)

Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Tue 30-Jun-20 23:11:05
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
Good info, thanks. I guess we'll find out who's right in due course wink

With regard to the SNR reducing to 3dB, is this likely to happen over the first two weeks, or are we talking over a longer period?


I remember my parents was on 6dB and G.INP enabled and it took 8 months for DLM to lower 3dB and stay there for few months then DLM say NO to 3dB and put their line back to 6.7dB with 47Meg. They had enough with FTTC 80/20 because their distance is over 500Metres away with Plusnet Hub One line attenuation at 15.7dB with badly crosstalk and downgraded to 40/10 FTTC.

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 30-Jun-20 23:50:46
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
I don't think crosstalk will be a major problem, there's only 20-odd properties on the cabinet, and some of those are still on ADSL, or phone line only.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User gary333
(committed) Wed 01-Jul-20 10:15:44
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
I thought cross talk happened in the main on the cable bundle going to the cabinet? Thus I would have expected cable density to be the underlying factor.

Totally on a side note, sorry. If each house has a 5 pair cable, do all 5 pairs go back to the cabinet or just to the DP?
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Wed 01-Jul-20 10:50:43
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: gary333] [link to this post]
 
All the voice lines here are the original EO lines. I don't think the bundle going back to the exchange will be enormous, there's only 500 or so on the exchange in total, and they fan out in all directions.

In reply to a post by gary333:
Totally on a side note, sorry. If each house has a 5 pair cable, do all 5 pairs go back to the cabinet or just to the DP?

No problem, it's all interesting stuff.

In our case, there are two pairs in the drop wire from the pole, I would think only a single pair goes back from the pole connection box from each property, plus redundant spares. How many spares, your guess is as good as mine.

For subscribers cables that go underground, I don't know if the same cable would go right back to the PCP, or do they use local underground connection boxes? Interesting stuff.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 01-Jul-20 21:10:19
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: gary333] [link to this post]
 
The UG feed cable from outside the property will go as far as the nearest joint ..
so maybe not even as far as the DP.

In later years the 5pr cable has been replaced by 2pr

Standard User gary333
(committed) Wed 01-Jul-20 23:48:59
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Zarjaz:
The UG feed cable from outside the property will go as far as the nearest joint ..
so maybe not even as far as the DP.

In later years the 5pr cable has been replaced by 2pr


Ooh, interesting stuff. What is the purpose of a joint in an underground scenario, is it just to reduce line lengths to more manageable chunks? Or are they just there in scenarios where they don’t know how many properties are going to be erected / the time the builder is going to take so it allows dig outs to be filled, or something else?

Are the number of cables per property available all the way back to the cabinet, or is the number cut down at joint or DP. For example in my case there are 12 properties on a DP all with 5 pair. Would all 60 pairs go back?
Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 02-Jul-20 05:19:07
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: gary333] [link to this post]
 
The purpose of a joint in this scenario is to provide flexibility.

No, copper was expensive. If there are twelve properties on the DP, it most likely has a twenty pair feed. Even then, it is quite possible that not all twenty pairs go back to the cab. Each scenario is different.

Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Thu 02-Jul-20 09:07:19
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
Today's update. Something's happened overnight...

NEW STATS

DSL uptime:0 days,07 Hours19 Mins44 Secs
Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 73.953 Mbps
Maximum data rate:23.637 Mbps / 75.851 Mbps
Noise margin:15.4 / 5.3
Line attenuation:7.2 / 13.1
Signal attenuation:7.1 / 14.5
VLAN id:101
Upstream error control:Off
Downstream error control:Off

PREVIOUS (DAY 5)

Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 70.688 Mbps
Maximum data rate:25.118 Mbps / 72.268 Mbps
Noise margin:15.0 / 6.1
Line attenuation:7.3 / 13.1
Signal attenuation:7.2 / 14.6


Looks like 5dB SNR to me. Story so far...

Day 0 - Activation
Day 3 - Power cut!
Day 5 - G.INP switched on
Day 7 - SNR 6 >>> 5dB

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Thu 02-Jul-20 09:19:15)

Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Thu 02-Jul-20 12:32:47
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
Today's update. Something's happened overnight...

NEW STATS

DSL uptime:0 days,07 Hours19 Mins44 Secs
Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 73.953 Mbps
Maximum data rate:23.637 Mbps / 75.851 Mbps
Noise margin:15.4 / 5.3
Line attenuation:7.2 / 13.1
Signal attenuation:7.1 / 14.5
VLAN id:101
Upstream error control:Off
Downstream error control:Off

PREVIOUS (DAY 5)

Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 70.688 Mbps
Maximum data rate:25.118 Mbps / 72.268 Mbps
Noise margin:15.0 / 6.1
Line attenuation:7.3 / 13.1
Signal attenuation:7.2 / 14.6


Looks like 5dB SNR to me. Story so far...

Day 0 - Activation
Day 3 - Power cut!
Day 5 - G.INP switched on
Day 7 - SNR 6 >>> 5dB


Look like your line are getting 80Meg soon. On your stats increase 3Mbps per 1dB snr reduced

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Thu 02-Jul-20 15:48:05
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by adslmax:
Look like your line are getting 80Meg soon. On your stats increase 3Mbps per 1dB snr reduced


But you said...

In reply to a post by adslmax:
I be very surprise a large jump from 70Mbps to 80Mbps for an extra 3dB lower snr if it has happen (I think stick to 73-74Mbps)


I did say that each 1dB is worth 3-4Mb on lines that make good use of the D3 band.
Any line syncing at 70Mb is making good use of the D3 band.

His sync increased by 3.3Mb with a 1dB drop in SNRM.
His line will reach 80Mb if it drops to 3dB.

You know better though smile
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Thu 02-Jul-20 18:49:50
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
How can you tell if band D3 are good or bad?

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sat 04-Jul-20 09:10:49
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Day 9, another resync...

NEW STATS

DSL uptime:0 days,06 Hours14 Mins18 Secs
Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 76.167 Mbps
Maximum data rate:23.804 Mbps / 77.710 Mbps
Noise margin:15.3 / 4.2
Line attenuation:7.2 / 13.1
Signal attenuation:7.2 / 14.7
VLAN id:101
Upstream error control:Off
Downstream error control:Off

PREVIOUS (DAY 7)

Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 73.953 Mbps
Maximum data rate:23.637 Mbps / 75.851 Mbps
Noise margin:15.4 / 5.3
Line attenuation:7.2 / 13.1
Signal attenuation:7.1 / 14.5

That's 4dB SNR, but a smaller improvement in sync this time. Will it make 80?

Day 0 - Activation (60.2 DL)
Day 3 - Power cut! (56.2)
Day 5 - G.INP switched on (70.1)
Day 7 - SNR 6 >>> 5dB (73.9)
Day 9 - SNR 5 >>> 4dB (76.1)

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Sat 04-Jul-20 09:47:33)

Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sat 04-Jul-20 19:02:58
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Just had final invoice from previous ADSL supplier, 30 day notice from order date, as expected...

and a £30+VAT cease fee mad

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sun 05-Jul-20 12:03:01
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
What's this cease fee all about? I've fired off an email to them, see what they say.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Sun 05-Jul-20 14:53:44
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
What's this cease fee all about? I've fired off an email to them, see what they say.


At no point in the thread have you said who the old provider was.

With some ISP's if the service is ceased rather than migrated there is a cease fee.
BT Wholesale pass this on to the ISP, some ISP's pass this to the customer, some absorb it.

There's likely nothing you can do about it.

Edited by j0hn83 (Sun 05-Jul-20 14:54:10)

Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sun 05-Jul-20 15:42:01
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by j0hn83:
At no point in the thread have you said who the old provider was.

With some ISP's if the service is ceased rather than migrated there is a cease fee.
BT Wholesale pass this on to the ISP, some ISP's pass this to the customer, some absorb it.

There's likely nothing you can do about it.

I did mention it was Eclipse (KCOM) back on switchover day. I didn't think it would be that important, as they are all BTw through our exchange.

Surely this is a migration, rather than a cease - BTw provider to BT?

Don't they have to tell you about this charge at some point?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Sun 05-Jul-20 15:57:26)

Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Sun 05-Jul-20 18:12:30
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Edit: my mistake, ignore.

https://business.kcom.com/media/175902/eclipse_terms...

It's in Kcom's t&C's (8.2) so unlikely they would waive this.

Most ISP's charge £30 when a cease applies.

Edited by j0hn83 (Sun 05-Jul-20 19:04:44)

Standard User Realalemadrid
(committed) Sun 05-Jul-20 18:57:41
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
No it isn't. It's a 80/20 FTTC service that the OP has migrated to.

Edited by Realalemadrid (Sun 05-Jul-20 18:59:02)

Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Sun 05-Jul-20 19:02:36
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: Realalemadrid] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Realalemadrid:
No it isn't. It's a FTTC service that the OP has migrated to.


Reading too many threads at once I think.

No idea what circumstances the cease should be applied in all honesty.

The likes of Plusnet and BT absorb the cease fee while others apply it on eBay and like a random basis on occasions.

It might be related to having a separate landline and broadband service?

Worth querying with Kcom considering it's btw to btw.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sun 05-Jul-20 21:02:31
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by j0hn83:
https://business.kcom.com/media/175902/eclipse_terms...

It's in Kcom's t&C's (8.2) so unlikely they would waive this.

Most ISP's charge £30 when a cease applies.

I'm pretty sure these T&C weren't in force when I signed up with Eclipse back in 2006.

Did the cease charges even exist back then? Wouldn't they have to notify me of any changes to T&C?


Surely, it should be a migration anyway? On changeover day, I received this email from KCOM

Subject: Migration notification - COMPLETED - 01777xxxxxx

Dear Paul,

We have completed the migration of 01777xxxxxx to your new supplier, please find the details of this service below:

Phone number:
Planned completion date:
Complete date:


In reply to a post by j0hn83:
Worth querying with Kcom considering it's btw to btw.

Have done so, got to be worth a try. Seems wrong to me.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Sun 05-Jul-20 21:22:16)

Standard User j0hn83
(fountain of knowledge) Sun 05-Jul-20 21:24:16
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
They definitely weren't in force in 2006.

The cease charges have existed for some time, they increased from roughly £5 to £30 around 2015 (BT Wholesale's charge).

Although you joined Eclipse back in 2006 any time you recontracted you accepted their updated t&c's. Unless you've been on a rolling contract for 10+ years.

They also don't specify the amount of the cease charge in the t&C's which doesn't help.

I recommend querying with them why a cease fee has been applied in this case as it appears to be a migration.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sun 05-Jul-20 21:42:10
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: j0hn83] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by j0hn83:
Although you joined Eclipse back in 2006 any time you recontracted you accepted their updated t&c's. Unless you've been on a rolling contract for 10+ years.

Never recontracted, never moved house, I've been on a rolling contract since the first 12 month contract ended in 2007.

What did happen a few years ago (2015?) was that they put everyone on legacy products onto equivalent current products - but no new T&C were issued or drawn attention to, I've checked the emails I had at the time. On my account, my 'out of contract' date still states 2007.

In any case, I think the strongest argument is that it's a migration, not a cease. I've emailed them as suggested, and queried the charge - we'll see what happens tomorrow.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Mon 06-Jul-20 08:55:02
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Day 11 and on cue, another resync...

NEW STATS

DSL uptime:0 days,07 Hours55 Mins11 Secs
Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 78.955 Mbps
Maximum data rate:23.804 Mbps / 80.580 Mbps
Noise margin:15.3 / 3.3
Line attenuation:7.3 / 13.0
Signal attenuation:7.2 / 14.5
VLAN id:101
Upstream error control:Off
Downstream error control:Off

PREVIOUS (DAY 9)

Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 76.167 Mbps
Maximum data rate:23.804 Mbps / 77.710 Mbps
Noise margin:15.3 / 4.2
Line attenuation:7.2 / 13.1
Signal attenuation:7.2 / 14.7


So, 3dB SNR and another small improvement in sync, almost 79Mb.

What exactly is the relevance of the "maximum data rate", that's now showing over 80Mb?


Day 0 - Activation (60.2 DL)
Day 3 - Power cut! (56.2)
Day 5 - G.INP switched on (70.1)
Day 7 - SNR 6 >>> 5dB (73.9)
Day 9 - SNR 5 >>> 4dB (76.1)
Day 11 - SNR 4 >>> 3dB (78.9)

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Mon 06-Jul-20 09:31:16
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Looking good now smile.

The maximum data rate there're is looking to me like there is a bit of crosstalk from other FTTC lines or some other form of noise between you and the cabinet, that is stopping you sync'ing at 79999.

Given you are only 1Mbps below that it's probably as good as you are going to get.

Theoretically, in a few days if DLM has decided it is stable at this speed, you could try a single re-sync well inside daylight hours as noise is usually a bit less than when it is dusk or dark. That's why the margin is 3.3 not 3, noise having decreased since the sync. It will probably go back down to 3 in the middle of the night, then rise again tomorrow.

That's what the margin is for. It sync's you a little below max attainable to allow for actual noise fluctuations without disconnecting, and also to keep error rates low.

I would leave well alone smile. You wouldn't notice another 1Mbps and it would be fractionally less stable.

__________________________________________________________
Sovereignty Means Sovereignty

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connection - Three B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up. 1+ 8 Pro max 80Mbps down, 24Mbps up.
=========================
To argue with a mindless bigot is foolish.
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Mon 06-Jul-20 09:48:30
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
Day 11 and on cue, another resync...

NEW STATS

DSL uptime:0 days,07 Hours55 Mins11 Secs
Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 78.955 Mbps
Maximum data rate:23.804 Mbps / 80.580 Mbps
Noise margin:15.3 / 3.3
Line attenuation:7.3 / 13.0
Signal attenuation:7.2 / 14.5
VLAN id:101
Upstream error control:Off
Downstream error control:Off

PREVIOUS (DAY 9)

Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 76.167 Mbps
Maximum data rate:23.804 Mbps / 77.710 Mbps
Noise margin:15.3 / 4.2
Line attenuation:7.2 / 13.1
Signal attenuation:7.2 / 14.7


So, 3dB SNR and another small improvement in sync, almost 79Mb.

What exactly is the relevance of the "maximum data rate", that's now showing over 80Mb?


Day 0 - Activation (60.2 DL)
Day 3 - Power cut! (56.2)
Day 5 - G.INP switched on (70.1)
Day 7 - SNR 6 >>> 5dB (73.9)
Day 9 - SNR 5 >>> 4dB (76.1)
Day 11 - SNR 4 >>> 3dB (78.9)


Unlucky not to have a magic 79999K as this the max sync rate due to crosstalk. U more likely to stay on 78955K unless someone go on holiday and will put u back on 79999K

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Mon 06-Jul-20 09:51:45
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
Just had final invoice from previous ADSL supplier, 30 day notice from order date, as expected...

and a £30+VAT cease fee mad


This is totally wrong from your ISP as u did migration over from your old isp to new isp. This cease fee is for the service to disconnected (no phone line, no broadband on the line, no migration) I would email them back to say this is error mistake on their end!

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Mon 06-Jul-20 09:58:48
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by RobertoS:
I would leave well alone smile. You wouldn't notice another 1Mbps and it would be fractionally less stable.

No, I'm more than happy with that, if things stay pretty much as they are.

To be honest, apart from the cockup on changeover day, it's all gone pretty smoothly. I think we can put the whole adventure down as a success.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Mon 06-Jul-20 10:00:28
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by adslmax:
This is totally wrong from your ISP as u did migration over from your old isp to new isp. This cease fee is for the service to disconnected (no phone line, no broadband on the line, no migration) I would email them back to say this is error mistake on their end!

I've had an automated acknowledgement from Eclipse, just waiting for a human to respond.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Mon 06-Jul-20 10:00:50)

Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Mon 06-Jul-20 10:05:20
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Wait for another week then try power down at 12:45pm for 31 minutes and powered it up at 1:16pm to see it come back at 79999K (sometimes it does the trick)

** FTTC must powered down for at least 30 minutes to avoid DLM trigger) once a day **

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014

Edited by adslmax (Mon 06-Jul-20 10:06:15)

Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Mon 06-Jul-20 11:08:28
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
I've had a reply from Eclipse, apologising for the error and a promise to credit the amount of the cease fee.

Fair enough, they replied quickly, admitted their mistake and resolved the matter. I'll keep an eye on this, but hopefully that will be the end of it.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Mon 06-Jul-20 13:41:07)

Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Mon 06-Jul-20 18:46:05
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
Strange, just had a re-sync.

NEW STATS

DSL uptime:0 days,00 Hours01 Mins14 Secs
Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 79.146 Mbps
Maximum data rate:24.510 Mbps / 79.944 Mbps
Noise margin:15.4 / 3.2
Line attenuation:7.3 / 13.2
Signal attenuation:7.3 / 14.7
VLAN id:101
Upstream error control:Off
Downstream error control:Off


Sync more or less same, max data rate now just below 80Mb.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Mon 06-Jul-20 18:51:54
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
DLM wouldn't do this at this time of the evening. Look like you are force it to re sync yourself
.

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Mon 06-Jul-20 19:17:53
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by adslmax:
DLM wouldn't do this at this time of the evening. Look like you are force it to re sync yourself
.

Not guilty, nothing to do with me.

Lost internet, hub flashing orange, orange steady, then back to solid blue and all back up.

Nothing on event log before 18.42PM, so looks like a hub reboot?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Mon 06-Jul-20 20:25:20)

Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Tue 07-Jul-20 00:16:14
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Ah! Apparently they do a re-sync every fortnight! To do with BT itself, not the Openreach DLM. 😧

That might be it. You'll find loads of posts around with a bit of browsing in the BT ISP Forum here.

__________________________________________________________
Sovereignty Means Sovereignty

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connection - Three B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up. 1+ 8 Pro max 80Mbps down, 24Mbps up.
=========================
To argue with a mindless bigot is foolish.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 07-Jul-20 08:50:38
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Could be.

I checked the hub again this morning, and although the event log only starts from the time of the re-sync, I found system uptime on another page, and that's still showing 8+ days... that's back to the time of the power cut we had, so it couldn't have been a full reboot.

Anyway, still connected at 79.146 down, and all seems well.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Tue 07-Jul-20 13:41:03
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
software version could be updated? Does your BT Hub showing CRC & ES errors count?

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014

Edited by adslmax (Tue 07-Jul-20 13:42:37)

Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 07-Jul-20 16:31:18
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by adslmax:
software version could be updated? Does your BT Hub showing CRC & ES errors count?

Don't think it's a software update. The "Technical Log" page, which doesn't get too technical, says

Firmware version: v0.15.00.06145-BT
Firmware updated: unknown

Not sure what the latest version is, but I guess the second entry would show a date if it had updated.

No error counts that I can see, technical info from this router is a bit limited.


I'm happy, so long as it doesn't make a habit of it wink

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Tue 07-Jul-20 16:40:49
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Sometimes SNR at very low at 3dB can caused more CRC and ES errors. Only DLM will collect it every midnight. Hope your line errors is low, if it was too high then DLM might act the next step to move SNR up by 1Mbps each step as a time until there is no errors on the line.

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 07-Jul-20 16:47:21
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
If it is that, I'd sooner have stable than a few extra Mbs.

See how it goes.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Wed 08-Jul-20 09:12:09
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Interesting, day 13 and another night time resync around 1.05am. Not much appears to have changed.

NEW STATS

DSL uptime:0 days,07 Hours54 Mins38 Secs
Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 79.241 Mbps
Maximum data rate:24.019 Mbps / 80.245 Mbps
Noise margin:15.2 / 3.3
Line attenuation:7.3 / 13.0
Signal attenuation:7.2 / 14.4
VLAN id:101
Upstream error control:Off
Downstream error control:Off


Eclipse have credited my account with the cost of the cease fee, so all good there.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Wed 08-Jul-20 11:17:14
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Maximum data rate:24.019 Mbps / 80.245 Mbps

Line attenuation:7.3 / 13.0

That's pretty good for max rate 80Mbps for line attenuation

Mine below:

xdslctl info --stats
xdslctl: ADSL driver and PHY status
Status: Showtime
Last Retrain Reason: 0
Last initialization procedure status: 0
Max: Upstream rate = 24514 Kbps, Downstream rate = 82673 Kbps
Bearer: 0, Upstream rate = 19999 Kbps, Downstream rate = 79999 Kbps
Bearer: 1, Upstream rate = 0 Kbps, Downstream rate = 0 Kbps
Link Power State: L0
Mode: VDSL2 Annex B
VDSL2 Profile: Profile 17a
TPS-TC: PTM Mode(0x0)
Trellis: U:ON /D:ON
Line Status: No Defect
Training Status: Showtime
Down Up
SNR (dB): 5.9 14.5
Attn(dB): 11.8 0.0
Pwr(dBm): 12.5 1.7
Interleave depth: 16 1
INP: 48.00 0
G.INP: Enabled Not enabled
Vectoring status: 5 (VECT_UNCONFIGURED)

Bearer 0
INP: 48.00 0.00
INPRein: 0.00 0.00
delay: 0 0
PER: 0.00 3.98
OR: 0.01 64.22
AgR: 80614.82 20063.54

Bearer 1
INP: 4.00 0.00
INPRein: 4.00 0.00
delay: 3 0
PER: 16.06 0.01
OR: 95.62 0.01
AgR: 95.62 0.01

Bitswap: 18/18 11/11

Since Link time = 7 days 8 hours 47 min 21 sec
FEC: 7853 1290
CRC: 0 446
ES: 0 349
SES: 0 0
UAS: 0 0
LOS: 0 0
LOF: 0 0
LOM: 0 0
Retr: 0
HostInitRetr: 0
FastRetr: 0
FailedRetr: 0
FailedFastRetr: 0

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Mon 13-Jul-20 08:52:41
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Hub firmware update and resync overnight

PREVIOUS

Firmware version: v0.15.00.06145-BT
Firmware updated: unknown

NEW

Firmware version:v0.17.01.12312-BT
Firmware updated:Mon Jul 13 01:05:40 2020
Board version:R01
GUI version:1.56 15_02_2019
DSL uptime:0 days,06 Hours25 Mins56 Secs
Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 79.195 Mbps
Maximum data rate:23.641 Mbps / 80.024 Mbps
Noise margin:15.0 / 3.1
Line attenuation:7.2 / 13.0
Signal attenuation:7.2 / 14.6
VLAN id:101
Upstream error control:Off
Downstream error control:Off


Everything looks settled on the sync front, around 79.2Mb @ 3dB.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Mon 13-Jul-20 09:01:49)

Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sun 19-Jul-20 11:06:19
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Several days ago, thinking it would be fairly safe to do so now after 3 weeks activated, I needed to unplug the router to re-route a few cables.

NEW STATS

Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 79.998 Mbps
Maximum data rate:24.055 Mbps / 81.213 Mbps
Noise margin:15.2 / 3.3
Line attenuation:7.2 / 13.1
Signal attenuation:7.2 / 14.7
VLAN id:101
Upstream error control:Off
Downstream error control:Off

Connection has been rock solid at 80/20, no disconnects, SNR drifts between 3.2 - 3.4.

Happy days! smile

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sun 19-Jul-20 11:21:20
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Excellent.

Sorting out cables could be what improved it.

__________________________________________________________
Sovereignty Means Sovereignty

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connection - Three B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up. 1+ 8 Pro max 80Mbps down, 24Mbps up.
=========================
To argue with a mindless bigot is foolish.
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Mon 20-Jul-20 03:01:27
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Pretty good stats as re-route short cable does make a lots difference! Now enjoy your full 80/20 for long while!

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Mon 20-Jul-20 10:54:23
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by adslmax:
Pretty good stats as re-route short cable does make a lots difference! Now enjoy your full 80/20 for long while!
Lots of short cables can make things worse. Particularly if mains power and signal cables are parallel and very close to each other.

__________________________________________________________
Sovereignty Means Sovereignty

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connection - Three B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up. 1+ 8 Pro max 80Mbps down, 24Mbps up.
=========================
To argue with a mindless bigot is foolish.
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Mon 20-Jul-20 11:57:14
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
I thought short cable from master socket to modem will be better overall line attenuation with max data rate? Longest cable will reduced data rate speed.

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Mon 20-Jul-20 22:01:40
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
No change to any cables, just a bit of untangling. I moved the position of the router a bit when I changed over to the BT hub, and plugged it in where it wouldn't be inadvertently switched off. Some of the cables needed sorting out.

SNR has drifted down to 3dB over the last couple of days, but still seems solid enough.

BT sent me a message yesterday confirming the £100 reward card was being posted out, I had to contact them on the community forum to get that sorted out. £25.50 cashback on TCB confirmed today too. It's all rolling in... cool

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User broadband66
(knowledge is power) Tue 21-Jul-20 17:49:33
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
Depends on cable type.

Was Eclipse Home Option 1, VM 2Mb & O2 Standard
Now Utility Warehouse (up to 16mbps) via Talk Talk
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sat 25-Jul-20 19:40:08
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
After 10+ days of rock solid connection, just had a momentary power cut... which has dropped sync to 76.496Mbps and upped margin to 4.1dB. frown

I might look into one of those 12V mini-UPS blocks.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sat 25-Jul-20 23:58:49
Print Post

Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
It should auto-correct back to ~3dB in two days. Maybe even Sunday night. Don't mess wink smile.

__________________________________________________________
Sovereignty Means Sovereignty

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connection - Three B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up. 1+ 8 Pro max 80Mbps down, 24Mbps up.
=========================
To argue with a mindless bigot is foolish.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sun 26-Jul-20 10:24:58
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Fingers crossed, leaving well alone.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sun 26-Jul-20 20:37:52
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Been out this afternoon, just got back in to find it's re-synced at around 7.15PM, back to 3dB and 79Mb.

I make that about 24 hours (and 15 mins) since power cut?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Sun 26-Jul-20 23:40:08
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
😉

__________________________________________________________
Sovereignty Means Sovereignty

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connection - Three B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up. 1+ 8 Pro max 80Mbps down, 24Mbps up.
=========================
To argue with a mindless bigot is foolish.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Thu 30-Jul-20 08:17:05
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Another damn power cut again this morning, resynced again at 80/20, but look at the noise margins?

DSL uptime:0 days,00 Hours28 Mins41 Secs
Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 79.999 Mbps
Maximum data rate:25.239 Mbps / 80.946 Mbps
Noise margin:9.2 / 2.3
Line attenuation:7.2 / 13.1
Signal attenuation:7.2 / 14.5
VLAN id:101
Upstream error control:Off
Downstream error control:Off

What's going on there? Why has it dropped the margin that low?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User Realalemadrid
(committed) Thu 30-Jul-20 08:44:15
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
This is typical when there is an area power cut, my HG612 does the same it syncs at 3dB at 80Mbps downstream then other modems come back up and increase the noise and crosstalk, so reducing the SNRM, mine has been running at 1.6dB for the last 9 days with no errors on the downstream. If I resync it will not achieve 80Mpbs but a bit lower.
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Thu 30-Jul-20 11:13:10
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: Realalemadrid] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Realalemadrid:
This is typical when there is an area power cut, my HG612 does the same it syncs at 3dB at 80Mbps downstream then other modems come back up and increase the noise and crosstalk, so reducing the SNRM, mine has been running at 1.6dB for the last 9 days with no errors on the downstream. If I resync it will not achieve 80Mpbs but a bit lower.

Ah yes, that makes sense. Thanks!

When we have these power cuts, I notice that our Smart Hub 2 and another one locally are the first two routers in range that fire up a wifi signal, so I guess they're the quickest booting. All the other assortment of routers follow shortly after.

You can tell the Smart Hub 2s as the access point is BT-nnXXXX, rather than BTHub6-XXXX

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Fri 31-Jul-20 13:09:13
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Aaaargh! Another power cut....

DSL uptime:0 days,00 Hours34 Mins29 Secs
Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 75.911 Mbps
Maximum data rate:25.071 Mbps / 81.247 Mbps
Noise margin:14.5 / 4.1
Line attenuation:7.0 / 13.5

Getting a bit fed up with this power outage business now, I'm getting onto the DNO.

edit: They've been working on an HV fault, unconnected to the blips we've had over the last few weeks. I've never known so many power cuts as we've had in the last month or two!

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC

Edited by sparky_paul (Fri 31-Jul-20 13:16:01)

Standard User JonRennie
(knowledge is power) Fri 31-Jul-20 13:31:39
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
I have one of these for my ONT - lasts for a couple of hours if required,

12V UPS

wink Comms is hard wink
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Fri 31-Jul-20 15:25:27
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: JonRennie] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by JonRennie:
I have one of these for my ONT - lasts for a couple of hours if required,

12V UPS

That's the sort of thing I need, I was looking at a cheaper, smaller version which would probably do.

The power only goes off for a few seconds normally!

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User awontroba
(member) Sat 01-Aug-20 04:48:40
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Have you considered a UPS for all your computer equipment?
Loss of power can cause file system damage and lost or corrupted files.
Bouncing power can fry equipment.

--
Adrian
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Sat 01-Aug-20 09:18:04
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: awontroba] [link to this post]
 
Actually, that might not be a bad idea at all.

I did run a UPS years ago when I had a desktop running 24/7, set up to shut the PC down on a power outage. Laptops and phones aren't going to suffer, but the lad uses a desktop PC, and I often think it can't do the hard drives in the TV boxes any favours either... and then there's the NAS box... Hmmm...

To be honest, this current run of power blips is not usual, we must have had more than half a dozen outages in the last 3 months - probably more than in the last 5-10 years. It's usually only in severe weather that we have problems.

I'll give it some thought.

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 04-Aug-20 08:52:49
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Four days now, still stuck at 4dB frown

Data rate:19.999 Mbps / 75.911 Mbps
Maximum data rate:26.037 Mbps / 80.869 Mbps
Noise margin:15.2 / 4.3
Line attenuation:7.0 / 13.5
Signal attenuation:6.9 / 14.4


<insert expletive> power cuts!

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User adslmax
(knowledge is power) Tue 04-Aug-20 14:06:49
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
You need to sort out the power cut issues otherwise DLM will capped your line such as banded line pretty soon.

PN FTTC 80/20 since 2014
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Tue 04-Aug-20 17:08:56
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: adslmax] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by adslmax:
You need to sort out the power cut issues otherwise DLM will capped your line such as banded line pretty soon.

There's not much I can do about it, apart from a UPS

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User busterboy
(committed) Tue 04-Aug-20 18:45:37
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by sparky_paul:
There's not much I can do about it, apart from a UPS


Simple fix then Paul. wink

BTBroadband
Standard User sparky_paul
(experienced) Mon 10-Aug-20 19:34:14
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
Still stuck on 4+dB, 10 days on. What's the chances of it resetting back to 3dB now?

>>> BTFibre 2 FTTC
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Mon 10-Aug-20 21:53:07
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Re: BT/Openreach migration gateway


[re: sparky_paul] [link to this post]
 
It can be quite a while. A month is not uncommon.

__________________________________________________________
Sovereignty Means Sovereignty

My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, sites and mail hosting - Tsohost & Ionos.
Connection - Three B311 4G, tbb tests normally 35-45Mpbs down, 65Mbps off-peak, 9-24 up. 1+ 8 Pro max 80Mbps down, 24Mbps up.
=========================
To argue with a mindless bigot is foolish.
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