Master Sockets

1.Why would there be two master sockets?
BT Line enters house and splits into two directions at a little box with a BT logo each one goes to a Master socket. There is one phone line active in the house available from both sockets so it is NOT two different phone lines.
2. Would BT have done this?

Edited by deleted (Tue 28-Jul-09 17:07:39)

Are they both modern NTE5 Master Socket's ?

...and yes there's also a very good chance it was done by a previous owner!

If they are real masters then the previous owner/occupier may have had 2 seperate lines (not that uncommon pre-broadband) .
They may have stopped one line then rewired the internals to the remaining line to use it as an extension.

They both look like that pic and both have test sockets inside.

Hmmm...
How does the line "spilt into two"?

Is one 'Master Socket' daisy chained behind the other?

Are any extensions connected when you remove the faceplates?

Some photos would be handy

Tiny little bt box above the door is the entry of the bt line into the property. Bt written on it and a single screw in the middle.
Out of that box comes two lines, one out of the left and one out of the right.
Left line goes to master socket by the door. Nothing connected to this master socket no extensions sockets or anything.
Right line leads to identical master socket in next room. Line leads off of this socket to extension sockets x2 in living room

Edited by deleted (Tue 28-Jul-09 19:08:58)

In reply to a post by annie96:

Tiny little bt box above the door is the entry of the bt line into the property. Bt written on it and a single screw in the middle.
Out of that box comes two lines, one out of the left and one out of the right.
Left line goes to master socket by the door. Nothing connected to this master socket no extensions sockets or anything.
Right line leads to identical master socket in next room. Line leads off of this socket to extension sockets x2 in living room

A good clear description. Why this has happened is not clear, and whether BT did it is not clear either. If the connections to the little box above the door are all made on the backplate which has the test socket, then it is 'normal'. But if either of the frontplates is wired to the box above the door, there will be something bent about the installation.

Assuming it is 'normal', the left socket and its wiring to the box above the door could be removed if you have no use for it.The pedantic will insist on reminding you that BT must do this job.

My clear explanation was completely wrong.
I have just dismantled the bt logoed entry box thing and was amazed to discover it simply contained the two ends of the wire and some weird little red circle things about the size of my little finger nail. Nothing leading into it from any other source. I was told it was the entry point when I moved in. Obviously not. SORRY

The one on the left of the door must be the entry point but why would bt put in a second master socket running off of the first (seperated by the bt box) and then two more sockets (daisy chained) running of of that.
Why wouldn't you just run a continuous line instead of that weird tiny junction box thing?

I'm so fed up with this thank you for helping.

Edited by deleted (Tue 28-Jul-09 20:00:23)

In reply to a post by annie96:

My clear explanation was completely wrong.
I have just dismantled the bt logoed entry box thing and was amazed to discover it simply contained the two ends of the wire and some weird little red circle things about the size of my little finger nail. Nothing leading into it from any other source. I was told it was the entry point when I moved in. Obviously not. SORRY

The red circle things are probably crimps which connect the wires within each cable to the corresponding wire in the other cable, which suggests it might be a BT job

The one on the left of the door must be the entry point but why would bt put in a second master socket running off of the first (seperated by the bt box) and then two more sockets (daisy chained) running of of that.
Why wouldn't you just run a continuous line instead of that weird tiny junction box thing?

I'm so fed up with this thank you for helping.

There was probably a good reason for doing it at the time. Is any of it causing you a problem?

I'm with O2 (new customer) first week or so was brilliant. But I noticed the router was dropping out and reconnecting during the night. Then I found I couldn't access certain websites. Then yesterday I was getting drop outs regularly throughout the day. The o2 wireless box thought it was connected to the internet but it wasn't. O2 thought it was their infamous loss of rooting bug, which 1st line staff deny is really exists and secondline staff say is being worked on.

They did a line check early this morning when I rang them again and said their bt line check software was telling them to report the fault to bt. They promised the engineer would go to the exchange not my home and I wouldn't be charged. He turned up unannounced here this afternoon I didn't know who it was so didn't answer the door.

I don't want to be charged because o2 don't care. They didn't do anything else just the line check. Then the pass it on to bt who are infamous for charging people. O2 say they won't but they keep contradicting each other. And they say the don't know what this earth compact fault is that thats what the bt software told them.

Edited by deleted (Tue 28-Jul-09 20:18:57)

I would really want to get to the bottom of it from my end before letting an ISP call in BT, which if it is at anyone's expense it will be at yours.

So, linestats is where to start, and if these are not good, then you need to try in the test socket nearest where the phone line comes in. If they are still poor, then get BT involved via the ISP. But if they are OK, then BT are out of it and your problems are with O2

'Earth compact' fault means nothing. Is it an 'earth contact fault'? If this is the case, then get them to repeat the test with your front plate removed from the test socket. If the fault still shows, it is on BT's network and their problem to fix. But if it goes away, it will be in your wiring - either you find and fix it or you pay BT. to do it.

So o2 are lying when they say I won't be charged?
I managed to set up my netgear earlier and the internet is back up now. I still can't access a few random websites which other 02 customers can.

I'm not a tech what am I supposed to do o2 refuse point blank to investigate it at all just say bt want to see your line. I have no clue what is causing the various problems.

System Up Time 03:52:35
Port Status TxPkts RxPkts Collisions Tx B/s Rx B/s Up Time
WAN Static IP 56398 74835 0 920 4966 03:36:56
LAN 10M/100M 79249 76291 0 4914 1133 03:52:31
WLAN 11M/54M 6995 0 0 138 0 03:52:26

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 16506 kbps 1360 kbps
Line Attenuation 30.0 db 17.1 db
Noise Margin 3.9 db 3.2 db

Edited by deleted (Tue 28-Jul-09 22:31:59)

In reply to a post by annie96:

So o2 are lying when they say I won't be charged?
I managed to set up my netgear earlier and the internet is back up now. I still can't access a few random websites which other 02 customers can.

Lying? Misleading you with call centre ignorance spoken with complete confidence more like.

I'm not a tech what am I supposed to do o2 refuse point blank to investigate it at all just say bt want to see your line. I have no clue what is causing the various problems.

Sorry to say, those without a clue are doomed to fork out for their incomprehension. Supply of internet to you involves the ISP and BT, one is intent on doing the least themselves to avoid cost, the other is intent on doing something, anything and getting someone else to pay. Until you can sort out which one is responsible for your problems, you are at their mercy.

Text

1 23 45 67 89 10

System Up Time 03:52:35 Port    Status  TxPkts  RxPkts  Collisions      Tx B/s  Rx B/s  Up TimeWAN     Static IP       56398   74835   0       920     4966    03:36:56 LAN     10M/100M        79249   76291   0       4914    1133    03:52:31WLAN    11M/54M         6995    0       0       138     0       03:52:26  ADSL Link       Downstream      Upstream Connection Speed        16506 kbps      1360 kbpsLine Attenuation        30.0 db         17.1 db Noise Margin    3.9 db  3.2 db

The noise margin looks a little low, but the speed is high enough. None of this points to BT, it all points to the ISP.

I really appreciate your input. And it seems to have settled (for the moment it is running perfectly) the past few hours.
I have heard of BT engineers doing their thing at the exchange and then making out they need to go to the persons home so that they can do a call out charge. I wonder if that has happened here. Or maybe I am being paranoid. It wasn't pre arranged they just turned up today, I didn't answer the door because I didn't know who it was. Then the internet seems to settle down. Should I sit tight? O2 are ringing me tomorrow because I refused to let them book the engineer to come back here until I know that I have no other option.
What else should I do in the mean time router record wise.

Oh and I changed my dns servers to opendns ones and I can access all websites again.

Edited by deleted (Tue 28-Jul-09 23:28:35)

As a first step, you need to identify which is the true master socket

If the one that is an extension is wired correctly, it should not work with a phone connected when you have the REAL master socket faceplate removed.
A case of trial and error here really

I'd suggest you try the router in each test socket behind the faceplates and see which one if any give you a connection. Then when it's plugged into the one that it hopefully connects with, plug a phone into the other socket and you should not have a dial tone.

If you do get a dial tone, your internal wiring is wrong and this is likely the cause of your problems

If an engineer visit is still required, ensure you have the router connected to the master socket or more ideally the test socket when he / she comes. If the test socket is used, this means that it is completely BT's responsibility and you will not be charged

I've probably missed something, but this should at least point you in the right direction in terms of ruling out a fault that is your responsibility to fix / get fixed

I already know the answer to that actually, amazingly. Because when the helpful O2 guy the other week had me testing all the sockets for the best connection the other week (when my internet connection was all hunkydory) I had the phone in an extension when he told me to put the router in the test socket. And he said the phone might cut out and it did.

Plus the MS on the left (the real one) is embedded in the wall and does appear to have wires hidden in the concrete rubble in the hole behind the faceplate.
The one on the right (the dummy one) only has wires to it come from the BT connector box thing and go out to the extensions so it must lead back to the one embedded in the wall (the one going off to the left of the bt connector box thing) because it can't be fed a signal by an extension.

Does that make sense/answer the question?

I didn't realise it had any significance until you asked this question

Edited by deleted (Tue 28-Jul-09 23:57:25)

All looking good.

Now, if you haven't done so already, connect the router to the test socket for a few hours to see if you still get the drops.

Is the router normally connected to the master socket or the extension socket?

You should also examine the connections into the back of the facelates on both sockets. There should only be a wire going into terminals 2 and 5

See here for more info
http://yarwell.blogspot.com/2005/08/adsl-tweaking.html

It may be possible that the fault was between your house and the exchange and the engineer fixed the fault and thought he would check from yur end that things were OK. O2 should be able to give you an update on the fault and whether BT need to re-attend.
Provided that the router is connected to the socket, you will not be charged

I already removed the third wire from both the real and the pretend master socket. Before I changed to O2 I had only removed it from the real one. But when I removed it from the dummy one last week I got a 1.45mb increase in speed.
The router is connected to the extension because connecting it to the master one would involve buying an ethernet cable of 15 metres long because my computer won't recognise my wireless card and the master socket is at the end of a hall way by the front door. And leaving the door open constantly (not realistic) and having it trodden on constantly.

If some websites work, and not others, then the issue is most likely nothing to do with the DSL part (the telephone line), but more to do with O2 DNS servers, or your computer and how its configured

The OP did have a DNS issue

Wasn't helped by O2 support giving out duff information