Stable Rate

I was Max'd on Wednesday lalst week, and my router gives the following stats:

Downstream Rate: 7616 Kbps
Upstream Rate: 448 Kbps
Downstream Margin: 11 db (sometimes goes as low as 9 db)
Upstream Margin: 23 db

However, the Stable Rate page has shown 2000 ever since and shows no sign of change.

Should I be disconnecting and reconnecting regularly or not and will this make any difference? The first night I switched off and on a couple of times, but have since left it on 24/7 after being told that it should be left alone.

That seems perfectly "normal". The low MSR (Stable Rate) is because in the early stages of maxing you had a low sync (under 2500). If you now have a good connection and continue to sync at 7616, then your MSR will increase to 7000 or 7500 around the end of the week. Until then BT will restrict your "Connection Rate" (browsing & downloading will be "sluggish", comparable to a 2Mb connection).

What's your Line Attenuation (downstream)?

sb248

Edited by deleted (Sun 22-Oct-06 13:16:29)

Downsteam Attenuation is 31.

So do you think I should be disconnecting the router and reconnecting regularly or not? Plusnet say yes, most other forums I can find say no!

This happens until Plusnet receive a delta report from BT and then they will lift your speed to whatever BT reports.

If you've had no delta's after the first 10 days, then chase Plusnet, then can manually lift the cap if they have to.

Your connection figures are very good, and you should eventually end up with a solid DslMax connection.

You should leave your router on 24/7 but it's difficult to say if you'll gain anything by rebooting it. You may boost the CS (Connection Speed sync) to 8128 (the maximum), but it will be at the expense of your Noise Margin which will drop nearer the dreaded 6db limit. Some people manage to maintain good sync with a 6db NM .. I expect they're very close to their exchange and have a very good line. But if you find that a higher sync leads to disconnections (especially around 11.00pm), then you're back where you started.

Remember, what matters is your final "Connection Rate" allocated by BTw. You're never told this, but it's related to the MSR figure reported by PN. It's the "Connection Rate" that determines your actual download speeds, but then you have to factor in BT contention, and PN's extensive "management". In the end, the router sync (downstream) is not important - You just want a solid, reliable connection.

You might like to check out what BT thinks your "speed" should be at See how fast you can go ... enter your phone number at bottom right. You can also get an idea of how far you are from your exchange at the SamKnows Availability checker .. click the "Locality" button when your exchange "map" displays.

sb248

Edited by deleted (Sun 22-Oct-06 15:23:08)

BT checker says:

Our initial test on your phone line indicates that you should be able to have BT Broadband with a likely maximum speed of up to 8Mb (Megabits per second).

Good. And how far are you from your exchange?

sb248

I would guess about a mile max.

Estate is 3 year old new build so I guess it's likely BT ran new cabling into the estate.

Edited by keithmdw (Sun 22-Oct-06 20:12:07)

That sounds very good. So maybe you should "go for it" ... the best time to reboot is around 11.00am. If this is impractical, perhaps you could get someone to do it for you. There's no point rebooting in the evening. If you can get an 8128 sync, and your router can cope with the low NM values, you'll have a first-rate connection.

sb248

Thanks

No one is able to reboot the connection for me unfortunately, and I want to avoid turning remote admin on.

Guess I'll just have to live with what it gives me.

I have a couple of days off over the next week though so will make sure I drop the connection and reconnect around 11am.

I assume performing a disconnect in my router rather than just pulling the power is the best idea?

The next best time then is before you leave for work. But have a look at the NM first ... don't reboot if the NM is "hovering" around 6db.

How you reboot depends on your router. My Netgear has a software reboot option. Failing that, just power the router down, count to ten, then power back up.

sb248

Why stick it an obscure port with a password I doubt anyone is going to try hard to hack your router across the internet.

Do I have to reboot the router or is dropping the connection (ie disconnecting from the ISP) sufficient?

I disconnected and reconnected this morning at around 7am, but didn't reboot it.

Was upgraded last Thursday but still only getting 2000 as the Stable Rate. I raised a ticket with Plusnet to ask why and they just told me to reconnect daily and they would eventually get Delta Reports from BT.

Yes, you need to reboot your router to force it to resync with the exchange.

What router have you got?

What's your downstream data now?

The MSR, as reported by PN, won't change until Saturday (day 10) at the earliest, and it'll probably be later than that.

sb248

I've been on MaxDSL for months.

Last week I used the "ring wire trick" to boost my sync speed from 3500 to 5932 - and my router has stayed sync'ed and connected at this rate every since.

My stable rate still says 3000 - despite my router being sync'ed at nearly twice that for the past 5 days. I am sure this has an affect on download speeds as all my recent speed tests give speeds of no more then 2500-2700.

shouldn't the BT hardware have picked up my new sync speed by now ?? Or should I be disconnecting regularly to get BT to notice ??

Router is a Linksys WAG354G

I'll post the stats when I get home but I suspect they are still the same.

Im in exactly the same boat, I hate waiting!

Check out your router manual, but it looks like you can do either a "Hard" or "Soft" reboot direct from the Administration tab, when you login to the router. This will save you the trouble of "pulling the plug", but make sure you've got your router login details handy.

You might also like to check out Kitz's Adsl pages - an invaluable "resource" if you're going to "mess about" with your settings. For example:

- Router Stats ... check out the Linksys section

- Linksys Hidden pages

- DslMax

Also, check out the AG FAQ page on RADSL.

sb248

If you continue to sync at 5932, then your "MSR" should go back up to 5500. It's supposed to take only 3 days, but in practice I've found that it can take 5 days or more, and PN seem a little sluggish in reporting the change.

If your profile does get "stuck", then you'll have to get PN to ask BT to do it for you. James Bailey is very good at doing this kind of "favour".

sb248

Stats as of just now:

Downstream Rate: 7616 Kbps
Upstream Rate: 448 Kbps
Downstream Margin: 10 db
Upstream Margin: 23 db
Downstream Line Attenuation: 31
Upstream Line Attenuation: 18

MSR is fixed at the end of the 10 day period, unless Plusnet mean IP profile (BRAS Data Rate) when they say MSR

MSR does nothing as far as BT Wholesale is concerned with regards to fixing the speed

Andrew

Yes, of course, but the OP and myself are talking about the same thing, namely the connection rate reported on this PN page. The link itself is misleading as it includes the phrase "action=stable rate", and when it first appeared many moons ago, it was in fact referred to as the "MSR". It was argued to death in this forum at the time, and there was no consensus about what the number actually does mean. Perhaps it is the "BRAS Data Rate", but I've never seen a BTw BRAS profile, so I just don't know.

To be fair to PN, the page now reports the following:

Your current broadband speed is nnnn Kbps

What does this speed mean?
This is the speed that the network supplier is telling us you should expect on your line. If your hardware is reporting higher speeds, you can try and automatically update this speed by disconnecting and reconnecting once a day for 3 days.

No mention of MSR!

Henceforth, I will call the number the "BRAS Data Rate". Unless someone else corrects me!

sb248

Well, it looks like all your hard work seems hardly worth it!

And, to be honest, an extra 500Kbps (for a sync of 8128) is not going to significantly improve your broadband "experience". Speaking for myself, I would be very content with a stable 7616 without any disconnections. At the moment, I've got a fairly stable 7040Kbps, and my SNR varies from 10-14db during the course of the day. My LA is 38db. I'm perfectly content with that.

sb248

I will be happy with the 7616 IF my Stable Rate is increased from 2000.

Yep - that's the figure I was referring to.

Still saying 3000 this morning ... time to get onto Plusnet.

I am correct in thinking that this figure has a bearing in speed test results, right ??

It certainly will.

From my understanding of it, this rate is what you line has effectively been capped at.

So I sync at close to 8000, but the Stable Rate is 2000. So at the moment, my line is theoretically capable of close to 8000, but is limited to 2000 by BT and/or PlusNet.

Yep thats the case at the minute.

My own line stats show that its synced at 8mb but I am only getting 2mb speeds....

Yes, it's beginning to look like your "BRAS profile" is stuck.

You now face the "problem" which was debated here hundreds of times a few months ago - if you raise a ticket, PN will respond in "crib-sheet" fashion, asking you to do a multitude of speed tests, several times a day, over the course of a few days.. And they will do this even if you include in your ticket results of various tests done over the last few days!

That's why I suggested contacting a specific CS person like James Bailey who understands the problem and can take positive action on your behalf. James posts over on the PUG forum, so it might be an idea to start a thread there.

Have a look at the "sticky" posts at the top of the Nildram forum for a full explanation of DslMax and related issues.

sb248

Plus CS has actually been quite quick and good, I think, this time.

Got the following reply:

Dear Mr Brunt,
I have now changed your line profile please reboot your router in order to pick up your faster speed.

Regards,
James Kirkham

I have rebooted the router - and it is now sync'ing at 6624. The "stable rate" page is now showing 8000kbps but all the speed tests I have done since all still only at 2700-2800 ??

Have Plus CS done it wrong or is there a more "accurate" method of testing the speed I can try ??

Regards,

Adam Brunt

What is www.speedtester.bt.com saying your IP profile is?

Andrew

Keeps saying "Test Error - the system is currently busy" at the moment

Do I need to use the BT username and password on my router to access that site correctly ??

Edited by AdamBrunt (Wed 25-Oct-06 20:44:34)

Same here. Perhaps it is busy.

I can't imagine where that "BRAS Data Rate" of 8000 came from. It looks silly in view of the info you've given so far.

You might also like to try the following links:

- See how fast you can go ... enter your phone number at bottom right

- SamKnows Locality checker.
-- Enter your phone number & postcode, then click "Check!"
-- on the new page click the "Locality" button
You can now read your distance from the exchange below the map.

sb248

It is best done around breakfast time.

Andrew

The BT things said 1Mb which I know is absolute rubbish.

The SamKnows locality says 1.94km away from the exchange.

I know the current speed tests are wrong as even when I was only sync'ing at 3000-4500 (pre ring wire removal) I was getting 2500 - 3000 speed test results.

I think we can keep clicking on that link till doomsday and it still won't work!

There's a page dedicated to this "test" on the PN UserTools site. Apparently you've got to change your router ADSL login to "speedtest@speedtest_domain", and then you've got to ensure that your DNS servers (in your router) are compatible ... etc. etc. Just a pain in the proverbial.

I remember doing this test some months ago, and all I got was a download speed, similar to what you get with the AG speedtester (except of course the BT one bypasses the PN network).

Has this "test" changed recently? Does it now provide some details of your BRAS profile?

sb248

The BT site says I can get 8mb and SamKnows says Im 425m from the exchange!

Its been 6 days since Max was enabled and the speed test still says my download speed is around 2mb..... Should I be contacting PlusNet yet to query this or is it a bit premature?

My line stats are:
Downstream Rate: 7616 Kbps
Upstream Rate: 448 Kbps
Downstream Margin: 12 db
Upstream Margin: 24 db
Downstream Line Attenuation: 21
Upstream Line Attenuation: 11

Most sensible people let the router obtain the DNS addresses dynamically, so changing login is not hard.

You can get the IP profile using your ISP login or speedtest@speedtest_domain

Alas as its the one trustworthy source for the IP profile it is VERY busy.

The tester now provides your IP profile, for those who've not seen it I'll put a page up in the next few hours at http://www2.farina1.com/ipprofile (page is online - if you can't get it blame night time noise)

Andrew

Edited by MrSaffron (Thu 26-Oct-06 11:34:21)

Cheers, Andrew. My wife has been trying to tell me for some time that I'm not sensible, and of course I never believed her. Now I know!

I can confirm that the test does work, and without changing the ADSL login in my router. I've just completed the test at about 11:15am. And it's nice to see that extra info there now.

The "IP profile" value reported is the same as the "BRAS Data Rate" value given in the PN "stable rate" link. The rest of the info is the same as that given in my Netgear "Statistics" page.

Many thanks for clarifying that.

(As for messing about with DNS configuration in the router, when you've been with PN for some time and have experienced problems with web pages not opening smoothly, or not opening at all, then many of us follow the prevailing advice to switch to "OpenDNS" servers - Well, that's my excuse anyway!)

sb248

Just managed to run the test.

Got the following:

Test1 comprises of Best Effort Test:
IP profile for your line is - 5000 kbps
DSL connection rate: 448 kbps(UP-STREAM) 6240 kbps(DOWN-STREAM)
Actual IP throughput achieved during the test was - 2838 kbps

None of which tie up with Plus's "stable rate" of 8000 kbps.

I also get the feeling that the "Actual IP throughput" figure is at least 1000 kbps less than it should be ??

Stable Rate page today says:

Your current broadband speed is 8000 Kbps

I raised a ticket with PlusNet on Friday and this morning they responded by raising my limit manually.

Best speed test I have managed to get so far is 3.4Mbps though (according to the speedtest on PlusNet's site).

Test on this site gave me: 5.7Mbps up and 0.4Mbps down.