Have you every tried talking to someone at PlusNet, I have and so far with 3 weeks of trying have never managed it.

My opinion is that Plusnet attracts additional criticism, over and above other ISPs with service problems, because they irritate people through regularly communicating a high opinion of themselves.

There is a limit to how many times people can be told how great something is, before some start testing it, to see if it stands up to scrutiny. Some of the claims Plusnet make about themselves, their products, their competitors etc, are unnecessary in my opinion, and they'd get a better reception by being more modest about themselves and their achievements.

We often discuss things from a consumer perspective, but I'm curious to know also, how other ISPs for example, regard Plusnet, when they claim to be ahead of the competition in so many respects?

They have the chance to read some of the forums. People who have gained some knowledge here and understand Eclipse can help. Personally I have done some posting on the f2s support forum, of which I am also an ex-customer, about being forcible moved to LLU. f2s simply say it is our business model (until someone sues them!) and when Pipex start the same game I will be active there. But no-one can just move from forum to forum and if you know what is happeneing at Eclipse, the pass the knowledge on and encoutage them to read up the issues here to be able to apply things there.

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Unfortunately, it's not easy to separate the two. That would be censorship. It's up to readers of the posts to make up their own minds what is credible and what is simply malicious.

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On other ISP forums I see a number of complaints, sometimes more than on the PlusNet forum, often about similar things. But I don't see the same kind of, what I would call malicious attacks on anyone who dares to say that PlusNet even now has some good things going for it. I stopped reading this forum shortly after the PlusNet reps were pulled out, because to me nothing constructive was being said.

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It was users who blew the whistle on the one way LLU migration fiasco not PN. Maybe I'm naive but I think most ISPs would have 'fessed up to losing x GB of emails.[/qoute]

I wouldn't say that anyone 'blew the whistle', but there were enough complaints and opt-outs within the PlusNet community to change things, when the situation became untenable
Both LLU and Max were a fiasco. Max because PlusNet performed mass migrations using the settings recommended by BT for very good lines, on all lines regardless of length or quality. But PlusNet did give customers the opportunity to opt out of migration to both Max and LLU in April.
A large number of customers did opt out of LLU because nobody believed that Tiscalli wholesale would be any better than retail. It was PlusNet's intention to have a number of LLU suppliers, but Tiscalli was the only one that an agreement was reached with, unfortunately.

People who opted out of LLU were LLU'd, due to the very poor communications at PlusNet. People scrambled to be put on Max regardless of their line stats, and the combination swamped PlusNet support.

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I dont know. I have no experience of Tiscali. PlusNet must like them though as they're punting a large number of their own subscribers over to Tiscali wholesale every month (without telling them first or setting up a free way out again!) The argument was made that Tiscali wholesale is a better and superior animal to the Tiscali ISP. Do you think that argument has stood the test of time?

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LLU regrades have been stopped completely.
Now, people have to ask for a Max regrade and have to say that they are aware that it could go wrong. LLU has been stopped. PlusNet are trying to solve their problems with Tisaclli, something I don't hold out much hope for, knowing Tiscalli's reputation, and trying to get other LLU partners. It is a great pity that only Tiscalli agreed to sell bandwidth to PlusNet. The other LLU supplier intended to do so, I think, has now agreed to supply Sky instead.

I do not like the way that PlusNet has moved this year. I think it is a disaster. This company is too small to compete with the mass market giants and does not have the large call centres to hold people's hands while they perform operations such as setting up email. IMHO PlusNet has to find a new marketing model if it is to survive. Obviously it doesn't want the very heavy users, the p2p leechers, because they are too expensive for any ISP to sustain. But there are markets that PlusNet can move into, or it could enhance what it always did so well, provide a good service to the technically knowledgeable.

High bandwidth users feel angry because they can no longer use most of the bandwidth for a very low price, but all ISPs that rely on BT have had to put caps into position. If somebody wants to use unlimited bandwidth 24/7 I don't think anyone at PlusNet would try to stop them, providing they paid for it all. Of course the cost to somebody downloading hundreds of GBs of 'linux' with p2p would be so high that a leased line would probably be more economic. The fact is that BT charges ISPs by bandwidth used, and the only way that companies such as AOL can allow that is because they have probably the largest number of customers using under a MB a month than any other ISP. In other words, the high cost of AOL to the masses subsidises the minority. But AOL is getting out of the UK market.

I used to be with BT broadband and it's terrible. The support was useless, and at premium rates always, the horrible Yahoo was encouraged as the home page, Yahoo was inescapable because it handled all the mail, the cap is less than PlusNet if you count the unlimited usage outside peak hours, and how long do you have to stay not to pay for that wonderful home hub. Also, BT tie you into a 12 month contract, so you can't leave if you don't like them. I still have a BT mailbox, but it became so full of spam when they started using Yahoo it became unusable. Maybe BT has changed now, but I don't think I'd go back. Too expensive after I've had to pay for all the extras that PlusNet provide as a part of their package. Anyway, why prefer a Home Hub to a Speedtouch router? At least other routers are well known, and that bit of gear doesn't exactly break the bank. I wonder if you can keep it and use it with another ISP if you migrate?

At least you can monitor PlusNet through their dial-up group. Leave BT and you have no access at all.

I'm hoping that PlusNet does find a way back, it has improved to some extent recently. But in the not too distant future the broadband market will have changed completely, and a large number of the present bunch of ISPs will have gone, in the same way that happened when the market moved from dialup to ADSL.

For now I'm staying with them, although as I said, I wouldn't recommend anyone to join. My only problems are slight niggles, far less than the problems I had with BT, and I can put up with that for the advantages I have, such as a fast connection

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Have you every tried talking to someone at PlusNet, I have and so far with 3 weeks of trying have never managed it.

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Interesting that you mention that one, because I raised a ticket to Billing a couple of days ago and had a satisfactory response within 2 hours.

"that PlusNet even now has some good things going for it. I stopped reading this forum shortly after the PlusNet reps were pulled out, because to me nothing constructive was being said."
All isp's have something going for them(even tiscalli)
What was being said by plusnet reps before they were pulled out that was constructive?
They have said a lot of constructive statements but they can't back them up with actions
"It is a great pity that only Tiscalli agreed to sell bandwidth to PlusNet."
Or was the only wholesale supplier who would sell plusnet bandwidth for a price they excepted Tiscalli or do wholesale suppliers turn away business for no apparent reason.
"IMHO PlusNet has to find a new marketing model if it is to survive."
IMHO Plusnet has to find a new business model if it is to survive(marketing is another word for spin)

"Interesting that you mention that one, because I raised a ticket to Billing a couple of days ago and had a satisfactory response within 2 hours. "

have you read the plusnet community forums at all, as from what i can see you are the only one to get an answer that quick.

perhaps you should spend your time helping people and telling them how to get a reply as fast as that instead of inciting an arguement on here. Since Plusnet have left for pastures new the conversation on here has fairly good, topical and without bickering.

I am glad that you are happy with their level of service, however if i was still a customer i would be most disappointed. But thats the opinion of just 2 people in the whole of the UK

I raised a ticket on

Your original question 7:06pm, Tuesday 1st August 2006
CSC Agent 7:21am, Saturday 12th August 2006
Your comment 10:38am, Saturday 12th August 2006
Your comment 12:38am, Thursday 17th August 2006
Your comment 12:31pm, Friday 18th August 2006
Your comment 7:12pm, Saturday 19th August 2006
Your comment 4:03pm, Sunday 20th August 2006

And as you can see still awaiting a response.

Hence the phone calls and still nothing.

Actually I almost fainted with shock when the ticket was returned so quickly.
The normal time is over a day, but at least they are far more honest with their timing, even though it is still often out by a day or so.

I've noticed that anyone PlusNet customer who posts here, admits they are a customer, and doesn't just slag them off is attacked, or feels that they are being attacked.

So I'll follow the PlusNet reps to the PlusNet forums, where people don't attack each other. I haven't posted on here for some time because the attacks were getting to be either annoying or just plain boring. I do spend my time on the PlusNet forums, where the reps do help customers if they are able to. But the fact is that some things are out of their hands, such as fixing the disaster that is Tiscalli LLU.

This forum has become like certain Usenet forums full of trolls as far as I can see from my recent browsing. But at least there are plenty of other forums here that are reasonable, and they are the ones I read. In fact I think I'll remove my notification of PlusNet forum posts, in case I'm tempted to come back.

If any customers want to have problems solved, the best forum is PUG. If anyone is a possible customer or ex customer, the dial-up forum is available for their use. Unfortunately nobody is permitted to have a good word to say about PlusNet, which still has a large number of customers.

Plusnet followed the wrong business model. Hopefully, with a more discerning customer base, having shed the ones who chase the maximum bandwidth for the minimum cost, it will get back to what it once was, the best ISP around.
It's not there yet, has a very long way to go if it survives, but I've looked at the alternatives and every one of them has something that stops me moving. The only alternative I'd consider right now is cable, which is pointless as there is never likely to be cable in my road. But cable has one very big problem. Support that is probably the worst in the business.

Hi Anna

noone is attacking you and i take on board what you say, however there are 2 sides to every story

"If any customers want to have problems solved, the best forum is PUG. If anyone is a possible customer or ex customer, the dial-up forum is available for their use. Unfortunately nobody is permitted to have a good word to say about PlusNet, which still has a large number of customers. "

dont you think that is a shame, that you cant get help on their own forums or on here, one of the largest in the UK, and that you have to register and attend PUG forums?

Yes Plusnet, have made mistakes, and yes they are trying to put things right again, but people are entitled to praise, or to criticise, thats life.

Edited by soundsystem (Sun 20-Aug-06 21:52:05)