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Standard User Michael_Chare
(committed) Wed 09-Jan-13 11:32:10
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GigaClear could they compete with BT Fibre on Demand?


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How can Gigaclear expect to be able to launch a viable fibre service in a rural part of Kent, given that (hopefully) BT with Kent BDUK funding will upgrade local exchanges and cabinets to FTTC, and Fibre on Demand will become available from BT?

The Gigaclear prices are not cheap - starting at £37 per month.

Michael Chare
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 09-Jan-13 11:45:59
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Re: GigaClear could they compete with BT Fibre on Demand?


[re: Michael_Chare] [link to this post]
 
The installs though are a fair bit cheaper than Openreach Fibre on Demand, and you get burst to Gig for the £37, reserved 10 Meg.

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/5426-gigaclear-de...

The final link install if done by a third party or householder can be a lot cheaper.

There is a bit of a race though, Gigaclear and others need to get a good toe-hold and it will be interesting to see the UK go from no fibre to two physically different options in the course of a year.

Andrew Ferguson, [email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User yarwell
(sensei) Wed 09-Jan-13 11:59:13
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Re: GigaClear could they compete with BT Fibre on Demand?


[re: Michael_Chare] [link to this post]
 
Takeup will be the important factor, £37/month may work financially at the sort of takeup they have mentioned elsewhere ~40%.

If it costs 2 grand per property to provide then over the long run that's £200 pa or £16.67 per month in the cost of capital, so viability is conceivable.

http://www.gigaclear.com/communities/underriver/ - seems the takeup aspect is addressed

--

Phil

MaxDSL - goes as fast as it can and doesn't read the line checker first.

MaxDSL diagnostics

Edited by yarwell (Wed 09-Jan-13 12:10:51)


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Standard User Michael_Chare
(committed) Wed 09-Jan-13 12:22:34
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Re: GigaClear could they compete with BT Fibre on Demand?


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
What rights would Gigaclear have or need to get to lay fibres across private land, which they would need to do to provide access to my house? BT could presumably use their existing rights.

I am not sure that I see the need for two competing services. I would much rather have one properly maintained one. Rural overhead copper lines certainly need plenty of maintenance.

I have received a promotional leaflet from Gigaclear, and there was a article in the local paper. Will BT be aware of Gigaclear's plans anyway, or should I draw their attention to the matter?

What are the monthly costs of BT's Fibre on Demand expected to be? Will they be similar to the FTTC products for similar speeds?

Michael Chare
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 09-Jan-13 12:34:05
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Re: GigaClear could they compete with BT Fibre on Demand?


[re: Michael_Chare] [link to this post]
 
BT Group is well aware of competitors, individuals in BT may not be.

Who said anything about overhead deployment? Even if existing telephone is overhead Gigaclear may still duct their fibre. BT would most likely make use of their overhead like they have done in Cornwall though.

BT has no rights to dig across your land, you grant permission through ordering the service, for rolling out network they use public land and their code powers, or apply for a wayleave. Gigaclear have the same abilities.

Fibre on demand, if you order the same speeds as FTTC offer the monthly price will be the same from Openreach, but what the retailers do is up to them, some may only offer Fibre on Demand with their business packages, rather than with the massed market products.

Andrew Ferguson, [email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Michael_Chare
(committed) Wed 09-Jan-13 13:50:23
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Re: GigaClear could they compete with BT Fibre on Demand?


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
To provide me with a service Gigaclear would have to have cables crossing someone else's land. It appears they can use legal powers to obtain this, though in my case I would not expect this to be an issue.

Gigaclear are looking for a 30% take up before they start, and they have already got 20%, though I don't know how the 20% is distributed. They also say that they would lay their cables underground.

At £37 per month the Gigaclear service is quite expensive. However if you deducted the cost of renting a copper phone line, the price is not that much more than I would expect to pay BT + Plusnet, and the installation cost is much lower.

Michael Chare
Standard User Ribble
(committed) Wed 09-Jan-13 14:07:03
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Re: GigaClear could they compete with BT Fibre on Demand?


[re: Michael_Chare] [link to this post]
 
To install equipment including duct, poles, and joint box's on private land would require wayleaves from the land owner, which the land owner can decline. Many companies have code powers that allow them to install such line plant on public land.
Standard User yarwell
(sensei) Wed 09-Jan-13 14:58:59
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Re: GigaClear could they compete with BT Fibre on Demand?


[re: Michael_Chare] [link to this post]
 
Wayleaves are granted by negotiation and payment of fees. There was a recent example where a BT leased line to a Vodafone (?) base station, the line was damaged but someone forgot to negotiate a wayleave when it was put in and the landowner denied access to repair it.

http://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/network/wayleav...

--

Phil

MaxDSL - goes as fast as it can and doesn't read the line checker first.

MaxDSL diagnostics
Standard User Michael_Chare
(committed) Wed 09-Jan-13 16:13:06
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Re: GigaClear could they compete with BT Fibre on Demand?


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by MrSaffron:
There is a bit of a race though, Gigaclear and others need to get a good toe-hold and it will be interesting to see the UK go from no fibre to two physically different options in the course of a year.
A bit like buses, you wait a long time and then two turn up together. I am beginning to think that I should just get on the first one that actually comes.

Michael Chare
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 09-Jan-13 16:38:07
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Re: GigaClear could they compete with BT Fibre on Demand?


[re: Michael_Chare] [link to this post]
 
The price of Fibre on Demand will vary from property to property, so could be a chunk more than the indications we have, plus who knows what might happen with the BDUK projects

Andrew Ferguson, [email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Michael_Chare
(committed) Wed 09-Jan-13 17:31:25
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Re: GigaClear could they compete with BT Fibre on Demand?


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
One advantage of Gigaclear is that they don't have a large upfront cost - unlike BT. So if they fail to provide a good service you can escape without incurring a large penalty. I just hope that they would be able to provide a fault repair service similar to what BT offers for residential customers. Avoiding Indian call centres would be good though!

Michael Chare
Standard User pjaj
(newbie) Thu 14-Mar-13 01:17:25
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Re: GigaClear could they compete with BT Fibre on Demand?


[re: Michael_Chare] [link to this post]
 
The cost of Gigaclear is, I agree, £37 per month, but you can switch to a VoIP provider for telephone and ditch all BT services entirely.
In Appleton my quarterly BT bill was around £120 = £40 per month. This included the cheapest broadband package, "friends and family" and the "anytime" telephone call packages. I calculated that this was the cheapest set of options for my particular usage.
The broadband rarely got above 1.5Mb download and 300Kb upload, capped at 10Gb/month and the telephone line was noisy.
With Gigaclear and Vonage I pay about £44 per month (£37 + £6 Vonage + £1 for extra calls to mobile, 084 etc numbers)
All land line calls are crystal clear and UK geographic number are free.
Broadband measures above 900Mb symmetrical just about any time of the day or night. There is no data cap of any kind, only a fair usage policy that frowns upon things like spam generation and other questionable practices.
OK 10% dearer for me but many, many times better than BT's offering.
One of my neighbours has halved his costs by switching - his usage was different.
Standard User Michael_Chare
(committed) Thu 14-Mar-13 11:01:04
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Re: GigaClear could they compete with BT Fibre on Demand?


[re: pjaj] [link to this post]
 
Thanks for your post. I have now placed an order, but so far, for the Underriver project, only ~40% of the target have signed up. - Unlike Otmoor which is at more like 80%. I am just keeping my fingers crossed that the Underriver project will go ahead.

I suspect that many to not appreciate that they can save on the cost of a copper landline
by using VOIP. (based on conversation with neighbour!)

Michael Chare
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