Improving my wireless network - help please

Hi

I've been having alot of internet dropouts recently.

To cut a long story short, it appears to be related to the legacy phone wiring in my house (many phone sockets, no proper master socket etc.).

So Open Reach came out at weekend, put new phoneline to house & fitted a nice modern mastersocket, with internal test socket, but this is now in a corner room - with inferior wireless signal in some of the other rooms.

Never had more than 2.7 speed before - O2 ran test on Test socket & we got 5MB speed !

However I would ideally like to improve the wireless coverage by either extending from mastersocket into hall - or ethernet cabling to a wireless access point in the hall. Not sure which would be the best solution.

Can anyone advise ?


thanks

Leave the modem & router next to the master, then run Cat5 from there out to where you want the WAPs to be located.

You can go even better and wire to a cupboard, install a patch panel and switch and then from there to sockets where needed and connect the WAPs there.

Have a long think about exactly what you want and you will get plenty of advice and assistance.

Thanks

Having thought a little more I was maybe being a bit silly.

Wouldn't it be better to just run a longer Cat5 cable from the filter at the master socket & put the modem/router in the hall (where I want it) ?

The only wall I have to drill through is a partition which divides the converted garage into office (actually my music studio, and where master socket is) and a small utility room.

From the utility room it's only a few metres round the corner to the hallway table.

Am I likely to lose much bandwidth with a 5 - 10m Cat5 cable run ?

Also is it straightforward to remove/fit cat5 plugs, as this would affect the size of hole I have to drill !

I may run this setup straight from the test socket as this appears to give about 1MB larger bandwidth than the mastersocket (even though I've now disconnected the master from the rest of the house sockets).

Not ideal as I have to leave the face plate off the socket ...

(registered post)

Thanks

Having thought a little more I was maybe being a bit silly.

Wouldn't it be better to just run a longer Cat5 cable from the filter at the master socket & put the modem/router in the hall (where I want it) ?

The only wall I have to drill through is a partition which divides the converted garage into office (actually my music studio, and where master socket is) and a small utility room.

From the utility room it's only a few metres round the corner to the hallway table.

Am I likely to lose much bandwidth with a 5 - 10m Cat5 cable run ?

Also is it straightforward to remove/fit cat5 plugs, as this would affect the size of hole I have to drill !

I may run this setup straight from the test socket as this appears to give about 1MB larger bandwidth than the mastersocket (even though I've now disconnected the master from the rest of the house sockets).

Not ideal as I have to leave the face plate off the socket ...

PS I now read about HomePlug networking (via mains wiring) - may be this would be another option ... It's all getting a bit confusing !

Edited by deleted (Fri 23-Sep-11 09:02:07)

Sorry to be a pain but can someone advise asap - I'd like to pick some cable up from Maplins on the way home tonight ..

Ethernet plugs - easy to fit / remove ?

Which cable - cat5e ? cat6? UTP ? crossover ? solid ? stranded ?

It gets more confusing the more I look into it !


thanks

Ethernet plugs - easy to fit / remove ?

Yes, although slightly fiddly. You will need the correct tool and at least a little practice. You will also need to do a little reading up on which colour wires to connect to which pins in order to make sure the pairs are being utilised correctly.

Which cable - cat5e ? cat6? UTP ? crossover ? solid ? stranded ?

The choice is yours.
- Cat6 can perform at higher network speeds than Cat5e. That said Cat5e will happily cope with gigabit network speeds.
- Definitely UTP (unshielded) not STP (shielded)
- Crossover - this is not a consideration if you are putting the connectors on yourself as how you wire the pins determines if the cable is crossover or not.
- Solid v Stranded. Solid performs better but Stranded is far easier to route and fish through walls etc. For your ~10m run the performance difference will be irrelevant so I would recommend going with stranded for ease of installation.

n.b. make sure you get the correct plugs to suit the type of cable and the correct tool to suit the plugs!

EDIT TO ADD: The socket you seem to be planning to connect to on the ADSL filter is actually RJ11 not RJ45.

Edited by deleted (Fri 23-Sep-11 13:28:13)

Many thanks

Actually I think I'm being stupid again !

What I actually need to do if I plan to move the ADSL modem further from the MasterSocket is an ADSL cable (with RJ11 plugs) not a cat5 ethernet cable.

The bloke at O2 support said they don't recommend this, as the modem should be as close to the Mastersocket as possible.

I did find this though:

http://www.skyuser.co.uk/forum/cabling-faceplate-hel...

http://www.maplin.co.uk/ultra-high-speed-adsl-cables...

This would avoid having to add in a wireless access point in the hall.

Is this a bad idea ?

So if I understand this correctly, you just want to move your router so you can get a better signal. Your modem connects to your router via an RJ45 ethernet cable.

All you need is a patch cable. Since this cable will stay there indefinetaly and you won't be moving it around then solid core is fine but at such short distances it doesn't really matter. You wouldn't notice a difference at all between 5m and 50m.

Don't buy from Maplin. Way too expensive. Check Hot uk deals to catch up on the latest offers. You will probably find something cheap from amazon or ebay

why not keep your modem as close to the master socket as possible and get a long CAT5e/CAT6 cable to put the wireless router somewhere else. Otherwise, you can keep both the modem and wireless router where they are, and get a wireless access point. You connect the WAP to the router's LAN interface via an ethernet cable and you give it the same SSID and password as the original router.

If you can get away with just moving the router, go with that option. If not, get an additional WAP. Let us know which you prefer

As long as you use decent quality CW1308 standard cable it will be fine. Cheaper than Cat5 or 6 too

Personally I would run it as a proper extension off the punch down connectors in the master socket rather than rj11 plug into the adsl filter.

So you will need, CW1308 cable, telephone extension socket, IDC punch down tool, suitable sized clips. Then if you like you could use an ADSL filter faceplate on the extension socket or simply plug the adsl filter into th the socket.

Thanks

The O2 box is wireless router & modem combined (I think !) - so single box at the moment.

Is it a bad idea to move it several meters away from the Mastersocket (as O2 support said) ?

It's absoultely fine - provided you use decent quality CW1308 cable to the extension. I would caution against going down the route of a 10m r11 cable - especially if branded as "high-speed broadband cable" or some other such marketing guff. They are generally quite poor quality copper and often not even twisted pair.

I was actually thinking of running this off the test socket inside the mastersocket - this gave the best performance (around 5.2 meg, mastersocket gave around 4 meg, even when disconnected from rest of house sockets).

Not sure I'm techy enough to follow your ideal setup ..

So are you proposing:

MasterSocket > ADSLFilter > RJ11 > 10m cable > RJ11 > router ?

If so make sure the cable is good quality.

Oh - as for techy - using an IDC punch down is far simpler than putting RJ style connectors on the ends of cables.

Although it is best practise to leave the modem as close to the master socket as possible, it isn't a problem if you were to extend it. Check your speeds before and after you get the extension cable if you are unsure.

Another option is to just get another wireless router (cheaper than an access point in most situations). It takes some setting up but it requires less DIY (apart from dilling necssary holes for the patch cable that will go from your modem/router to the new wireless router).

If you do get a second wireless router, you wouldn't actually use its routing function, just the switch and wireless components. You connect one of the LAN ports of the modem/router to one of the LAN ports on the new router via a straight through "patch" cable. DHCP must be disabled on the new router. Also the LAN interface needs to be given a static IP in the same subnet as the router/modem. Then you have 2 choices for the wireless. You can give the new router the same SSID and password and in theory, wireless divices will connect to the access point that has the highest signal. Otherwise, you can have a different SSID/password and set up some of your devices to connect to the access point that is nearest (obviously, you wouldn't be able to roam that way)

In reply to a post by GeeTee:

So are you proposing:

MasterSocket > ADSLFilter > RJ11 > 10m cable > RJ11 > router ?

If so make sure the cable is good quality.

Oh - as for techy - using an IDC punch down is far simpler than putting RJ style connectors on the ends of cables.

Yes, that is what I was thinking. It would mean leaving the faceplate off the mastersocket to access test socket, but that doesn't really bother me as it's hidden away in corner of the room.

Would that Maplins ADSL cable not be a good idea then ?

I guess if the performance is poor I could take it back...

I've no idea as to the quality of that particular cable - it "looks" well made. The fact it is a round cable rather than flat probably means it is twisted pair which is a good thing. The braided screening actually won't do very much at all. For cable shielding to work effectively it really needs earthing at each end. That said, it's not going to make it worse

There is such a big variance in the quality of these RJ11-RJ11 cables as there is no official standard as there is for telephony and data cabling.

As you say - give it a go and take it back if it performs badly

In reply to a post by GeeTee:

I've no idea as to the quality of that particular cable - it "looks" well made. The fact it is a round cable rather than flat probably means it is twisted pair which is a good thing. The braided screening actually won't do very much at all. For cable shielding to work effectively it really needs earthing at each end. That said, it's not going to make it worse

There is such a big variance in the quality of these RJ11-RJ11 cables as there is no official standard as there is for telephony and data cabling.

As you say - give it a go and take it back if it performs badly

Thank you for being so helpful.

Is it strange that I would want to run this permanently from the test socket ?

O2 are running a 24 hr test on the mastersocket (as I said, now isolated from the rest of the dodgy sockets in this house) - 3 dropouts in 24hrs on the previous test socket test, 6dB noise level. I can accept this if bandwidth is better than if noise level raised.

Is there any reason why the mastersocket (mm away from the test socket) would show lower performance than test socket (if isolated from the rest of the house) ?

Not strange at all - many people do the same thing as it avoids having to learn how to wire in an extension.

If there is no extension wiring cabled up to the faceplate on the master socket then theoretically the performance should be exactly the same as the test socket itself. It's just a case of how well the contacts between faceplate and test socket perform. Sometimes just a little clean of all the contacts with something like isopropyl alcohol and a cotton bud on a stick can improve things - particularly on an older socket.

There's no problem leaving the faceplate off if you don't need extension sockets - other than a bit of dust and the odd spider getting in there

Edited by deleted (Fri 23-Sep-11 15:15:35)

In reply to a post by GeeTee:

Not strange at all - many people do the same thing as it avoids having to learn how to wire in an extension.

If there is no extension wiring cabled up to the faceplate on the master socket then theoretically the performance should be exactly the same as the test socket itself. It's just a case of how well the contacts between faceplate and test socket perform. Sometimes just a little clean of all the contacts with something like isopropyl alcohol and a cotton bud on a stick can improve things - particularly on an older socket.

There's no problem leaving the faceplate off if you don't need extension sockets - other than a bit of dust and the odd spider getting in there

One last thing (I hope !).

Is bandwidth degradation more likely with long RJ11 ADSL cable than similar length cat5 cable (as O2 inferred) ?

If it's highly likely then I might go the ethernet / access point route.

However I am tempted to drop by at Maplins on the way home just try this out ...

Again it's all down to the quality of the cable used. RJ11 just refers to the plug on the end of it.

Give it a go, it's only going to be a 2 minute job to plug the cable in and trail it across the floor then stick the router on the end of it. If the ADSL synch speed drops significantly then just return it.

Although from the Returns policy on the Maplin site:

Therefore if for any reason you find that your recent purchase is not quite what you wanted. Then within 28 days of purchase, Maplin will replace, offer a credit note or refund your unsuitable purchase to equal value. This is provided the goods remain in their original condition, unopened and unused and accompany all packaging an accessories they came with.

So maybe worth clarifying with them in shop whether you'd be able to return if it just under-performed.

Get yourself some home plugs. Some of these are also apearing with wireless built in.