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Standard User planetf1
(experienced) Sun 19-Jan-20 11:12:25
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Smarty (and Voxi) - Band 20 & use in router


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I was thinking about using a Smarty Sim in a router for home network connection (short term) However having done some research I think Smarty doesn't yet offer VoLTE, and as such Band 20 is not available (even for a non voice component)?

If so that could somewhat dent any use in a router where Carrier aggregation of Band 20 + another was expected (or available on three) - correct?

It reminds me of a bad year my partner spent on virgin mobile..(EE) that was a mobile use case but lack of band 20 was ouch,.
Here it's just speed...

I imagine the same applies to Voxi?

Meaning the ongoing monthly prices for full speed are with the primary carriers services only..
Standard User gary333
(member) Sun 19-Jan-20 11:31:47
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Re: Smarty (and Voxi) - Band 20 & use in router


[re: planetf1] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by planetf1:
I was thinking about using a Smarty Sim in a router for home network connection (short term) However having done some research I think Smarty doesn't yet offer VoLTE, and as such Band 20 is not available (even for a non voice component)?

If so that could somewhat dent any use in a router where Carrier aggregation of Band 20 + another was expected (or available on three) - correct?

It reminds me of a bad year my partner spent on virgin mobile..(EE) that was a mobile use case but lack of band 20 was ouch,.
Here it's just speed...

I imagine the same applies to Voxi?

Meaning the ongoing monthly prices for full speed are with the primary carriers services only..


Smarty doesn't have VoLTE but you still get band 20 access if that's all what is available.

CA on bands 3 & 20 is what I have been getting on Smarty (until cell site was upgraded last week).

Speed is not restricted on Smarty, you will get whatever the cell can deliver at that point in time. On band 20 you could get up to around 37.5mb if no-one else was using network and you had good signal.

In reality I find the band 20 cell in my local area congested and get from 4-12mb at best. With CA i averaged arounnd 25mb across band 3 & 20..
Standard User planetf1
(experienced) Sun 19-Jan-20 11:33:50
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Re: Smarty (and Voxi) - Band 20 & use in router


[re: gary333] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by gary333:
Smarty doesn't have VoLTE but you still get band 20 access if that's all what is available.

CA on bands 3 & 20 is what I have been getting on Smarty (until cell site was upgraded last week).

Speed is not restricted on Smarty, you will get whatever the cell can deliver at that point in time. On band 20 you could get up to around 37.5mb if no-one else was using network and you had good signal.

In reality I find the band 20 cell in my local area congested and get from 4-12mb at best. With CA i averaged arounnd 25mb across band 3 & 20..


Thanks so much for confirming that, so you are getting Band20 even with CA. Great to know - obviously network configuration varies, but it should mean the same as three in this case then. Glad to see a specific example!


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Standard User gary333
(member) Sun 19-Jan-20 11:51:36
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Re: Smarty (and Voxi) - Band 20 & use in router


[re: planetf1] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by planetf1:
In reply to a post by gary333:
Smarty doesn't have VoLTE but you still get band 20 access if that's all what is available.

CA on bands 3 & 20 is what I have been getting on Smarty (until cell site was upgraded last week).

Speed is not restricted on Smarty, you will get whatever the cell can deliver at that point in time. On band 20 you could get up to around 37.5mb if no-one else was using network and you had good signal.

In reality I find the band 20 cell in my local area congested and get from 4-12mb at best. With CA i averaged arounnd 25mb across band 3 & 20..


Thanks so much for confirming that, so you are getting Band20 even with CA. Great to know - obviously network configuration varies, but it should mean the same as three in this case then. Glad to see a specific example!


I get CA when connected to a band 3 cell as primary and band 20 as secondary. CA here is across two different masts rather than one mast broadcasting band 3 and band 20 overlapping each other. If the device connects to band 20 cell first it tends to stay locked to this and doesn't like to handover to the band 3 cell and thus the network doesn't provide CA. If I encourage device to lock on to band 3 cell it will then use band 20 for CA (hope this makes sense as it's quite confusing).

Obviously for CA you need two bands, in this instance I think this is likely a quirk with the Huawei B525 rather than behaviour of all routers (the locking and remaining on band 20)

Edited by gary333 (Sun 19-Jan-20 11:54:12)

Standard User kommando
(regular) Sun 19-Jan-20 11:51:39
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Re: Smarty (and Voxi) - Band 20 & use in router


[re: planetf1] [link to this post]
 
I have CA available on a Three mast Band 3 and Band 20 but Band 3 on its own give much the same download speeds as CA 3 and 20. Its going to depend on your local mast setup too so test first if possible, Three do a free sim card with 200mb a month included, good for testing.
Standard User gary333
(member) Sun 19-Jan-20 11:56:31
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Re: Smarty (and Voxi) - Band 20 & use in router


[re: kommando] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by kommando:
I have CA available on a Three mast Band 3 and Band 20 but Band 3 on its own give much the same download speeds as CA 3 and 20. Its going to depend on your local mast setup too so test first if possible, Three do a free sim card with 200mb a month included, good for testing.


Yeah that is a good point about trying. Even if it works for one group of cells sites it might not at another. By example Three upgraded my local cell to have band 1. Since then the CA doesn't work at all. This could just be Three removing it temporarily whilst they test their new setup, but even an area where it did work (CA) can then down the line stop working (like mine).
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 19-Jan-20 12:02:46
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Re: Smarty (and Voxi) - Band 20 & use in router


[re: gary333] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by gary333:
Yeah that is a good point about trying. Even if it works for one group of cells sites it might not at another. By example Three upgraded my local cell to have band 1. Since then the CA doesn't work at all. This could just be Three removing it temporarily whilst they test their new setup, but even an area where it did work (CA) can then down the line stop working (like mine).

Its quite possible that your upgraded mast has an entirely new vendor of hardware. (e.g. Samsung hardware out, Huawei / Nokia / Ericsson in). This will change all the configuration, and the new hardware may not CA with the other vendor across sites. I would expect you to pick up CA of Band 1 and Band 3 in due course, which should give you better performance. The propagation of B3 & B1 is very similar. This will reduce 3G speed of course.

VirginMedia 200/20 (22 Nov 19). Was FTTC for 7 years (55/12 to 46/5)
20 years of broadband connectivity since 1999 trial - Live BQM
Standard User gary333
(member) Sun 19-Jan-20 12:07:11
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Re: Smarty (and Voxi) - Band 20 & use in router


[re: jchamier] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by jchamier:
In reply to a post by gary333:
Yeah that is a good point about trying. Even if it works for one group of cells sites it might not at another. By example Three upgraded my local cell to have band 1. Since then the CA doesn't work at all. This could just be Three removing it temporarily whilst they test their new setup, but even an area where it did work (CA) can then down the line stop working (like mine).

Its quite possible that your upgraded mast has an entirely new vendor of hardware. (e.g. Samsung hardware out, Huawei / Nokia / Ericsson in). This will change all the configuration, and the new hardware may not CA with the other vendor across sites. I would expect you to pick up CA of Band 1 and Band 3 in due course, which should give you better performance. The propagation of B3 & B1 is very similar. This will reduce 3G speed of course.


New vendor hardware is highly likely as ping has almost halved. Propagation is quite similar as you say. I get RSRP of -102db on band 3 and around -107db on band 1. Although as the antennas are in a slightly different position moving the router around a couple of degrees can get band down to -105db but that is detrimental to band 3. With band 3 having 15mhz vs band 10mhz of spectrum Iíve setup router to prioritise maximising signal for band 3.
Standard User jchamier
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 19-Jan-20 12:14:30
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Re: Smarty (and Voxi) - Band 20 & use in router


[re: gary333] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by gary333:
New vendor hardware is highly likely as ping has almost halved. Propagation is quite similar as you say. I get RSRP of -102db on band 3 and around -107db on band 1. Although as the antennas are in a slightly different position moving the router around a couple of degrees can get band down to -105db but that is detrimental to band 3. With band 3 having 15mhz vs band 10mhz of spectrum Iíve setup router to prioritise maximising signal for band 3.
There was a press release sometime in the last 18 months saying Three was doing a network hardware rebuild (ie, the units in the cabinets, not the antennas on the masts). I would allow 6 to 8 weeks for the upgraded mast to be re-integrated into the network, and see how it goes.

For lower ping, could be better hardware, but there could have also been an increase in backhaul, or a switch to a different core routing site - maybe getting ready for a 5G NR future?

VirginMedia 200/20 (22 Nov 19). Was FTTC for 7 years (55/12 to 46/5)
20 years of broadband connectivity since 1999 trial - Live BQM
Standard User planetf1
(experienced) Sun 19-Jan-20 19:51:06
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Re: Smarty (and Voxi) - Band 20 & use in router


[re: kommando] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by kommando:
I have CA available on a Three mast Band 3 and Band 20 but Band 3 on its own give much the same download speeds as CA 3 and 20. Its going to depend on your local mast setup too so test first if possible, Three do a free sim card with 200mb a month included, good for testing.


yes testing is important though 'testing' for me would be a few GB at least smile

actually we had an extended virgin outage and ended up tethering to the phone (3, iPhone 8) - no issues working, spotify, streaming netflix in HD etc.. so should be ok as an out-of-contract stopgap -- which is the other point, as it's short term (until moving ... open as a possibility after) we're going onto a 1 month setup.. so little lost and can jump to voda or EE if required
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