4G/5G connection

So I am literally stuck for connection options at home and only real option for a decent speed is Virgin Media.

Now I can go the 4G (soon to be 5G here) route speed wise it does the job, I need recommendation for a 5G (ideally) external kit/bridge modem to link into my current pfsense setup.

Secondly the other thing that has been putting me off is I need a public IP, static not necessary to enable access for my CCTV and other little bits. Does anyone know if this is possible with EE? pfsense works with IPv4 or IPv6 so have options, I know there is the A&A L2TP service as I am a VOIP customer of there's it is something I have looked at and their packages seem to have changed recently as before the costs were higher data wise.

Any recommendations in this matter as I would like to review my setup in the coming months with a view to possibly moving until say a better offering is available via BT lines.

Cheers

I know a lot of people here use pfsense on Raspberry Pi kit for some reason, but I have no knowledge or understanding of why. However!

For years now I have used purely mobile broadband. Initially for a few months by simply tethering kit to my phone, the phone in hotspot mode. Later for other reasons I got a mobile broadband router. Which works just like a landline modem/router. Ethernet and WiFi I/O.

The one I have, see my sig, replacing the first is 4G, not 5G. There are no doubt better ones available. Just like most landline modem/routers its DHCP can be turned off. Effectively turning it into a bridged modem/router if you ignore its WiFi.

Four gigabit ethernet ports. Three more than you need .

As far as I know you can't get a public IP with EE.

A few words of caution on using mobile for your main Internet connection...

I went down the same path about four years ago, after FTTC got slower and slower and BT/OpenReach wouldn't/couldn't improve it.

It was great to start with, on Three with a public IP and nice fast 80/40 speeds. But then a few months in Three started to break things. Something was broken in their core network to do with TCP and HTTPS. I put up with it for a few months, worked around it with A&A's L2TP service but finally gave up and moved to EE.

That worked fine for a while as well, again 80/40 speeds. But then after a few months, EE also broke something in their core network around TCP/HTTPS that looked oddly similar* to Three's problem. It only seemed to impact some routers, but that included my Mikrotik. I spent ages with Mikrotik and EE trying to get it addressed, finally ended up working with EE's network engineers and in the end they rolled back whatever had broken it. But I had to put up with months of broken TCP/HTTPS before it got fixed.

It then worked ok until COVID happened. Then lots more people working from home found their landline broadband wasn't good enough and switched to mobile...

So I wasn't getting 80/40 any more and in the evening streaming TV peak times the connection wasn't reliable enough to watch HD streaming. So I had to give up on mobile for primary Internet access.

Thankfully Starlink came along at just the right time, so I now have a decent speed, if expensive, Internet connection.

Hopefully one day FTTP will be an option here, it stops about 600 metres from my door at the moment.

* I suspect that EE were rolling out the same kit/software that Three had done, with the same TCP/HTTPS breaking option turned on, sadly I never did get any detail from EE on what they rolled back to fix it.

In reply to a post by pluralist:

I know a lot of people here use pfsense on Raspberry Pi kit for some reason, but I have no knowledge or understanding of why. However!

Unless I am mistaken it not possible on RPi to run pfsence as far I know. It much more likely to be something like OpenWRT.

In reply to a post by MattL:

Does anyone know if this is possible with EE?

Not on any consumer plans, you would need to explore the AAISP L2TP service.

I had a similar quandry in 2019, Openreach services providing too slow uplink for my needs (due to crosstalk) and my options being mobile data or Virgin Media. EE providing insane speeds over 4g (today I see 200+ megabit download, 18mbps upload) but Three and Vodafone only managing 30 Mbps.

I went to Virgin Media for 200/20 for £50/month, and you get a single dynamic IPv4 fully routed..

Thanks for the responses I thought that would be the case.

the AAISP L2TP I'm probably going to go down, my pfsense is an existing to my network so just need a good 4G/5G industrial type router mainly for the modem to link in.

I frequently drop onto 4G on a device during the day as VM has its issues, don't get my wrong that is stable but going to explore the 4G route a bit more.

My Three service is fine . And cheap.

In reply to a post by pluralist:

My Three service is fine . And cheap.

Everyone's radio based communications service is fine for them but the crucial thing about radio based services is how they are impacted by much more than any fixed line communications service.

Its not helpful to say "it works for me", in the same way it doesn't help me (20 miles from Heathrow) to say that to a Virgin Media customer in Hounslow whom is on a completely differently designed coax segment with too many users per node.

I wonder if you do the same sort of internet activities as the other poster? The internet is diverse, and mobile ISPs that only support "web browsing" generally vanish.

Edited by jchamier (Sun 09-Jan-22 13:16:12)

In reply to a post by pluralist:

There are no doubt better ones available. Just like most landline modem/routers its DHCP can be turned off. Effectively turning it into a bridged modem/router if you ignore its WiFi.

Given that the OP is after a public IP address, no turning DHCP off on your mobile router is not turning it into a bridged modem/router. It will still be a router and still be NATting the connection, taking the OP even further away from their aim for a public IP.

Some mobile routers can be put into a true bridged mode, passing the IP address they get from the ISP through to a router inside your network. But most of them don't have this feature.

I run security cams through mine with no trouble. That's what I bought it for. Dynamic IP address.

Sony Smart TV is connected to it, with various uses such as NOW Sports; Netlflix; iPlayer and other catchups. An occasional ".tv". A few Alexa Echoes and my iPad.

In reply to a post by pluralist:

I run security cams through mine with no trouble. That's what I bought it for. Dynamic IP address.

The services you are using connect outbound from the device, through your connection, to a service on the internet. Perhaps branded "cloud". All video streaming works in that way, all web pages etc work in that way.

However not every internet service works in that way, some corporate VPNs perform incredibly badly over CGNAT, and many multi-player gaming setups fail to perform, and in some cases fail to work, when there is CGNAT.

Your Dynamic IP from Three may or may not be CGNAT, as Three has two options depending which APN you are using. ONLY three has this option for consumer products, and if you live in an area (like me) where Three is slow or no coverage, then the mobile data option is nowhere near as useful.

Edited by jchamier (Sun 09-Jan-22 16:32:56)

I've forgotten which is which of the two Three options . And how to test for CGNAT. It's currently on 3internet. Phone, using mobile connection not wifi, is on three.co.uk.

In reply to a post by pluralist:

I've forgotten which is which of the two Three options . And how to test for CGNAT. It's currently on 3internet. Phone, using mobile connection not wifi, is on three.co.uk.

I don’t use either, but from a quick internet search:
3internet - mobile broadband (MBB) and should avoid CGNAT
three.co.uk - smartphones with CGNAT

The way to tell is to find out from the router what its own IP is, and to compare that against the IP showing in a web query, e.g. http://ipquail.com/

If you use an Apple device, ensure that iCloud Private Relay is disabled before checking.

Of course Three could run out of public IPs at any time, as other UK internet providers have, and switch to CGNAT for everyone. The other mobile telcos have no choice for consumer services, there are some options for large corporate when you have an account manager.

Edited by jchamier (Sun 09-Jan-22 19:36:19)

Thanks James. I'll check later or tomorrow. I'm hungry! Time to make dinner.

There’s another APN combo which I just stumbled onto in a thread over at ISPreview. See post #55 from that thread.

APN: Name - 3internet
APN - everywhere
Username: 3secure
Password - secure

This weird APN combo (which looks like some Hybrid EE style APN) apparently seems to have resolved certain network issue on Three folks were having…

Interesting, wonder if it is account restricted. There are lots of APNs on mobile networks, the majority only work for specific groups of users. (e.g. direct link into a corporate system etc).

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

There’s another APN combo which I just stumbled onto in a thread over at ISPreview. See post #55 from that thread.

APN: Name - 3internet
APN - everywhere
Username: 3secure
Password - secure

This weird APN combo (which looks like some Hybrid EE style APN) apparently seems to have resolved certain network issue on Three folks were having…

I’m pretty sure three only lookup the APN name and none of the other fields make any difference (and can just be left blank). You could set the apn to threeneedtoimprove, but so long as the name states 3internet then this is what you get (i.e 3internet). iPhones use the APN name 3hotspot when in hotspot mode.

In reply to a post by gary333:

I’m pretty sure three only lookup the APN name and none of the other fields make any difference (and can just be left blank). You could set the apn to threeneedtoimprove, but so long as the name states 3internet then this is what you get (i.e 3internet). iPhones use the APN name 3hotspot when in hotspot mode.

Many networks override the APN either in the SIM or in the account, to ensure the user doesn't have any issues connecting. The Three virtual networks (e.g. Smarty) use this to stop support calls I suspect, but it has the downside you can't get a proper IP with Smarty.

I've been using AAISP L2TP with EE 4G for a few years now. It works well for me, but be aware it has a max throughput of 100Mbps and a 1TB monthly allowance - it could limit your connection if you have 5G faster than 100Mbps.
One option is to only route necessary things through the L2TP tunnel - I use it for a server running a mail server and websites, but route most other traffic (i.e. things that don't care about CGNAT) directly over EE.

They have 3 options available now:

Capped at 200Mb for 2TB £10 a month, single IP
Capped at 200Mb for 5TB £15 + VAT a month, multi IP
Capped at 3Mb for 1TB £2 + VAT a month, single IP

I only clear about 300 or 400 GB a month in total, what needs to be routed statically is probably about 10% of that. Mainly for CCTV, VOIP and the odd bit of VPN access if I need to access files whilst out.

I know when I looked at it last time it was lower but it appears in December they made changes. https://www.aa.net.uk/broadband/l2tp-service/ and details on the change here https://www.aa.net.uk/etc/news/l2tp-service-changes/.

I need to source a suitable external antenna to use/modem.

I hadn't noticed the increase in the limits - thanks for that info!
I use a Mikrotik SXT LTE kit, which I've been very happy with, although it is getting a bit old now - it only has 100Mb ethernet, which is fine for my 4G signal. They do have newer models with better throughput available.

I've looked at Mikrotik kit, with that do you literally put your SIM in, mount it and then plug it in your WAN port? What router do you use at the other end, can it dial and present the IP at router level?

In reply to a post by MattL:

I've looked at Mikrotik kit, with that do you literally put your SIM in, mount it and then plug it in your WAN port? What router do you use at the other end, can it dial and present the IP at router level?

Yes to all of that. It has two SIM sockets so you can switch between two networks if you want. It has pass through functionality to present the IP address to the internal network.

It has two Ethernet ports, so you can use one for the IP pass through and the other one for management. Or you can use VLANs over a single port to do the same.

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

Yes to all of that. It has two SIM sockets so you can switch between two networks if you want. It has pass through functionality to present the IP address to the internal network

Has Microtik upgraded from LTE Category 4 yet? Quite limited compared to a Cat 12 or higher phone.

My vote would be for a ZTE MC7010 outside CPE - which runs a fairly snappy 🤩 snapdragon X55 chipset. @ something like Cat 22.

If you’re rural / edge of signal mount it in front of a mini parabolic to boost the signal. The only trouble is they’re £280 odd + shipping. But it’s a very good router.

They moved beyond cat 4 quite a while ago now, but only to cat 6:

https://mikrotik.com/product/sxt_lte6_kit

It seems they are in the process of moving to hardware with more modern modems.

https://mikrotik.com/product/chateau_lte12
https://mikrotik.com/product/chateau_5g

No sign of newer modems beyond cat 6 for the Let range yet though.

And you can pay someone to add extra external antenna ports to the cat 12 routers

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/184887842050?mkevt=1&mkci...

Edited by andynormancx (Tue 11-Jan-22 22:17:56)

In reply to a post by amiga_dude:

In reply to a post by pluralist:

I know a lot of people here use pfsense on Raspberry Pi kit for some reason, but I have no knowledge or understanding of why. However!

Unless I am mistaken it not possible on RPi to run pfsence as far I know. It much more likely to be something like OpenWRT.

Pretty sure pfSense solely runs on x86-64/AMD64 on third party kit. So plenty of low power cheap Atom based mobo's for example.

Although there are also a couple of Netgate factory boxes using ARMv7 and ARMv8 based processors - this is as far as it goes. So although Pi's run ARM - there is no either official or unofficial support, compilation or porting of pfSense for the Pi family.

https://docs.netgate.com/pfsense/en/latest/hardware/...

From what I've read some folks have ported (unofficial development releases) of OPNsense to the ARM architecture. That's about as close as it gets.

@smouty is the resident expert on OPNsense related matters so he no doubt knows way more.

So yeah as you say its basically OpenWRT

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

And you can pay someone to add extra external antenna ports to the cat 12 routers

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/184887842050?mkevt=1&mkci...

...to be fair router-mods aren't particularly fussy lads and they'll happily take the drill and soldering iron to the latest Huawei CPE Pro 2 routers that are Cat 20+ for that unique 'from the set of Matrix films' look 😂

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/185004719469

They really should show it with all the cables plugged in for the full Matrix effect.

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

No sign of newer modems beyond cat 6 for the Let range yet though.

Its a shame as many people will test mobile data using a handset and a 2 year old OnePlus Nord (ver 1) manages Category 18 and 4x4 MIMO. It means the dedicated hardware organisations are, for some reason, not able to keep up, and that concerns me. Perhaps the number they sell is too small to invest much in upgrading?

A network wants all users on as high a category as possible, as then everyone benefits, and you need Cat 6 to get the benefits of aggregation (CA) and the higher categories improve efficiency in the communications between the user equipment and the cell site.

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

...to be fair router-mods aren't particularly fussy lads and they'll happily take the drill and soldering iron to the latest Huawei CPE Pro 2 routers that are Cat 20+ for that unique 'from the set of Matrix films' look 😂

The outside of your home will look like a cell site

In reply to a post by jchamier:

It means the dedicated hardware organisations are, for some reason, not able to keep up, and that concerns me. Perhaps the number they sell is too small to invest much in upgrading?

I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that they can't even easily buy the high end modems they'd need to use. Most of the phones with reasonably up to date modems don't even have separate modems, they tend to be built into the processor package now.

In reply to a post by jchamier:

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

...to be fair router-mods aren't particularly fussy lads and they'll happily take the drill and soldering iron to the latest Huawei CPE Pro 2 routers that are Cat 20+ for that unique 'from the set of Matrix films' look 😂

The outside of your home will look like a cell site

I'd certainly like to see that picture, with a whole array of metre long yagi antennae pointed at the nearest cell tower

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that they can't even easily buy the high end modems they'd need to use. Most of the phones with reasonably up to date modems don't even have separate modems, they tend to be built into the processor package now.

True for Android, but Apple is a large manufacturer using standalone modems. Maybe they are buying up all of Qualcomm's production!

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

I'd certainly like to see that picture, with a whole array of metre long yagi antennae pointed at the nearest cell tower

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

In reply to a post by jchamier:

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

...to be fair router-mods aren't particularly fussy lads and they'll happily take the drill and soldering iron to the latest Huawei CPE Pro 2 routers that are Cat 20+ for that unique 'from the set of Matrix films' look 😂

The outside of your home will look like a cell site

I'd certainly like to see that picture, with a whole array of metre long yagi antennae pointed at the nearest cell tower

Ughhh. 8 of metre long Yagi’s. That would be utterly yuck. Even 4 cross polarised yagis would be horrific. Worse than the cell site. 🤮

Yeah, I don't think Mikrotik and the like have the same buying power as Apple 😉

Reportedly they want to take more in-house, with wireless chipsets, as they’ve done with Apple Silicon on the main processors…

https://www.macworld.com/article/560257/apple-report...

That much has been clear for at least three years now, they did buy Intel's modem division after all...

https://www.apple.com/uk/newsroom/2019/07/apple-to-a...

It will be a slow burn. Prior to that acquisition they had zero in house capability. Expect it will be a while before they can get to best of breed in that space.

Then again their long term strategy under Cook has been impeccable. He hasn’t squandered the legacy from the late Jobs. Quite the opposite. Apple is in a pretty good place historically.

I couldn't agree more, I'm sat typing this on an amazing M1 Max MacBook Pro.

I'd be amazed if the first Apple 5G modems didn't appear next year, though I suspect they'll put them in an iPad first before the phones. Maybe this year, though probably not.

Snap. Did you get a 14 or 16” ?

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

I'd be amazed if the first Apple 5G modems didn't appear next year, though I suspect they'll put them in an iPad first before the phones. Maybe this year, though probably not.

Some of that will depend on what commitment Qualcomm extracted from them when Intel couldn't meet the 5G need, and I suspect drove a hard bargain.

Wonder if we will ever see mobile data in a MacBook, its a strange omission for an option at the price point.

16, the 14 would be too small when I’m stuck on client sites with no second screen.

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

Thankfully Starlink came along at just the right time, so I now have a decent speed, if expensive, Internet connection.

Right up until Starlink suffers from the same problem. I have seen reports that uses in the USA are already reporting their Starlink speeds have dropped. Radio spectrum is not a long term option for broadband beyond a small number of people in very hard to reach and/or mobile locations.

Starlink have always been clear that their main target market is relatively sparsely populated areas.

And I think long term in places like the UK there are actually likely to be fewer fixed location Starlink customers than now, as more and more FTTP rolls out to currently uncovered areas the need for Starlink will fall.

And although it sounds like madness saying it...

...it is easier for them to add capacity by launching more satellites, than it is for terrestrial mobile operators to add more cell towers !

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

...it is easier for them to add capacity by launching more satellites, than it is for terrestrial mobile operators to add more cell towers !

Until we have collisions in orbit, or more complaints by other countries, the sheer number of satellites for Starlink is incredible.

In reply to a post by andynormancx:

I couldn't agree more, I'm sat typing this on an amazing M1 Max MacBook Pro.

I'd be amazed if the first Apple 5G modems didn't appear next year, though I suspect they'll put them in an iPad first before the phones. Maybe this year, though probably not.

Looks like they're finally about to appear...

Mark Gurman @ Bloomberg: Apple Plans Three-Year Modem Rollout in Bid to Top Qualcomm

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

Looks like they're finally about to appear...

Nearly 2 years old thread, nice find.

Rumour started in Nov that the next iPhone SE will have Apple modem as it won't yet support mmWave required for US premium products.
https://www.macrumors.com/2024/11/19/iphone-se-4-exp...

In reply to a post by jchamier:

Nearly 2 years old thread, nice find.
...

Cheers. Almost 3 years! I remember discussing it, just couldn't find what thread...finally had to enlist Gary and Sergey to help 😅

Of course we know once Mr Gurman has writ in Bloomberg, then it's more or less gospel truth! I did think it would take them a while, but six years is a very long time to wait for the first products to get to market. Was the $1B price Apple paid Intel a 'good' investment?

Bit of deja vu in that article, with current events with ARM and Qualcomm, back to a 2019 link about the infamous Apple-Qualcomm lawsuit settlement too. Funny how history often repeats...

Edited by Pheasant (Mon 09-Dec-24 11:39:26)

In reply to a post by Pheasant:

Cheers. Almost 3 years! I remember discussing it, just couldn't find what thread...finally had to enlist Gary and Sergey to help 😅

Of course we know once Mr Gurman has writ in Bloomberg, then it's more or less gospel truth! I did think it would take them a while, but six years is a very long time to wait for the first products to get to market. Was the $1B price Apple paid Intel a 'good' investment?

I suspected the reason Intel got out of cellular was the complexity of making a 5G modem was somewhat different to making 2G/3G/4G, and Intel's support for the (at the time) US required CDMA for 3G was always second class, but Samsung famously used Qualcomm modems in the Galaxy S models for USA due to this. Apple has the money, and the determination to solve the problem, and if Gurman is right... they have. Which will let them eventually integrate into the A-series or M-series SoCs in time.

Bit of deja vu in that article, with current events with ARM and Qualcomm, back to a 2019 link about the infamous Apple-Qualcomm lawsuit settlement too. Funny how history often repeats...

Yeah, lawyers always get rich !

Thread resurrection time again. 😅

Apple reveals C1, its first in-house 5G iPhone modem, replacing Qualcomm

I’ll start a new thread in the Apple section with a link to the specs as published by Apple.

Edit: here we go…
https://forums.thinkbroadband.com/mac/f/4772839-appl...

Edited by Pheasant (Thu 20-Feb-25 11:02:28)