FTTP ISP who doesn't use PPPoE and gives a static IP

Hi, is there such an ISP?

Preferably using TT Backhaul.

Edited by S2KIP (Tue 26-Jul-22 09:54:00)

In reply to a post by S2KIP:

Hi, is there such an ISP?

Preferably using TT Backhaul.

Not over Openreach.

Pretty much all Openreach providers use PPPoE with the exception of Talktalk residential and Sky.
Neither Talktalk residential or Sky offer static IP's. Sky used to but not any more.
Talktalk Business offer static IP's but they use PPPoE.

There is a service called EoFTTC (Ethernet over FTTC) that doesn't use PPP but it costs considerably more than a standard FTTC connection.
It is also usually sold as 20/20, burstable to 80Mb/s. Very few providers sell it.

If the static IP is more important to you - than a preference over PPPoe vs IPoE - and you want TalkTalk backhaul then TalkTalk Business is only marginally more expensive than the equivalent TT retail plan and comes with a static IP.

Which means Pulse8Broadband (using TalkTalk Business Wholesale) also offer a static IP address add-on for £2pm. I just checked by clicking the Purchase button against a product on the FTTP tab which gave add-ons half-way down the page.

Edited by pluralist (Wed 27-Jul-22 00:39:00)

In reply to a post by pluralist:

Which means Pulse8Broadband (using TalkTalk Business Wholesale) also offer a static IP address add-on for £2pm. I just checked by clicking the Purchase button against a product on the FTTP tab which gave add-ons half-way down the page.

Too true, but they’re way more expensive than TTB overall.

Why go to all the trouble or limit your choices in order to avoid PPPoE (which as you are finding is not really that easy or cheap to avoid it in the UK)?

There is absolutely no reason why PPPoE should cause you any issues, unless you are using some very old hardware that gets bogged down by it, and if that is the case, it would be cheaper and easier to upgrade that kit.

In an ideal world we wouldn't have PPPoE, but its transparent to most users. The only thing it might mean is your MTU is 1492, but even then it's pretty easy with most kit to change the MTU to 1508 on the router, adding 8 bytes for the PPPoE, allowing for the maximum MTU of 1500 once PPPoE is stripped of by the ISP. Even then you'd be hard pressed to notice the difference in day to day use.

Edited by E300 (Wed 27-Jul-22 08:33:29)

Do the altnets such as Swish use PPPoE?

Zzoomm don’t they use IPoE and also offer a static IP but charge £10pm

In reply to a post by smouty:

Do the altnets such as Swish use PPPoE?

You would have to check, as many AltNets only have one ISP, some (e.g. CityFibre) are wholesale to various ISPs. The ISP may choose how they connect over the network.

Don't forget TT Business FTTP prices are ex Vat and it's a 24-month minimum term with a setup fee that comes to another £1.25pm over the term.

Pulse8 is monthly contract with no setup or leaving charges, at least when migrating in or out.

TTB includes a router. Pulse8 does not. Similarly with a new installation.

So you are right if a 24-month term is acceptable, especially if the user doesn't have a suitable unlocked router.

Note . Smouty is not the OP. I missed that at first.

In reply to a post by pluralist:

Note . Smouty is not the OP. I missed that at first.

I noticed; but it is still a good and relevant question for the thread.

No, they don't use PPPoE according to another post on here from a Swish employee.

Edited by nofappingway (Wed 27-Jul-22 12:12:46)

Yes, it is .

In reply to a post by smouty:

Do the altnets such as Swish use PPPoE?

LilaConnect use IPoE

In reply to a post by pluralist:

Don't forget TT Business FTTP prices are ex Vat and it's a 24-month minimum term with a setup fee that comes to another £1.25pm over the term.

Pulse8 is monthly contract with no setup or leaving charges, at least when migrating in or out.

TTB includes a router. Pulse8 does not. Similarly with a new installation.

So you are right if a 24-month term is acceptable, especially if the user doesn't have a suitable unlocked router.

Sure. OP hasn’t specified if they need to go 30-day rolling contract, so I guess up to them to do the maths on what it would work out based on a given length of time.

YouFibre use good old DHCP

To paraphrase Scott Adams:

"Here's a nickel, kid. Get yourself a better router".

In reply to a post by Mark07:

YouFibre use good old DHCP

Happy days for you chief. However doesn’t really help the OP (unless of course they’re in an area cabled up by YouFibre).

I’d expect most (all?) AltNets that have started fresh with a ‘clean sheet’ so to speak to adopt IPoE/DHCP unless their senior network architects are in lurve with PPPoE from a former life or they’ve bought a skip load of old BRAS on eBay. I’m being completely facetious btw 🤣

Thanks everyone, some useful info. It's OR FTTP only, no alt-nets (until City Fibre come in the next few years).

In reply to a post by candlerb:

To paraphrase Scott Adams:

"Here's a nickel, kid. Get yourself a better router".

I use a combination of Untangle, Sophos XG and OPNsense, so I'm good thanks.

Edited by S2KIP (Thu 28-Jul-22 14:11:32)

I'm with an AltNet (Hey!Broadband). PPPoE. I suspect there are many more.

In reply to a post by S2KIP:

Thanks everyone, some useful info. It's OR FTTP only, no alt-nets (until City Fibre come in the next few years).

In reply to a post by candlerb:

To paraphrase Scott Adams:

"Here's a nickel, kid. Get yourself a better router".

I use a combination of Untangle, Sophos XG and OPNsense, so I'm good thanks.

Given that OPNsense supports PPPoE via an ethernet why don't you want to use it?

In reply to a post by Michael_Chare:

In reply to a post by S2KIP:

Thanks everyone, some useful info. It's OR FTTP only, no alt-nets (until City Fibre come in the next few years).

In reply to a post by candlerb:

To paraphrase Scott Adams:

"Here's a nickel, kid. Get yourself a better router".

I use a combination of Untangle, Sophos XG and OPNsense, so I'm good thanks.

Given that OPNsense supports PPPoE via an ethernet why don't you want to use it?

It's an unnecessary overhead, I'd rather avoid having to use it if I can however that doesn't look possible (for a decent price anyway).

In reply to a post by S2KIP:

It's an unnecessary overhead,

Out of interest, by how much?

PPPoE on OPNSense/pfsense are limited to a single core. Without PPPoE you can use a lower performing multicore CPU to reach the same performance normally.

My current J4125 box at 2Ghz is should be fine for a 1gbit PPPoE connection though @10w max.

Edited by smouty (Sat 30-Jul-22 12:18:21)

In reply to a post by dect:

In reply to a post by S2KIP:

It's an unnecessary overhead,

Out of interest, by how much?

Most *nix based routers are limited to single core for PPPoE, so you need a CPU with higher frequency compared to not using PPPoE as an example. This adds to the price, heat output and power usage. Okay, not a huge amount but it's still something.

Edited by S2KIP (Mon 01-Aug-22 16:39:24)

In reply to a post by S2KIP:

Most *nix based routers are limited to single core for PPPoE, so you need a CPU with higher frequency compared to not using PPPoE as an example. This adds to the price, heat output and power usage. Okay, not a huge amount but it's still something.

I wonder if there is any hardware with a propriatory ASCI (e.g. the broadcom PPP accelerator in the ASUS kit) that can handle the PPPoE and then pass the public IP over DHCP to a downstream device. Would solve all these worries.