Fidonet comments? Looking for a bonded FTTC service

Hi,
I was wondering if anyone here knows what FidoNet is like?

Reason I ask is that I'm looking for a 'not too expensive' option for when I move house soon, as I may need two lines to increase the speed of FTTC there. So far FidoNet's pricing seems the best I've seen and I've read they also support bonding. I've checked AAISP's options and they seem rather pricey (but given AAISP's quality standards I'd expect that), I also checked Fluidata's website but not sure what they would charge roughly.

On the other hand, I've also read load balancing is a possible alternative but I'm not sure if that would have an impact on my need for a block of 8 IP's for my home server and a few other devices. I've got a Draytek Vigor 2860 which is supposed to do load balancing from what I can see, so if I end up going down that route instead then at least I have the hardware capable of doing that.

Thanks in advance.

america only ?

http://www.z1.fidonet.org/

http://www.fidonet.org/

https://www.fido.net/telecoms/broadband/

Ah - The price rather seem so expensive!

Yeah, it's the cheapest one I've seen so far though, still expensive however . I might be forced to just get two separate FTTC services and load balance them, and finally hope that it doesn't effect anything in regards to my home server and a few other devices using a block of public static IP addresses. I'm currently with Zen, but as far as I know they don't support MLPPP so I can't even do that, which brings me back to square one with load balancing and hoping it works on the Draytek.

You could drop Uno a line to get a quote.
They advertise line bonding.

Presumably upload is important to you if you are running a server? Load balancing won't help with that.

Thanks! Uno initially caught my eye a while ago but I didn't realise they did bonded FTTC. I've sent them a query, hopefully they can offer a good deal. I'm expecting the price to be a little more than what two separate FTTC services would cost, but not majorly higher like FidoNet or AAISP so far show.

Upload is important to me yes, so ideally a bonded solution would be preferable. Download is just as important too, but not in comparison to upload.

Let us know what they come back with.
You don't see much info on bonding on here.

I'm guessing the cost of the hardware required at your end may be high...

Matt said that while they've never tested FTTC bonding, it should work identical to ADSL2+ bonding (they can't test FTTC bonding as their office in Sheffield doesn't have FTTC capability). If anything there may be a few minor tweaks they need to do in order for it to work, which can be ironed out throughout the setup.

The bonding has a maximum aggregate of 80-90Mb currently with the higher end routers.

Although I don't have a line yet, we went purely by the address of where I believe I'll be moving to soon.

His estimate is as follows:
£8 per month per line for the bonding service
£22 per line setup
£59.99 per router per line, which would then connect in to the BT modem and start the PPPoE session

I imagine there's also the FTTC service package costs to add on top of that. Sounds pretty fair to me .

Edited by Ixel (Fri 11-Sep-15 23:28:44)

Yep. Thanks for that.
That's a relatively small incremental cost. Looks like they have some cheaper line rental products on the way also.

I assume the allowances from each line are combined so you may be able to step down a product level?

Sorry to bring back up the topic, but it looks like I won't be able to do Uno. I called them about an hour ago to make an order and it seems they can't do orders over the phone, so then I enquired about the line rental option as I need lines but they aren't ready for a few more weeks (I can't wait that long sadly).

I guess my only option is either Andrews and Arnold or just go for a single line and hope the speed is reasonable when FTTC is activated. I had thought of ordering line rental from somewhere, not sure where though (Pulse8 or ICUK maybe?), and then ordering FTTC from Uno via their website though I'm concerned that by doing this I could end up waiting approximately four weeks. Presumably if I ordered FTTC and line rental together I would be waiting around two weeks as I assume they can be simultaneously provided.

Any ideas or comments please? Thanks.

What exchange are you on?

SDESTBR (Eastbourne).

So you could have Pulse8broadband FTTC and phone.

I see, but does Pulse8 support bonding or would that most likely be a single line solution?

Ah! Ring and ask? 01803 864545

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

Ah! Ring and ask? 01803 864545

Thanks, I'll give them a call first thing tomorrow morning. Even if they don't offer a bonding solution, the 1 month contract for FTTC and pricing seems quite appealing. I presume Pulse8 have a good reputation too.

I haven't checked on the website, but I think they have had to impose an FTTC setup fee of £75 because too many were joining for free then moving on a month later. It was costing them a bomb.

How about this solution:
http://uk.store.sharedband.com/index.php?package=Pro...

This innovative service allows multiple ADSL. and presumably FTTC,connections to be bonded. As these can be from any ISP, the service is essentially available to any broadband user. With Sharedband�s Professional package, two lines can be bonded for a total monthly subscription of £20 + VAT. It seems the Professional option meets your needs.

However you will need additional hardware to achieve a result.

I see. Yeah I'm considering that one, it might be my best and only option.

I've just called Pulse8 this morning but they aren't sure if they do a routed block of 8 static IP addresses (which is important as I run a server here), so have been advised to email them the question.

I also called Zen Internet (my current ISP) this morning, most importantly to see if I could retain the existing line rental price of around £12 a month rather than pay the inflated price of around £17 a month, but it seems customer loyalty means nothing and I'd apparently get landed with the higher price for line rental. They did check whether the address I'm moving to has an active line however, apparently it does but they said something about they will need to either stop and then re-activate it, or I pay for a new line install (got slightly confused near the end of the call). I assume another provider has the line still.

If I do go for a bonded solution I think I'll try Sharedband over two different ISP's for resilience. For the moment I'm waiting for Pulse8 to reply to my question, if they do offer a routed block of 8 IP's then I'll go for them, though this won't be important if I do end up needing a second line as Sharedband will be allocating the IP's instead.

Edited by Ixel (Tue 29-Sep-15 11:10:57)

Probably my final update to this thread.

Thanks for the comments and feedback. Well, I spoke with Zen again today just to confirm their policy on retention and it's definitely a no. However, as I was preparing to end the call stating my intentions to choose another provider at the new address, the guy checked my account and found that I was infact paying slightly more compared to the same package and increased line rental. To get to the point, I stuck with Zen for the following reasons (at least for my first line):
- The new line install cost was reduced significantly
- Activation fee for FTTC was waived
- I downgraded my choice of plan to initially unlimited fibre 1, will check on attainable speed once it's live
- Simultaneous provide has been arranged

Install date, if I don't get an engineer no-show or a botched job from a subcontractor if one of them turns up instead, is Friday 9th October for both phone and FTTC. I've been told I'll keep my existing number but it'll have to be moved over after the line becomes available. I'll also keep my existing block of 8 routed static IP's.

I will likely try, and hopefully use, Sharedband (if I need a second line). The second line will be the one that is apparently currently active, hence why I opted for a new line install for sake of saving time despite a little more to pay for the setup. Maybe the previous tenants at the property were unable to cease the line or otherwise forgot to do so. I'm not sure who it's with but I imagine it'll either be Sky or TalkTalk.

One thing I'd like, which I don't know if it's possible, is for the existing master socket and new master socket to be located in the upstairs front bedroom rather than the living room. Is this possible to do if I ask the engineer and offer tea/coffee and biscuits ?

You ask Zen to order the (free - or was) Data Extension Kit. (Openreach call it the Home Wiring Solution).

Depending on the engineer almost anything is then possible. The ideal being re-routing the incoming connection to come straight from outside into the bedroom.

I see, ok. I did send an email to Zen querying this relocation as I forgot to mention it on the phone call. If I've not heard much back by lunch tomorrow I'll call them and see if they can amend the order. They've got to surely locate the new line upstairs anyway since I've ordered a new line and that's where I want the master socket for that line?

Edited by Ixel (Tue 29-Sep-15 23:47:05)

In reply to a post by Ixel:

They've got to surely locate the new line upstairs anyway since I've ordered a new line and that's where I want the master socket for that line?

That's a good point. If they and the engineer buy that, the coffee and biscuits could get the desired result of moving the existing one as well. Without the data extension kit.

Normally, the master for a second line is placed close to the first, as another pair in the same cable is used. So to move both could be easier than the two widely separated.

Are there any extensions that would need sorting out?

I see.

No extensions would need sorting, I don't like extension sockets or wiring .

This thread is great, I'll be giving Uno a call in a few weeks as I'd really like to get bonded lines

@Ixel when you said

The bonding has a maximum aggregate of 80-90Mb currently with the higher end routers.

Are you saying that even with 2 lines you still only get 80mb download? Shouldn't it be 160 with 2 lines?

Edited by deleted (Fri 02-Oct-15 10:05:25)

Sorry for the late response, however what I understand is that this is a limitation of the router. So even with a 160/40 connection (two lines at 80/20 each for example), the connection can only achieve an aggregate speed of between 80 to 90 megabits. A Firebrick, if it works with however Uno would do this, might be capable of more.

I wonder what router they're using.

If the solution uses MLPPP, a small x86-64 box running pfSense would probably work at full speed. Ideally you want a device with Intel NICs, as other brands have proved inferior. It's a good idea to look for a processor supporting AES-NI, as this will accelerate AES based VPNs.


For those that don't know, pfSense is a free router and firewall based on FreeBSD. Currently it is limited to x86 devices, but there will hopefully be an ARM version in the near future, allowing you to use cheap ARM boards like a Beaglebone Black as a pfSense router (the BBB would need you to use a switch supporting VPNs, as it only has one NIC).

I've recently contributed RFC 4638 support, which allows the use of a 1500 byte MTU over PPPoE with suitable hardware. This will hopefully appear in the forthcoming pfSense 2.3. I can't see any reason why RFC 4638 over MLPPP will not work, but I only have a single Zen FTTC connection. MLPPP is probably rarer these days than in the ISDN days, when it was common to bring up and drop B channels as bandwidth requirements changed.


The beauty of pfSense is that you can try it for free, by booting it on an old computer using a Live CD or memory stick. If you are happy with the results, you can go on to buy dedicated hardware.