Plusnet Profile V BT's

It seems unfair that a small glitch can drop your Plusnet profile nearly instantly, but when things stabilize the Plusnet profile can take a day to catch up with BT's profile again.

P.S. Can some kind person give my Plusnet profile a kick (again) its still lower than BTs.

Lenseman.

I'll go take a look. We are looking into how to refactor the updates so there is less chance of a difference between the 2 profiles.

Do you want to drop me a PM with your username, the one on your post doesn't seem to match to an account on our side.

Edited by chrisparr (Wed 10-Feb-10 15:52:24)

Can the IP profile affect connection rate of the ADSL router?

Does this mean I need a profile "kick" as well instead of the potentially expensive BT engineer call out that has been suggested?

I'm on the ADSL2+ service and used to switch the router off regularly. I stopped that and have a profile that has gradually increased the last two weeks from 4500, 5000 to 5500 (today)*. The logged Plusnet problem is that I've been having low connection rates of ~5-6Mbps (the line according to Plusnet diagnostics on the support call say it is capable of >11Mbps) and nobody at Plusnet seem to have picked up that I'm getting higher connections and higher speeds via the BT speed tester each time the profile increases.

User name is the same as on here.

* Plusnet asked me to do tests today before booking a BT engineer and I believe this caused it to drop again to an profile of 5000 according to the BT speed tester.

Your connection speed determines your BT IP profile. The profile does not determine the connection speed.

With most ISPs, but not Plusnet, your BT IP profile directly determines your maximum actual download speed.

A lower connection speed at any time triggers a rapid fall in profile to the appropriate level.

A higher connection speed at any time causes a rise in profile, but takes from a few hours to 5 days.

When your BT IP Profile changes, Plusnet are supposed to get an update of a copy of it that is held in the Plusnet system. Sometimes that update doesn't happen, so your Plusnet IP Profile can be out of date, either higher or lower than your current BT IP Profile.

If the update fails, the Plusnet copy will only be corrected by either a successful update next time your BT one changes, or by Plusnet support manually adjusting the copy.

When your BT and Plusnet copy IP Profiles are out of step, your maximum actual download speed is determined by the lower of the two.

There is a fuller description of the BT IP Profile system on this page of my website.

My belief is because of lots of manual disconnects the line profile was downgraded artificially - i.e. that it was my fault for switching off nightly, not the line having problems - and that the nominal rate of the line is above the profile I have at the moment. Do you think there's some mileage in that as I believe returning the profile to something around 7-8000 would return the line to its original state and if I can can get a better connection I'm happy for the profile to (continue to) increase over a number of weeks?

Switching off at night is normal. Only geeks like me or people worried about a low sync speed due to switching on during or before dawn don't. Though that last point could be relevant to you.

You seem to continue to think the IP Profile affects your connection/sync speed.

It does not. End of story.

Okay so I may have made a donkey's of myself in the Plusnet support call asking that Plusnet are aware that I've been having increasing profile speeds since I started leaving my router on and believed that to be the cause of the low sync speed.

Any ideas as to why my sync speed is gradually increasing again then back to a state I had a few months ago?

In reply to a post by brownb2:

Okay so I may have made a donkey's of myself in the Plusnet support call asking that Plusnet are aware that I've been having increasing profile speeds since I started leaving my router on and believed that to be the cause of the low sync speed.

Any ideas as to why my sync speed is gradually increasing again then back to a state I had a few months ago?

The most likely explanation is that way back you had a short spell of something bad happening, like many disconnections in a very short time. Thunderstorms are a very common reason, and we had a lot of those a few months back.

That can send your "target" noise margin up. That reduces your connection speed. Given good stability after that, and not switching off at night is a good idea so maybe you did the right thing for the wrong reason , then in the same way as the systems raised it, it should lower it in 3dB steps at intervals of 10-14 days. When it does that it will cause your router to re-sync at a higher speed.

That seems to describe what you have been experiencing - it didn't occur to me before due to the confusion of which is boss - profile or connection speed. Without knowing what your noise margin has been over the period we can't know.

If you read these two pages on my website I explain as well as I can noise margin and problems with it:-

How the noise margin works.
Noise margin problems.

You might also find the Ring/Bell wire and Miscellaneous Nasties pages in the Troubleshooting section useful.

In reply to a post by brownb2:

....That seems to describe what you have been experiencing...

I've copied your whole reply verbatim to Plusnet on the support call as although it's clutching at straws it sounds plausible and preferable to an engineer visit. I'll sit and twiddle my thumbs a bit now for Plusnet to catch up on my call.

Hi brownb2,

I agree that that is most likely the cause of the slow speeds on the line, which tests are showing is still apparent (there's a lower threshold breach showing on the line, you're in sync at 5706kb/s and the fault threshold on your line is set to 7952). Provided this is still apparent when the engineer turns up (and he is able to replicate the issue with his own hardware) we'll at least get something that we can use to push for resolution and at best the fault will be resolved.

If you could let us know when you're available for the engineer to visit we'll get it booked for you as soon as we can.

As discussed in private this appears to have raised my sync rate to 8792Kbps which I'm perfectly happy with (I signed up for 8Mbits not ADSL2+ speeds ) however the "IP profile for the line" still shows 5000 according to the BT speedtester and actual download throughput is around 4500Kbps - whether the profile has anything to do with the price of fish I don't know. I'm just waiting on feedback to see what happens next.

Today it seems my line profile is 7150 according to BT and my sync connection is slightly lower at 8187 (router had frozen so had to reconnnect) yet I still can't get more than about 4500 in speed tests - almost like it's being throttled somewhere. Looking at the sync speed it's in ADSL 1 territory despite being ADSL 2+ (confirmed on the line), is there a magic button somewhere that someone can press to release the brakes? When I signed up I was getting 7616 and 8128 connections and near 800Kbyte/sec download.

I assume your 'Current line speed' shown in the Member Centre here has yet to update to 7150kbps. That should update automatically but it takes 12-24 hours for that to occur.

Until that increases your download speeds will remain unchanged.

Your profiles now both match, try a reconnect on your router if you don't see the higher speeds immediately.

Looking at your line it is on ADSL2+ but only syncing at 8128, hence the 7150 profile.

I logged into the router tonight to find that the sync rate has dropped to 6186 from 8128+ yesterday and my profile according to BT speed tester is 5500 again. It seems that during disconnects by Plusnet on my line today it's affected the BT profile significantly.

HOWEVER.... in general due to Plusnet moving my (their) profile upwards I've got a better speed - but it's still not what I had on ADSL 1/20CN and (if I get this right) if Plusnet's profile for me remains at 7150 I believe in two weeks time I should start seeing 8000+ connection speeds again due to BT's profile automatically increasing?

In reply to a post by brownb2:

I logged into the router tonight to find that the sync rate has dropped to 6186 from 8128+ yesterday and my profile according to BT speed tester is 5500 again. It seems that during disconnects by Plusnet on my line today it's affected the BT profile significantly.

HOWEVER.... in general due to Plusnet moving my (their) profile upwards I've got a better speed - but it's still not what I had on ADSL 1/20CN and (if I get this right) if Plusnet's profile for me remains at 7150 I believe in two weeks time I should start seeing 8000+ connection speeds again due to BT's profile automatically increasing?

I know this has been said half a dozen times, but your profile, BT or Plusnet, does NOT affect your connection speed, it's the other way round!

In reply to a post by kasg:

In reply to a post by brownb2:

I logged into the router tonight to find that the sync rate has dropped to 6186 from 8128+ yesterday and my profile according to BT speed tester is 5500 again. It seems that during disconnects by Plusnet on my line today it's affected the BT profile significantly.

HOWEVER.... in general due to Plusnet moving my (their) profile upwards I've got a better speed - but it's still not what I had on ADSL 1/20CN and (if I get this right) if Plusnet's profile for me remains at 7150 I believe in two weeks time I should start seeing 8000+ connection speeds again due to BT's profile automatically increasing?

I know this has been said half a dozen times, but your profile, BT or Plusnet, does NOT affect your connection speed, it's the other way round!

My bad - having read the kitz page it makes a bit more sense.

Edited by brownb2 (Thu 18-Feb-10 20:21:10)

Some pages from Kitz to look at when you've time:-

........... IP / bRAS Profile

........... BT's 21CN - FAQ

At this point I think I'm going to give up or have a BT engineer to come out - it just looks like my margin has return to 12dB and BT profile down to 5000 again due to the worsening sync rate and I'm not sure its worth much more hassle for the extra +2.5Mbps I used to have. TBH I'm pretty frustrated at the whole thing because I'm paying for, but not getting the full benefit of, the Pro service on a 1.5 year contract but at the end of the day it's just not worth the stress for a support call going on for over a month.

Below also follows an odd brief 30 min drop in speed taken at 12:05am (shortly after speed tests returned to ~4800Kbps):

2Mbps My Broadband Speed
My Broadband Speed Result

1.2Mbps Thinkbroadband


5.4Mbps BT Speed Tester (the profile lowered again - note router connected for 30 hours straight currently):
Download speed achieved during the test was - 5414 Kbps
For your connection, the acceptable range of speeds is 600-7150 Kbps.
Additional Information:
Your DSL Connection Rate :6185 Kbps(DOWN-STREAM), 445 Kbps(UP-STREAM)
IP Profile for your line is - 5000 Kbps
The throughput of Best Efforts (BE) classes achieved during the test is - 16.94:23.68:59.38 (SBE:NBE:PBE)

Router Stats (noise margin increased):
ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 6186 kbps 445 kbps
Line Attenuation 36 db 11 db
Noise Margin 12 db 21 db

Edited by brownb2 (Fri 19-Feb-10 01:11:27)

It seems at ~12am (when it becomes free to download) speed drops to around 1Mbit or less and I'm guessing this is probably just a case of no real prioritisation advantage on the Plusnet Pro package during this time.

Router stats (I'm happy to say now fixed by a BT engineer - during the day bandwidth is fine - I'm just waiting for the BT profile to raise gradually from 5500):

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 8267 kbps 439 kbps
Line Attenuation 36 db 11 db
Noise Margin 3 db 23 db


0.5 Mbits Think Broadband:


0.9 Mbits My Broadband Speed:
http://www.mybroadbandspeed.co.uk/results/18254861.png

BT Speed Tester offline this evening (no result)

Plusnet's Speeds showing identical "line speed" for all packages after 12am:
http://www.plus.net/support/broadband/speed_guide/do...

Added to the fact the Pro is £19.99 has 20GB usage quota and Premium £11.99 package now has an 80GB usage quota it seems Plusnet really don't appear to be treating Pro customers right.

Also - why when I look to change packages is Plusnet Premium £15.99 a month when Plusnet advertises it on the front page at £11.99?

Edited by brownb2 (Sun 28-Feb-10 10:00:20)

In reply to a post by brownb2:

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 8267 kbps 439 kbps
Line Attenuation 36 db 11 db
Noise Margin 3 db 23 db

is it just me or does his upstream attenuation look a bit low at 11db when his downstream is 36db ?

In reply to a post by Ianph:

In reply to a post by brownb2:

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 8267 kbps 439 kbps
Line Attenuation 36 db 11 db
Noise Margin 3 db 23 db

is it just me or does his upstream attenuation look a bit low at 11db when his downstream is 36db ?

It's been like that as long as I can remember - upload speed doesn't bother me too much (around 40-50KByte/s). Noise margin was low when I took this reading - it usually hovers between 5-6dB

Sort of, but more to the point why hasn't he got a far higher upstream sync, as he is clearly on ADSL2+.

In fact, given that noise margin, the downstream sync is still poor.

In reply to a post by brownb2:

Also - why when I look to change packages is Plusnet Premium £15.99 a month when Plusnet advertises it on the front page at £11.99?

http://www.plus.net/support/broadband/products/faqs_...