New lines TalkTalk (openreach question)

Hi having a new line fitted with talktalk on Thursday it will be a second line my first ones with sky my question is what will they do and what do i need to do

Will the second line be a new line from the pole to the house or do they use the same cable as the first line (would prefer a new cable the current ones damaged so screws my attenuation up and gives me a slower synk than i should get but i cant prove it and im not paying 150 quid for an engineer to come see lol)

if its the same line do they need access to the current NET5 socket if yes i need to move a big book shelf befor they get there

(If anyone's wondering how i know my current lines iffy, a few months ago the main BT cable in the ground in the street got damaged but it only knocked me and 1 other person off the engineer accidentally got mine and the other persons lines mixed up,
Were both on sky so my modem synced and the attenuation had dropped to 31 from 38 and it ended up on 14meg vs the current 8-9 then when he switched the wires back around to put the phone numbers back to the right property's i was back on my line an the attenuation shot back up to 38 lol) but i cant prove that so sky say nothing can be done and the i get what my speed estimate was lol)

so oh well fingers crossed i get a second cable thats better haha.

Thanks for nay info

Ash

Edited by acpsd775 (Tue 15-Nov-11 06:16:54)

if the drop wire to the property has a spare pair that meets voice spec then that will be used.

Possibly not the drop wire itself at fault, but an alternate routing somewhere in the network, i.e. your line does not neccessarily take the same router back to the exchange as a neighbours.

when i had an engineer out in 2004 he found a place in the wire just before it entered the house where it had kinda rusted. I think because of the age of the wire he replaced the whole wire from the pole.
Seems like alot of extra work to go through just to fix a break, but maybe this was policy with certain age wires etc. Thinking back I think this wire was just a twin core like bell wire, so that might have been the reason also.

Previously had a 2nd line in another house and the engineer lady just added to the master socket (wasnt nte5), because there was an available 2nd pair. Broadband didn't exist then though so I don't think she had to do many tests on the wire to see if it was viable.

So I think NTE5 access is necessary, yes

In reply to a post by Myth:

when i had an engineer out in 2004 he found a place in the wire just before it entered the house where it had kinda rusted. I think because of the age of the wire he replaced the whole wire from the pole.
Seems like alot of extra work to go through just to fix a break, but maybe this was policy with certain age wires etc. Thinking back I think this wire was just a twin core like bell wire, so that might have been the reason also.

Previously had a 2nd line in another house and the engineer lady just added to the master socket (wasnt nte5), because there was an available 2nd pair. Broadband didn't exist then though so I don't think she had to do many tests on the wire to see if it was viable.

So I think NTE5 access is necessary, yes

here's a pic of inside my NTE socket not a good one because of were it is its hard to get to, Do you think thats the 1 with 2 pairs or with 1 pair and bell wire ect ive had cable for 16 years so never looked into BT's wiring lol that sockets only been there since march so id presume its newer cabling altho the cable from the pole to the house has been there since the 70s he just joined the old cable to the new cable with a joiner thing.

i think in long run i best move the book shelf though just in case he needs access, although i dont want the second line near that socket its goin to the other side of the house lol.


@ MrSaffron
not sure about taking a different route but we both connect to the same cabinet and both our wires go the same route to the cabinet from the pole i asked the engineer, maybe after the cabinet to the exchange its diff i dont know most of my neighbours get around the 30 attenuation mark though it would just be my luck though that my line goes way out of the way haha.

Ash

Edited by acpsd775 (Wed 16-Nov-11 00:05:13)

here's a pic of inside my NTE socket not a good one because of were it is its hard to get to, Do you think thats the 1 with 2 pairs or with 1 pair and bell wire ect

You are looking at the end of a CW1411 two twisted pair No. 12 dropwire -- the orange & white wires are the first pair and the green & black wires are the second pair.

In reply to a post by burakkucat:

here's a pic of inside my NTE socket not a good one because of were it is its hard to get to, Do you think thats the 1 with 2 pairs or with 1 pair and bell wire ect

You are looking at the end of a CW1411 two twisted pair No. 12 dropwire -- the orange & white wires are the first pair and the green & black wires are the second pair.

thanks for that it was confusing the line what was in the house when we moved in that was disconnected in 1995 had 6 wires in all completable diff colours lol (the old socket was still on the wall with about 10CM of cable left in it only reason i know lol)

so basically theyll should use the same line then wich also probably means ill end up with a lower atten on that line too

just to show these are the diffs between mine and neighbours (im 99% sure that both lines take identical routes engineer told me were mine went and one told them were theirs went. (i also now a few more ppl on same pole as us 2 with starts are more less same as my neighbours too)

theirs

Uptime: 0 days, 19:10:55 DSL
Type: G.992.5 annex A
Maximum Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 1,291 / 14,974
Bandwidth (Up/Down) [kbps/kbps]: 1,287 / 11,918
Data Transferred (Sent/Received) [kB/kB]: 0.00 / 0.00
Output Power (Up/Down) [dBm]: 12.0 / 19.0
Line Attenuation (Up/Down) [dB]: 16.5 / 30.5
SN Margin (Up/Down) [dB]: 6.5 / 6.0
Vendor ID (Local/Remote): TMMB / BDCM
Loss of Framing (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Signal (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Power (Local/Remote): 0 / 0
Loss of Link (Remote): 0
Error Seconds (Local/Remote): 56 / 0
FEC Errors (Up/Down): 36 / 270,236
CRC Errors (Up/Down): 36 / 759
HEC Errors (Up/Down): 908,448 / 563

Mine

System Up Time: 22:01:36
Port Status TxPkts RxPkts Collisions Tx B/s Rx B/s Up Time
WAN PPPoA 26033 24723 0 1251341 17822064 03:34:42
LAN Down 0 0 0 0 0 22:01:36
WLAN Up 50350 31256 0 34029607 14497709 22:01:17
ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 8392 kbps 796 kbps
Line Attenuation 37.5 dB 20.5 dB
Noise Margin 6.9 dB 12.0 dB

sorry mines a little muddled up the sky router stats dont copy as past right easy lol

Edited by acpsd775 (Wed 16-Nov-11 03:22:18)

In reply to a post by acpsd775:

thanks for that it was confusing the line what was in the house when we moved in that was disconnected in 1995 had 6 wires in all completable diff colours lol (the old socket was still on the wall with about 10CM of cable left in it only reason i know lol)

I remember. You told me about that in a different thread, some months ago!

so basically theyll should use the same line then wich also probably means ill end up with a lower atten on that line too

I guess it really depends upon where you would like the new NTE5/A to be sited.

The various wiring options would be:

(1) wire internally from the second pair at the back of the first NTE5/A to the location of the new NTE5/A
(2) wire externally from where the dropwire (from the pole) reaches the house
(3) provide a new dropwire from the pole to the house

Just because I've identified a CW1411 two twisted pair No. 12 doesn't mean that the older length, from the pole to the outside of your house, has a spare pair. Maybe the installing engineer will decide to replace that length and, thus, take off the feed for the new NTE5/A at the external junction, as (2) above.

Perhaps the best you can do is to explain where you would like the new NTE5/A to be sited, ensure that the big bookcase is still in front of the existing socket and be prepared to provide mugs of tea / coffee, chocolate / custard-cream biscuits, bacon sandwiches, etc.

I remember. You told me about that in a different thread, some months ago!

Ah yea so i did lol

The various wiring options would be:

(1) wire internally from the second pair at the back of the first NTE5/A to the location of the new NTE5/A
(2) wire externally from where the dropwire (from the pole) reaches the house
(3) provide a new dropwire from the pole to the house

Just because I've identified a CW1411 two twisted pair No. 12 doesn't mean that the older length, from the pole to the outside of your house, has a spare pair. Maybe the installing engineer will decide to replace that length and, thus, take off the feed for the new NTE5/A at the external junction, as (2) above.

hmm this all gets confusing lol i hope they do option 2 or 3 be much easier on me but as we no communication engineers do best for them not us haha, The side of my house is going to look like spaghetti junction when ive done lol there's already 9 cables running round the side of it + the new line haha

Just because I've identified a CW1411 two twisted pair No. 12 doesn't mean that the older length, from the pole to the outside of your house, has a spare pair. Maybe the installing engineer will decide to replace that length and, thus, take off the feed for the new NTE5/A at the external junction, as (2) above.

Hmm i think i best nip to the super in the morning ready for Thursday and get stocked up lol were running on empty at the moment 2 teabags and a dreg of milk left ha.

Ash

Hmm i think i best nip to the super in the morning ready for Thursday and get stocked up lol were running on empty at the moment 2 teabags and a dreg of milk left ha.

Please don't buy everything -- leave some for me! I also need to do some grocery shopping but my current, main, priority that I hear my bed calling me.

I'll check back once the job has been done on Thursday and you've updated this thread with all the details.

In reply to a post by burakkucat:

Hmm i think i best nip to the super in the morning ready for Thursday and get stocked up lol were running on empty at the moment 2 teabags and a dreg of milk left ha.

Please don't buy everything -- leave some for me! I also need to do some grocery shopping but my current, main, priority that I hear my bed calling me.

I'll check back once the job has been done on Thursday and you've updated this thread with all the details.

ok ill leave a few bits just for you lol there coming between 1and 6 although last time it say that he was banging on my door at 9 lol ill update once hes gone

Ash