why is LLU not equivilent? if i take the box to another house (which has sky) will this be ok to get out of this initial problem?

Edited by ni_mike (Wed 29-Aug-07 17:26:35)

its 99% probably that the problem is down to your telephony provider, if you are on talk talk and its LLU then it violates SKY's terms and conditions, which state a BT line rental is required (or equivelent). LLU is not equivelent as WholeSale Line Rental, as you are using their technology at the exchange, and not Wholesale (universal) technology.

It sounds to me as though this is another FRIACO problem. The Sky number is probably an 0808 series and that won't connect through CPWN because most FRIACO numbers are terminated by BT and require agreement between TT & BT to connect them outside the PSTN. I had a similar issue with a dial up internet access number that TT resolved.

It would be in Sky's interests to keep their competitors networks incompatible with the Sky box. Sky will probably be telling their customers you can't have broadband with TT and continue to receive Sky television! Best get Sky BB instead!

this is exactly what i was trying to say in an earlier post. The thing is, with BT and wholesale , there is something called SELECT SERVICES, and services which require CLI. Unfortunately, on LLU some of these services are not available, so, an 0808 number would be returned at Unknown / With-held, etc. SKY TV services on the telephony equipment, for use such as PPV, would require CLI.

FRIACO has nothing to do with CLI. CLI is standard on the CPWN LLU network.

BT only connects FRIACO calls at specific ports on their network and there are not very many of them nationally. If a non BT network like cable or TT wishes to send a FRIACO call to BT for termination, then it is up to the sending network to route the call to the correct BT transfer port.

This is why dial up access numbers are often different from cable or BT lines. I suspect this may be the OP's problem not CLI or select services.

Are you saying then that there is still a residential billing relationship between LLU and BT ? If so, would that be BT retail as the call would surely terminate at the suppliers LLU equipment and then carried over the LLU suppliers CPS (such as Opal) - even though they are owned by TalkTalk, they are still a supplier.

If there was a billing relationship for end user via LLU supplier and BT Wholesale, dosnt that bring up questions in regards to Equivelence Of Input etc ? I.E BTRetail being in the dark, as well as other SP's of non LLU ?

FRIACO calls are separated from PSTN calls. All Telcos have to carry voice calls between each other's networks or the phone system would not work. Flat Rate Internet Access Call Origination calls could block up telephone networks for hours as they are free calls paid for by subscription. Hence there are a number of limitations with using them from non BT networks. Basically TT and BT need to agree terms for each number used such as where the calls will be ported and how much is paid by the originator to the terminator.

When the FRIACO call stays on BT network throughout there is no problem (or it is just BT's problem). As most other ISPs use BT for calls, only cable and TT have difficulties with FRIACO.

*another day, a little more educated*. Why couldnt I learn all this from my previous employer ?

1st line CS don't know what FRIACO is. To get my FRIACO problem resolved I had to email Mr Dunstone and one of his directors called me back. Even he didn't know why it wouldn't work on LLU. However it started working about three weeks later. Luckily dial up internet access is on its way out. I suspect Sky will be putting their broadband router in their Sky TV boxes in future and the compulsory phone connection will not be needed.