Technical Discussion
  >> Home Networking, Internet Connection Sharing, etc.


Register (or login) on our website and you will not see this ad.


Pages in this thread: 1 | 2 | (show all)   Print Thread
Standard User iaintait98
(newbie) Sun 30-Jun-19 16:20:10
Print Post

Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[link to this post]
 
Hi there, I'm a novice when it comes to broadband connections but I'm looking to try and improve my current connection.

I've recently become a Sky Fibre Max Customer and ever since the installation, the service has become worse and worse, with common high latency and dropped packets. Making streaming videos/playing online games unbearable.

BQM: https://www.thinkbroadband.com/broadband/monitoring/...

Router Stats:
https://i.imgur.com/axOftHq.png

If anyone is able to detect the fault going on with my connection and what action I should take, that would be greatly appreciated. smile
Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 30-Jun-19 17:33:59
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: iaintait98] [link to this post]
 
The most common cause of such issues is an incorrect set up within your property.

Can you describe whatís connected, to where, and by how ?

Not whatís connecting to the router, more the phone line, extensions, filters and the like.

Standard User iaintait98
(newbie) Sun 30-Jun-19 17:57:11
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
Hi Zarjaz,

Currently I have a single socket master socket located in the kitchen, from there Iíve got a phone line extension cable which goes into the wall and leads to the hallway, I replaced the micro filter that was previously there (before I upgraded to Fibre) with the one provided with the router. And from the microfilter, I have the phone line connected to my home phone and have an ASDL cable connected to the router provided from sky.

From the router, I have the Sky Q box connected via Ethernet. PS4, Laptop, around 3 mobiles phones connected at one time via WiFi


Register (or login) on our website and you will not see this ad.

Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 30-Jun-19 18:08:11
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: iaintait98] [link to this post]
 
Thank you for the info.

Your current wiring set up generates a fault condition known as a Ďbridge tapí, and this is causing the problems you describe.

Doubtless this is the same wiring set up you had before, but as the speed of service increases, the Ďfussierí it becomes to such issues.

I suspect the easiest answer would be to contact Sky, describe your issue, and go through their faulting steps ... they should then make an appointment for a Sky or Openreach engineer to come and rejig the wiring to sort out the issue.

Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Sun 30-Jun-19 21:14:02
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: iaintait98] [link to this post]
 
What packet loss? There is some but nothing like the levels you would expect to classify as a fault

Also on the high latency, if the connection is behaving nicely when idle suggests nothing seriously wrong. The blocks of yellow - what were you doing at the time? Looks like a pattern from you actually using the connection.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User iaintait98
(newbie) Mon 01-Jul-19 04:27:51
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
Iím not an expert by any means but I assumed the red dots at the top of the graph indicates packet loss, I might be wrong.

I use the broadband mainly for general entertainment purposes (eg: video streaming and gaming). Currently the internet keeps dropping whenever used, leading to buffering videos and me getting kicked out of/laggy game servers. Which in some cases leads me to use 4G for extended periods of time as the internet can be very unstable at times (multiple times throughout the day). That is the practical way of putting it. Iím trying to put those issues into graphs and statistics to help find the issue and potentially solve it.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 01-Jul-19 09:29:53
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: iaintait98] [link to this post]
 
Yes there is a small amount but nothing that would be considered a fault, fault is when you get spikes that descend half way or all the way down the graph

No sign of resyncs (both on graph and router says its up for 23 hours and counting) so suggestion is it is not the VDSL2 part but Sky network itself and that the BQM is not showing masses of drops suggests it may be even outside the Sky network

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Realalemadrid
(member) Mon 01-Jul-19 09:37:06
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: iaintait98] [link to this post]
 
The evidence from the BQM shows you are not losing the VDSL2 connection and the packet loss you talk about is not significant. I would suggest that WiFi problems are the most likely cause of your troubles. Have you done any tests with wireless disabled and using an ethernet connection to the router?
Standard User gmangt4
(regular) Mon 01-Jul-19 10:03:08
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: iaintait98] [link to this post]
 
Is it WiFi clients that are losing connection and having issues? Your graph looks way better than my VM one except when your actually using it....if WiFi then try the devices with a wired connection that can be wired. Looks to me that your actual broadband connection to the house is not dropping out at all never mind many times a day, WiFi can be very poor depending on many things so best to try wired, especially on gaming systems. If you clarify for the clever folks on here that if its just WiFi clients or its wired also dropping connection you will get feedback more relevant to your issue.
Standard User ukhardy07
(knowledge is power) Mon 01-Jul-19 15:43:33
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: iaintait98] [link to this post]
 
Uptime of almost 24 hours with no drops, and noise margin of 3db indicates a stable line, as DLM only sets 3db on stable lines.

To have the setup correct; however, you should not have it connected to the end of the extension cable. You need master socket - filter - router. The extension can be used for telephone only, and this can be connected to the phone side of the filter. I do not think this is the root cause of your issues but it wont be doing you any favours.

Wireless wise, what speeds are you getting on the devices you are having issues with? It is very possible the wireless is just struggling in those areas, sky offer boosters for these circumstances. I have a few smile
Standard User iaintait98
(newbie) Mon 01-Jul-19 16:10:44
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: Realalemadrid] [link to this post]
 
Iíve only managed to run tests on WiFi only, I will continue testing on my laptop via Ethernet to try resolve the issue and get back ASAP. Sorry about mentioning packet losses, it was my bad to assume they were (first time using a BQM graph), but if the issue is with inconsistent WiFi connection, how can I resolve it?
Standard User iaintait98
(newbie) Mon 01-Jul-19 16:20:06
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: gmangt4] [link to this post]
 
Sorry I shouldíve mentioned that all tests have been done using WiFi connection due to the location of the router, I will connect my laptop to the router via Ethernet and continue testing.

Also itís completely my bad to directly assume that high latency and dropped packets where the main issue. At least itís nice to know that itís an internal issue.
Standard User iaintait98
(newbie) Mon 01-Jul-19 16:28:44
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: ukhardy07] [link to this post]
 
I would try that but the location of the master socket within my house is in an unusual location (under the kitchen sink, not the most ideal place) with no plugs in close vicinity to plug my router in, so it would require me to lift the floorboards which I want to try and avoid.

I might purchase a WiFi booster if issues are still persistent, Iíve also heard of Ethernet plugs where you can connect two Ethernet cables to (this might be more useful for PS4 as I need a consistent connection for this). Thanks for your suggestion though, Iím heavily considering this option smile
Standard User gmangt4
(regular) Mon 01-Jul-19 17:21:21
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: iaintait98] [link to this post]
 
Placement of your router can also have a massive impact on WiFi, stuck down back of a cabinet or in a cupboard will cause coverage issues as can other WiFi stuff like baby monitor, wireless doorbell, video sender, etc....also 2.4Ghz band travels better through walls etc, if your trying to connect to 5Ghz in the other side of the house then it will be unstable, try 2.4G band only and see. It does look like poor WiFi, Sky have been known to provide free boosters, as mentioned on a reply, maybe call them and tell them your WiFi is un-useable? Nothing to lose except a phonecall.
Homeplugs or Powerline adapters can be used for a "wired" connection, although I'm not a fan of them they do work....I find the higher the speed their reated for the more unstable they are, I stick to 500mb and 600mb ones where they are in use in friends/family homes. They start at £24.99 in Argos for example for a pair and they come with the required cables too., there are loads of other places to buy them, thats just one example as can get them same day from Argos.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 01-Jul-19 17:29:42
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: iaintait98] [link to this post]
 
1. Make sure all kit is using 802.11ac and the 5GHz band
2. For gaming even with the best wifi an Ethernet connection is what you want to reduce problems
3. Stop using ISP hardware and get a decent third party wifi access point if you are stuck using WiFi

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User ukhardy07
(knowledge is power) Mon 01-Jul-19 17:33:35
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: iaintait98] [link to this post]
 
Drop sky a call and tell them it was good with your old provider.

They will likely issue a sky broadband, not open reach engineer to visit who will install as many boosters as required and ensure it all works well on site. They donít just post the boosters anymore as people were placing them where there was already no signal and expecting it to do magic, this meant they kept complaining.
Standard User derby13
(regular) Mon 01-Jul-19 20:38:46
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: ukhardy07] [link to this post]
 
Your BQM looks exactly like mine, and I'm also with Sky. Overall pretty decent but with those huge spikes every couple of hours or so. Not sure if these are caused by the router and irrelevant to the actual quality of the connection or what.
Standard User kevindb
(regular) Tue 02-Jul-19 20:06:21
Print Post

Re: Trouble with Internet - Keeps Dropping (Sky)


[re: derby13] [link to this post]
 
The BQM graph requires a certain amount of interpretation. None of this is news I'm sure but yellow is the peak latency in any 100 second period, blue is the average over that same period, green the lowest reported latency over that period.

So it only takes one 'rogue' ping to be say 160mS late and you have a yellow spike. Big increases in average (blue) latency will contribute to a feeling of 'stickyness' and typically appear when doing large transfers aka bufferbloat. That's more harmful to perception of internet slowness than the odd rogue spike. Spikes aren't ideal because they can affect latency sensitive applications such as VOIP.

As a Sky FTTC customer I also see these spikes and my investigation suggests they're part of the downstream shaper that's used to prevent your line from being overfilled and having real bufferbloat problems.

The initial TCP startup of a stream fills up the downstream shaper which the ping packet gets 'stuck' behind, hence the spike. It's possible to reduce that spike by using a downstream shaper/aqm to signal TCP to slow down earlier, before it hits the buffer BUT at the cost of reducing your download bandwidth. Unless you've something that's extremely sensitive to latency jitter then I personally don't think it worth it. Bear in mind that 160mS is about 6th of a second.

I use the CAKE shaper running under linux to manage latency on my connection and I'm very happy with that but even so an aggressive start on a download can still cause the odd 'harmless' spike.
Pages in this thread: 1 | 2 | (show all)   Print Thread

Jump to