so which one?

i thought i may have been able to get a Mac mini from work, we get a 15% discount for 5 days after pay day, and 10% any other time, but the only new Mac mini they are selling is the basic M2 one, so not really any good for me.
I can get 6% off via a scheme my employer have signed up to.

so the choice is a Mac mini M2 pro or the normal M2 with 16GB of ram and 512GB of storage

The pro looks nice, but costs a lot more and while it is more powerful, do I really need it? I want to do a bit of video editing when I get back into it, some photo editing and maybe a bit of 3D rendering with Blender, when I can work out how to use it.
My idea is to get a dock that fits under the Mac for extra ports, SD card slot and space for a SSD.


I have also found out via a Mac owner, that to use bluetooth on a Mac it has to be set up, so my keyboard will not connect right away, I will have to use the dongle, but bit of a pain.

Another thing is, my monitor has a built usb hub, 4 usb ports on it, now if I get a USB switch like this one, I presume I could connect the cable from the monitor to it and then i can switch the ports from the monitor between both computers. The ports are only used for dongles and my scanner,

A Mac that has no USB keyboard connected and no Bluetooth keyboard parried will automatically pair and connect to a Bluetooth keyboard (and mouse).

In reply to a post by TinyMongomery:

A Mac that has no USB keyboard connected and no Bluetooth keyboard parried will automatically pair and connect to a Bluetooth keyboard (and mouse).

oh right, that is good to hear, thanks, I heard that it will only pair to Apple's own keyboard and mouse.

It can be a bit temperamental with non-Apple kit at setup (fine thereafter). If you have a cheap wired mouse and keyboard you could use for the set up, then pair the MAK that would cover the bases.

Be aware that Logitech's software remains...er...quirky.

In reply to a post by ian_c:

It can be a bit temperamental with non-Apple kit at setup (fine thereafter). If you have a cheap wired mouse and keyboard you could use for the set up, then pair the MAK that would cover the bases.

Be aware that Logitech's software remains...er...quirky.

I notice Logitech can be quirky, most of the time it is in the back round, but when I do bring it to the foreground it can play up.

Still trying to work out which one to go for, I think I may go for the non-pro version, but with 16GB or ram and 512GB of storage, people on YouTube are using it for video editing on far larger projects that I will ever do and it manages. The money I save can then go for a dock and extra storage, it is still going to be better than this machine I am using now.

You won't need the pro one, the 16GB machine is very capable.

I've got a 32GB M1 Max and it is total overkill for just about anything I might do with it. My 8GB M1 can do almost as well for most people's workload.

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

You won't need the pro one, the 16GB machine is very capable.

I've got a 32GB M1 Max and it is total overkill for just about anything I might do with it. My 8GB M1 can do almost as well for most people's workload.

But what do you do?

I would not go for 8GB, 16GB is the minimum, I got to do some more research

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

You won't need the pro one, the 16GB machine is very capable.

I've got a 32GB M1 Max and it is total overkill for just about anything I might do with it. My 8GB M1 can do almost as well for most people's workload.

But what do you do?

I would not go for 8GB, 16GB is the minimum, I got to do some more research

I tend to buy the highest spec. (within reason) and "sweat the asset' as the yanks would say. Has worked well for all my apple purchases the last 20 years or so.

[That's just my personal tendency though before I get piled on 😂 C'mon then...🤣]

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

I tend to buy the highest spec. (within reason) and "sweat the asset' as the yanks would say. Has worked well for all my apple purchases the last 20 years or so.

[That's just my personal tendency though before I get piled on 😂 C'mon then...🤣]

LOL,

If I was going for the highest spec I would go for the studio, it seems a very powerful machine, but far more than what I need. I am still shocked how much better in benchmarks the M2 is to my Tower. I suppose technology moves on, my machine is over 4 years old now, maybe 5. I may have a look at benchmarks on different AMD processors. I know benchmarks are just that, benchmarks, but it would be interesting to see how the newer version of the R7 does against my machine and the Mac m2.

My other half said to me for god’s sake, get on with it. Get one now. But it is ok for her, she earns nearly 40 grand a year

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

I would not go for 8GB, 16GB is the minimum, I got to do some more research

With Apple Silicon and the way macOS manages memory, you might find you can do in 8GB what you need 16 or 32 GB on Windows or Linux.

If you're working with super large files (RAW photos, or 4K/8K video) have a look at some of the disk performance metrics for the different SoC (System on Chip) as the way the storage is integrated with the CPU is similar to mobile phones rather than previous computer designs. (My 8GB RAM M1 Mac Mini is fast, its about the speed of my slower M.2 SSD in the windows laptop).

Haha. Not that high! I’ve got no reason to run a Studio. My M1 Max MacBook is more than ample for a long while.

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

I am still shocked how much better in benchmarks the M2 is to my Tower. I suppose technology moves on, my machine is over 4 years old now, maybe 5.

Take with a pinch of salt, but along the lines of what you were saying...

https://youtu.be/j9mAGHAtLkg

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

Take with a pinch of salt, but along the lines of what you were saying...

https://youtu.be/j9mAGHAtLkg

Geekbench the M2 is a lot faster than my Ryzen 7 1700, but the cinebench scores not so much, 8610 for the M2 and for my machine 7972. I found a site that compares scores

https://nanoreview.net/en/cpu-compare/apple-m2-vs-am...

But as you said, take benchmarks with a pinch of salt.

It is amazing how technology have changed over the years, My Ryzen is around five years old, has to be, maybe a bit older. To be honest, it has been a good workhouse and is the longest I have had a PC without updating it. The sound card went belly up on it last night, but that is a lot older, i think the pre amp may have gone, so I have to use the on board sound now.

It is difficult to know what to do, I feel i need a change from windows and while I would love to go to Linux full time that is really not a option, so Mac OS is the next thing, if I could run MAc os on a PC that would be ideal. I know there are ways, but it can be a pain.
My original plan was to get a Mac laptop and then connect it up to the monitor and keyboard, but I hate laptops,

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

It is amazing how technology have changed over the years, My Ryzen is around five years old, has to be, maybe a bit older. To be honest, it has been a good workhouse and is the longest I have had a PC without updating it. The sound card went belly up on it last night, but that is a lot older, i think the pre amp may have gone, so I have to use the on board sound now.

I just replaced a 7 year old tower (i7 4th generation / 16GB RAM / SATA3 SSD) with a new i7 tower (i7 12th Gen / 16 GB RAM / M.2 PCIe 4x SSD). This machine benchtests on CPU about the same as the M1 Mac Mini or an Air laptop. Graphics is different though.

Many of my colleagues at work whom have moved from Mac Intel CPU machines to Mac with Apple Silicon love the speed and the instant on/off (like a tablet or phone) for the laptops…. But many of us are in software development and document production jobs (MS Word, VSCode etc etc).

I think the Mac is really best for what you are talking about, graphic work, photo and video. Its okay as a platform for software development, but you can’t easily take a compiled program and run it on a Linux server in the cloud (as you could with an Intel mac).

So longer term I can see plenty of Mac’s being sold by Apple, but more so into the YouTube or Graphics world… and why most US universities filled themselves with Apple computers in the late 80s and 1990s. What happens in corporate is unknown… as so many of my colleagues need occasional access to Windows.

I played with a Surface Pro laptop with 12th gen i5 CPU, and in responsiveness its so close to the Macbook air M1 that I don’t think most people would notice. Not as good benchmarks, but the battery life is very close…. So its not yet “game set and match” to Apple. Its all for Intel and AMD to lose !

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

You won't need the pro one, the 16GB machine is very capable.

I've got a 32GB M1 Max and it is total overkill for just about anything I might do with it. My 8GB M1 can do almost as well for most people's workload.

But what do you do?

I would not go for 8GB, 16GB is the minimum, I got to do some more research

I did not recommend you went for 16GB. When I said the 8GB machine can do almost as well as my 32GB Max "for most people" I was using "most people" in the broadest possible way. Most people use their Macs to surf the web, edit some documents, send some emails and look at their photos.

And for them the 8GB machine will work really, really well.

From what you've said about getting a Mac over the months, I don't think you're most people, hence I didn't recommend the 8GB. But did suggest the 16GB would be good enough and it was unlikely you'd need the Pro.

I used the 8GB M1 Mac mini for six months for:

- Final Cut video editing (including a multi camera 40 minute long video of a friend's wedding)
- All my photo editing/management
- My daily work tasks as a software developer (Javascript, c# and a bit of Swift iOS development)
- Running Teams, Word, Excel for all the dull bits of software development

It didn't cause me any problems running that workload, it was fast and snappy, the fan rarely ever span up. It was much, much faster than the four core i5 2.5 GHz 16GB Intel MacBook I was coming from.

So I'm not claiming everyone should buy an 8GB machine, but for many, many people it can do everything they need to pretty much as fast as a 16GB model. And the 16GB model is 30% more expensive than the 8GB.

As someone else pointed out, thanks to the different architecture, 8GB on Apple silicon feels very different to 8GB of an Intel Mac or a Windows PC.

In reply to a post by jchamier:

So longer term I can see plenty of Mac’s being sold by Apple, but more so into the YouTube or Graphics world… and why most US universities filled themselves with Apple computers in the late 80s and 1990s. What happens in corporate is unknown… as so many of my colleagues need occasional access to Windows.

The lack of the ability to run x86 Windows is the only downside of of my M1Max MacBook Pro. I've got round the issue by having an Azure virtual machine for when I need do to stuff that I absolutely need Windows for.

Longer term, if Microsoft continues to put effort into ARM Windows (including making the licensing on Mac hardware more official) then it will probably become a non issue for quite a few people who currently need to use Windows from a Mac.

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

(including making the licensing on Mac hardware more official)

Assuming MS don't have an exclusive contract with Qualcomm over ARM windows, which is what many suggest is the reason for the hold. At the moment no company with lawyers can use this. Home users can get away with the Insider builds (using any of the free or paid virtualisation tools).

But ARM Windows still isn't binary compatible with x86 cloud (even Containers).

I know you did not recommend going for the 16GB one, but for stuff I want to do with it, I think it is best. I don't think I am going to go for a pro, 16GB of ram and 512Gb of drive, as I said before I can get a dock to put extra storage in, but you can't expand the ram

I know I have been on about going for a MAc for a while, buit I was waiting to see what new one Apple would bring out and that is what they have done.
I still not sure what to do, someone said I should get a MacBook then I could use that for for portable stuff as well, but I don't like laptops.
The thing is I don't want to spend a load of money as I may not like Mac Os and want to go back to Windows I can't see it myself, but you never know.

I like final cut, but for what I want it is too expensive, if I made a living out of it then fine. I think I will be using da Vinci, it seems like they have produced a Apple Silicon version.
I will buy the MAc version of Affinity photo as I am used to it on Windows.

A 8GB machine is fine for people who just want to browse, maybe do a little bit for video editing from their phone, do some office stuff and that sort of thing.

Thanks for the help, i think you have helped me to almost make up my mind

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

I know you did not recommend going for the 16GB one, but for stuff I want to do with it, I think it is best. I don't think I am going to go for a pro, 16GB of ram and 512Gb of drive, as I said before I can get a dock to put extra storage in, but you can't expand the ram

Can you please go back and read what I wrote in my two comments. I was recommending you get the 16GB one.

And yes, Da Vinci is a great option (free version limited to max 4K 60fps video). They have consistently supported new Apple hardware just as quickly as Apple have with Final Cut (in contrast to Adobe with Premier).

The other thing to bear in mind is the Pro goes extra TB4 ports and HDMI 2.1.

A usefukl general prinicple is to buy the best machine you can afford.

In reply to a post by jchamier:

But ARM Windows still isn't binary compatible with x86 cloud (even Containers).

No, but it can at least run some x86 apps via Microsoft x86-ARM translation tech, which is what a lot of people reaching for Windows when they have a Mac need.

In reply to a post by ian_c:

The other thing to bear in mind is the Pro goes extra TB4 ports and HDMI 2.1.

A usefukl general prinicple is to buy the best machine you can afford.

You, you, you

I just about made up my mind, and you come out with this

You are right, but it is a lot of money to spend if I decide I can't get on with Mac OS, If i spend that amount i would have to make myself get on with it.

I have the money I have saved up £1,338 in the account I set up for a computer update and I can grab some out of my other saving if need be.
But the basic pro is £1,399, that is a fair bit of money for a computer to be honest, more than I have ever spent on one.

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

No, but it can at least run some x86 apps via Microsoft x86-ARM translation tech, which is what a lot of people reaching for Windows when they have a Mac need.

Yep, and I've played with a Surface Pro 5G (Qualcomm CPU) and it is pretty good... not as fast as M1 with Rosetta, but Qualcomm are working on it

Used Mac hold their price pretty well, so you can always sell it if you don’t like it. But it’s like buying a guitar - buy the best that you can afford and you’re more likely to use it and using it will be a more pleasant experience.

In reply to a post by TinyMongomery:

Used Mac hold their price pretty well, so you can always sell it if you don’t like it. But it’s like buying a guitar - buy the best that you can afford and you’re more likely to use it and using it will be a more pleasant experience.

I had a thought about it last night and this morning in bed and I am pretty sure I am going for the M2, but with 512GB of storage and 16GB of ram. I doubt I will go any higher monitor wise than I am, it is a good monitor for what I do with it, cost me enough at the time, I may add another one at some point and then this one can become the second one. It seems to be the best balance for use and price. I have looked at a load of videos and people seem to do video editing and stuff on even the basic one.

To buy it from Apple I need an Apple I.D, they got you before you started, Apple is the only way I can get the discount. I suppose it is like an account on other sites you buy from.

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

To buy it from Apple I need an Apple I.D, they got you before you started, Apple is the only way I can get the discount. I suppose it is like an account on other sites you buy from.

You will need an Apple ID to set up MacOS anyway, and you will need it to update the free apps from the Mac App Store. (e.g. Pages/Keynote/Garageband etc).

You can use any email address (set up a new one perhaps?), and think of it the same as Amazon, or Argos or any other website you buy from online.

In reply to a post by jchamier:

You will need an Apple ID to set up MacOS anyway, and you will need it to update the free apps from the Mac App Store. (e.g. Pages/Keynote/Garageband etc).

You can use any email address (set up a new one perhaps?), and think of it the same as Amazon, or Argos or any other website you buy from online.

According to a friend, a Apple ID is not required to set up Mac Os and there are ways to get updates without an Apple ID, she does it on her Mac pro and have done for a few years. She does have an Apple ID for her mac book pro.

Anyway, I have now got a Apple ID,
one of the reasons I am going from windows is because of this pushing of an MS account.

In reply to a post by zyborg47:

one of the reasons I am going from windows is because of this pushing of an MS account.

Ahh, my Mac's since 2010 have needed an Apple ID, so its actually newer on Windows than Mac.

Apple, Microsoft, Android, all recommend a cloud login. You can set up Win11 Pro without (Home is a pain) and many corporates use Win11 without cloud login.

The reason for the login is for those whom aren't confident about computers to offer services such as auto backup (iCloud Drive, OneDrive) and more secure login (e.g. via Windows Hello) than basic passwords. Soon everyone will use passkeys.

You can update the OS without an Apple ID but, as far as I know, there is no way to update applications (or install new ones from the App Store) without an ID. Mac OS is far more restrictive in this respect than Windows.

To my mind you lose a huge amount of functionality in either Mac OS or Windows if you don’t have one of their accounts.

In reply to a post by TinyMongomery:

You can update the OS without an Apple ID but, as far as I know, there is no way to update applications (or install new ones from the App Store) without an ID. Mac OS is far more restrictive in this respect than Windows.

This is what we find in corporate, if end users don't set up an Apple ID they get the out-of-the-box free apps (Page/Keynote/Garageband etc) but they don't get the security patches and functionality updates, neither can users download free utilities such as the MS remote desktop app or other tools.

In reply to a post by jchamier:

Ahh, my Mac's since 2010 have needed an Apple ID, so its actually newer on Windows than Mac.

Windows 8 was the first Windows to require an account, so yes a couple of years after your Mac, Took ages to find a way to get around it on Windows 8, I did at that point have a hotmail account for some reason.

Apple, Microsoft, Android, all recommend a cloud login. You can set up Win11 Pro without (Home is a pain) and many corporates use Win11 without cloud login.

Windows 10 took away the forced MS account and now they bring it back, never understand why they are forcing it on home versions and even pro versions of Windows 11. Even Apple don't force their Apple ID

The reason for the login is for those whom aren't confident about computers to offer services such as auto backup (iCloud Drive, OneDrive) and more secure login (e.g. via Windows Hello) than basic passwords. Soon everyone will use passkeys.

I don't agree that it has anything to do top help people who are not confident with computers. I don't have Auto backup on my phone, so I am certainly not going to have it on a computer. I don't use cloud storage, as I don't need to.

In reply to a post by TinyMongomery:

You can update the OS without an Apple ID but, as far as I know, there is no way to update applications (or install new ones from the App Store) without an ID. Mac OS is far more restrictive in this respect than Windows.

This is the one problem i have with Mac OS I must admit, but a friend of mine told me a while back that it is possible to get around it as she doesn't have an Apple ID on her Mac pro.

To my mind you lose a huge amount of functionality in either Mac OS or Windows if you don’t have one of their accounts.

Not sure about Mac Os as I have not really used it much, but with Windows I have not lost any functionality by not having an MS account. People say this, and yet I have not had a MS account or Hotmail as it was then for years.

i almost ordered the Mac today, the Mini pro, but for some reason the discount did not follow me, so IO stopped before I paid for it. I think it may be because of some extensions on my browser or the VPN, so I will try again at some point and disable them