I've just been fed this [censored] from eclipse - HELP!

Hi, I need help
I regaded to an 8meg line at the end of July and for about 4 weeks I was getting a steady 1700Kbps (I'm only supposed to get a theorectical max of 2000Kbps due to the distance from the exchange) and a peak of 2200kbps! Then I began getting an unstable line. It wouldn't disconnect but when the line was very active the status light would intermittantly flicker red and the line would slow down for a bit. So eventually eclipse reported that BT have implemented a "fix" and to monitor my line speed. Come some 8 weeks later and I'm still complaining to them that my line speed has nearly been halved since the "fix". I was asked to run a barrage of tests thoough BTs speed checker and the usual equipment check and reported back to them. This was their stunning reply

Dear Mr Forden,

Thanks for running the tests as requested. On the new service there isn't any contention values of 50:1 instead the service works based upon the product that you are on. Looking at your connection speedtest results they would seem to be a good indication of what your line is capable of. Currently you can't get faster speeds due to something called a B-RAS profile that is current on every new ADSL line. It is built into the BT system in an attempt to prove a more stable service.

The B-RAS profile comes into effect whenever you connect to the exchange at a rate lower than you have during the past three days. Whatever speed you connect at will mean that you are limited to that speed for the next three days unless you again connect at a slower rate.

After the three days the capped limit will be removed by BT. As this is a feature built into the hardware in the exchange there is no way to remove this capped limit, all we can advise is to wait for the three days to pass and hopefully you will have connected at higher rates during the period and so you should get faster speeds once again.

However looking at the recent history of your line this may just be what your line is capable of getting.

Kind Regards,

Andrew Joy
Technical Support
Eclipse Internet

My reply was

Then explain why my line rate is estimated at 2272 kbps and up until BT "fixed" the problem on my line I was averaging 1800 Kbps and peaking at 2200 Kbps. I'd rather they put it back the way it was than suffer the
"speed cap" being imposed now. I wasnt aware my service was capped anyway, I [censored] well wouldn't have accepted this limitation. What if I was really unlucky and it connected at 200 Kbps or slower I'd be stuck at that for 3 days. This service is disgusting!

I never signed up for a service that has a speed cap, they never said there was one. What the hell are they talking about, what can I do?

Thanks

David

Like it or not, Eclipse are correct in stating there is a speed cap.
There's one on every single ADSL connection (fixed speed, or 'max').
Where Eclipse have fallen down, is in not explaining it too well.

If you have a product that uses BT: -
The way ADSLmax works is your equipment (i.e. your router or modem) negotiates the best possible connection speed with the BT equipment in the exchange, such that a minimum 'noise margin' is achieved at the time of connection (the clearance between the available signal and the noise on the line).
The BT monitoring systems check the speed you're connected at (your 'sync') and they set a 'BRAS profile' according to your connection speed. This BRAS profile limits the maximum flow of data, such that t'internet doesn't try and feed data through quicker than your line can support (to avoid bottlenecks).
The BRAS profile (apart from the lowest 256kbps speed), increases from 0.5Mbps in steps of 0.5Mbps. When your connection speed exceeds the next threshold, and has been seen to be stable there (the three day delay thing), your BRAS profile will be increased, and your data speed will go up accordingly.

FYI the lower step sizes (I won't list them all, as you only connect at low speeds): -
Sync above 1152Kbps; BRAS profile = 1Mbps
Sync above 1728Kbps; BRAS profile = 1.5Mbps
Sync above 2272Kbps; BRAS profile = 2Mbps
Sync above 2848Kbps; BRAS profile = 2.5Mbps
Sync above 3424Kbps; BRAS profile = 3Mbps

What you appear to have missed, is ADSLmax is an "up-to" 8meg product.
It doesn't mean you'll get 8Mbps.
The speed you get is entirely dependant on the length of your 'phone line, the state of your internal 'phone wiring, and the amount of interference on the line.
This is all explained (but carefully hidden away, and quite vague) on ISP web-sites.

Your challenge is to improve your sync speed.
There are a number of things you can do to eliminate your internal 'phone wiring.
Starting with your master BT socket.
If it's the newer split-front type, take the lower front cover off. Inside you'll find a 'test' socket. Take a micro-filter and your router, and plug in there.
See if your sync speed (you'll need to access the web-interface pages of your router) increases.
Post here the connection stats you currently have, and the ones with the router connected into the master's internal test socket.
Particularly interested in downstream connection speed (may be called 'bandwidth', or something else), downstream line attenuation, downstream noise margin.
Will also help if you can post your upstream connection speed (just in case Eclipse have left you on a fixed speed product - it does happen).

We'll be able to help more, once you've done the above tests, and posted the results.

Hi Adebov
Sorry, I'm obviously not making myself clear enough. I am well aware that I wont get 8meg broadband, but I did state that my the theoretical max speed on my line is 2meg. I upgraded as I was getting 256 kbps on the 1meg service, eclipse acknowledged there was an issue with service on this and since the 8meg is a little cheaper and promised a faster connection i went for that. It was tanking along fine for a few weeks then became unstable. Since this was fixed its been [censored].

I have been directly connected to the master socket since eclipse asked me to run the tests the other day.
Eclipse reckon my current line rate is 1,728 kbps allbeit that was on the 20/09/06 and my estimated stble line rate is 2272 kbps.
I don't know what my router sync speed was last week, but I have been regularly using adslguides speed checker and one from namesco both were showing averages of 1200 kbps. I can tell you now that in the few days of being connected to the master socket, not once has this speed improved.

Currently my router downstream is displayng as 2144 Kbps and upstream as 448 Kbps.

namesco bbmax test result 1252kbps up and 339kbps down
adslguide test result 304.6kbps up and 322.5kbps down YES 304.6 not 1304.6!!
these 2 tests were run at 20:50 pm

the 5 tests i did on bt speedtester over the weekend averaged at 950kbps and peaked at 1151kbps.

hardware info for the record
Broadband Hardware: Netgear DG632 Modem Router software version V3.6.0C_38
Connection Method: Ethernet
Computer Operating System: Macintosh OSX 10.4.7
Browser: Safari 2.0.4

My main issue is that I didn't know about BRAS when I signed up to the 8meg max service. I wasnt told about it until now 2 months later and sorry for repeating myself but I was getting blistering (well for me) speeds for 3 weeks before there was a so called fix implemented on my line.

I hope this information is helpful to you.

Thanks

David

What are your router stats?
As often the 'fix' involves increasing the target noise margin, which leads to a more stable but slower connection.
Odds are, this is what's happened.

You'll note, from my signature, I'm currently suffering a 2Mbps (or more) speed drop for the very same reason.

You don't say if you're connected into the internal test socket, or just plugged into the front.
Do you have a filtered face-plate, are you using micro-filters, have you disconnected the ring wire (3) and it's useless partner (4), as neither of these are required if you use micro-filters.
Any wired extensions?

Edit: still need to know your router stats - can't tell much without them.
For example, my line can only support 1.5Mbps (according to BT), yet it can sync at over 4600kbps with the right noise margin in place.

Edited by adebov (Mon 25-Sep-06 21:01:53)

Adebov
I am connected directly into the inside of the socket via a filter not into the faceplate.
Ring wire 3 and 4 ????? dont want to mess with the master socket.
I do have one hardwired extension but that hasn't caused any issue so far. Plus no phones are connected while i'm testing here. Same as when I've been testing the line for eclipse.

I thought I had stated my router status in my last post (2144 down 448 up) what other info do you need?
my MTU is 1458 and my connect mode is G.DMT
now i'm just guessing

BTW why is adsl guides speed test telling me i'm getting 300k down?
David

Line attenuation and Downstream SNR margin ?

I dont see this information on my netgear router.

Where do I look please.

Those stats indicate you are on 'max'. One of the 'buttons' on the router webpage will take you to a small stats pop-up window. In there you'll find line attenuation and noise margin figures.

I'm a bit confused by you being connected into the test socket inside the master, yet still having an extension wired. Normally the extension would be connected into the face-plate.

As for wires 3 & 4, wire 4 is not used (but is often connected by electricians), wire 3 is the old 'ring wire' which was used to make the telephones ring. Most modern 'phones don't need it (in any case a micro-filter has a ring circuit, so replicates the ring voltage locally).
Both these cables can drag in interference from the outside world (ADSL frequencies happen to be the same as AM radio).
You are permitted to add/change/modify connections from the face-plate onwards. The only thing you shouldn't be doing, is taking off the rest of the master socket and mucking about with the 2-core cable coming in from BT.

As a guide, when I first "upgraded" to ADSLmax, my Netgear router was sync'd at 1600kbps (not even enough to take me above 1Mbps data speed). I moved the router to the master socket, fitted an ADSL filtered face-plate, and disconnected '3' & '4' from every 'phone socket in the house.
Bingo! Router sync at 3600kbps! An extra 2Mbps just by modifying my internal 'phone wiring (and with no help, at all, from Eclipse).

Ive hardwired the extension directly into the connections on the board inside the socket. Into the little split blade connector thingies.

I still cant find the attenuaton and SNR figures anywhere on my DG632, i would appreciate any help finding this out.

I will diconnect 3 and 4 now and see what happens.

cheers

david

God, i'm stupid, the extension is hardwired into the faceplate which is now of course not connected!

DOH!

reconnected everything, faceplace included minus 3 and 4 and reconnected to the extension in my room not the test socket. (Dragging a emac into the lounge to plug into the test socket is a pain in the ass!)

Sync speed is now 3328 down and 448 up

But the speed tests are still only giving 1152 down and 361 up????

Is this because of the BRAS?