REIN REIN go away....

Hi

For the past few weeks i have had alot of issues with my adsl2+ service. I used to be able to get a nice 16.5mg connection and something has started playing up with my line.

I have narrowed it down to two things.

1. Could be REIN.

2. Crosstalk (on TT llu service so guess they crammed in)

This is usual for me, please see the screenshot http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/anothe...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/again.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/untitl...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/router...

On the last screenshot the complete drop was my resyncing.

This happens at random times. Usually goes back to normal from 11pm to 3am then drop back down 3db from 7am to 9am then sits like that for the whole day.

Could this be rein or crosstalk? I have no internal wiring and have been using the test socket (aswell as a adslnation faceplace filter. I have had my entire house power off connected with a usb modem to my laptop and get the same results so not my house causing the issue.

I have tried the tuning in a AM radio to 612Khz and walking around but iat night i only get a french lady and the only real noise maker is the plasma telly however its far away and this is on even when line stats return to normal.

Im running a DG834 GT with DG Team firmware with my snr dropped to 50%. I have tried with a 12db snr with my isp and this same issue happens. I have tried around 6-7 filters (3 different brands) and 3 routers (all netgear 2 GT's and one v5)

Any ideas, struggling to find the problem.

thanks

ADDED: my old stats from DEC 08 (only ones i can find!)

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 17264 kbps 1017 kbps
Line Attenuation 31.0 db 13.8 db
Noise Margin 4.8 db 9.4 db


Current stats

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 14765 kbps 1020 kbps
Line Attenuation 31.5 db 15.7 db
Noise Margin 5.7 db 10.4 db

Edited by deleted (Wed 24-Nov-10 04:01:06)

this morning...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/wedmor...

very odd as it usually drops for the entire day and does not recover until 11pm-3am

edit: spoke to soon

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/wedmor...

Edited by deleted (Wed 24-Nov-10 09:30:17)

Neighbours, Factory or Office block down the road, traffic lights, temporary roadworks and generator, Christmas lights. There are plenty of things which could cause the additional noise. Your problem will be tracking them down.

Any distance i should be looking at? Im residential with no office blocks etc near me and detatched (by about 4-5 foot) from my neighbour. The other side is just farm land so not alot to go on.

Writing a letter to my 6-7 closest properties to see if they can match up the time to the noise but not holding my breath on a response.

Is this a rein problem or crosstalk?

My guess would be noise - and a constant source rather than a specific impulse/burst that can cause loss of sync.

Given the times - it could, for example, be a very noisy central heating pump or pump in a garden water feature.

Where is the cabinet? I have seen roadworks adjacent to a BT cabinet and a large generator sitting there pumping out horrendous RFI which was almost killing all connections through the cabinet.


Can you see the bitloading graphs for your router at the different times?

here is my green cab, around 150meters away, no works happening however there is the sub station for this area as you can see here

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geo...

My bit loading is here dont know if this is what you need

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/bitloa...

Grab some bit loading graphs when all is clean and when you have the drop. Compare the two and you may see some additional notches. Work out the frequency they are at and then use your MW radio at that frequency.

Just in front of the substation is a duct cover which could be BTs. That would suggest cables running past the substation and very close to power cables exiting.

Try the radio outside the substation at good and bad times and see if the noise is any different.

okay thanks.

Any idea why the sub station would cause this? Different requests for power for the area?

I've been chasing something similar since 2006! Never found the suspect, robs me of around 9dB
Totally random, the 'noise' is on virtually all the time, just once in a while it will go for a few hours or even a week.

noise-off

noise-on

DMT-View

dam, im only loosing 3-4db and that is doing my head in.

Just got the mrs to drop off 6 letters to the closest neighbours....

im sofa bound, had my gallbladder out on Monday morning!

Ouch, get well soon

A real long shot - times could correspond with local load increasing, thus voltage drops, auto tap switching on the transformer kicks in to increase voltage, arcing contact, plenty of RF noise. Although I would hope the supply company would be on top of that. This is why I suggest using the radio right outside the substation. That will give a good indication that it might/might not be responsible.

Looks like a distribution unit so will most likely be fixed tap. Still could be chucking out noise though, dodgy core lamination's, even circuit breaker contact arcing.

My reasoning is that the problem starts early morning and stops last thing at night. Day in Day out ... which the OPs graphs show. If it was a fixed tap then the problem would be continuous. The location of the BT cabinet and duct so close gives reason to suspect it.

Some local distribution points do switch taps - father-in-law used to design transformers for use in power distribution and he has come up with some real horror stories.

Not saying they don't exist but they are not that common and generally industrial consumers on their own feeds.
Most distribution units have an off load manual tap changer compared with primary sites which are automatic on load, allows for easier voltage control from a central location otherwise you run into issues with the distribution unit competing with the primary.

As I said could be a noisy transformer core, switchgear contacts or bushings arcing or maybe a dodgy joint.

here is a dmt screenshot of what it should look like. Seems to be the higher frequencies effected.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/dmt201...

I know this is not the solution you would like to here, but have you tried forcing a different adsl mode during the times the noise/interference is affecting your line ? (switch from adsl2+ to g.dmt? or adsl2) as the frequencies will be different on the other 2,and there fore maybe be unaffected or less affected,i have a rein type issue also, i would switch mode as i suggested but for whatever the reason the easynet exchange kit doesn't or didn't like it, (ie it locked me to adsl g.dmt) until i got it manually swapped to adsl2+ again

"I have tried the tuning in a AM radio to 612Khz and walking around but iat night i only get a french lady "

Not REIN then.

Just noticed and im not sure if this can point me in the right direction but it seems the higher frequencies are affected.

ie from around 1690kHz to 2000KHz. The wierd thing is from 5pm today it was okay until now, 11pm.

My snr seems to be better at night then during the day which is opposite the usual issue.

After suffering from Rein for almost 2 years in 2007 in Bradley Stoke, we (Paul Hucklbridge fro OR and myself) eventually found the cause to be a tripler in a portable television half a mile away. It was wiping out 100% of the signal for >1000 people. So don't automatically think it's your neighbours, anywhere along the line will kill it.

To find it nice and quick (yes, we had another occurence about a year later, this was a bad telephone answering machine wall-wart), found this one in an hour. You really need to get the AM radio out, you have to pick a frequency (I found around 600Khz to be good) that gets a nice loud buzz when you get the rein issue. Stick the radio right next to the phone socket. Make sure it vanishes completely when rein stops.

Then I'm afraid to you need to trawl ebay. Your after an ADF, mines a Nova-tech 'Nova-Pal'. I paid about 20 quid for it. Dial in the same frequency to this as your am radio. Next time the rein hits, power it on and get your shoes on. Turn the gain up full and start walking in the direction of the highest signal, then back the gain off until you find the exact source. I could trace it to within a meter, but you can usually narrow it down to one or two houses in about 10 minutes. Then be polite to the occupents! You need to work with them, usually they are suffering from issues themselves.

Incidently using a normal AM radio to do this is useless as they all have agc, you can spend years walking on top of phone lines and get nowhere (I did!).

Good Luck!
Tim

Here is a google link to a picture of the unit I have:
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://pmimage...

thanks for the info....

do you fancy a drive up to shropshire, you seem a expert lol

Will keep my eye open for one of those, i am getting to the point of just accepting it and carrying on.

The problem i have is i am in a very rural area, getting anyone to notice something here is pritty hard as they (no offense) are mostly not technical minded and when they have adsl installed, as long as it works they are happy.

Edited by deleted (Tue 14-Dec-10 11:43:03)

Where abouts in Shropshire are you?

I don't think you are in my area (TF2) because we cannot get ADSL2+ but my line has gone from a steady 5,600kbps to 4,200kbps and BT will do sweet FA about it.

The line will sit at 5,120kbps until 10:30pm (always 10:30pm, summer and winter) and then bang, from a 5db SNR to nothing it re-syncs. Looking at the router stats graph the line is pretty much straight on 5db and then it dips to zero.

It is not every evening. I have had it running at 5,120kbps for 3 nights and then the noise comes in.

in wem (sy4)

Its doing my head in.

Why not just use triangulation?

That is very strange.

Just make sure BT cannot blame any of your kit if you log a call with your ISP. It costs a fortune if they blame you.

yeah, not even bothering ringing my isp (TT LLU) as i know they will class it within spec so no point.

Wish i could find a cheap piece of kit that can find it.

Well if you do find something please let me know because it has been an issue I have never got to the bottom of.

just noticed that my snr is higher at night then during the day. Obviously something is on during the day causing it as this is opposite to what it should be.

Line of site, i m 250 meters from the industrial estate so guess thats a good suspect of issue. I will monitor over christmas and see if i get a more stable connection leading to them not working over the festive period.

ouch

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/help.jpg

fed up with this now, down to 13mg to keep stable.

Hi

It is probably cross-talk plain and simple, if it is any consolation your ADSL connection will be dropping the speed of those causing you issues, however they will be unaware of this if your connection is always on of course as their line never looks any different.

I get the same now, used to be able to get around 14Meg at 9db SNR, now have to settle with 13Meg at 6.5db. Overnight I'm back to normal, but at some point during the day the crosstalk starts, this will be because they are turning their ADSL router off overnight.

The problem is ADSL is being taken up by more and more people, and those of us on ADSL2+ via LLU a long time before BT upgraded to the same were enjoying next to no crosstalk over half the frequency space, now that is changing.

Regards

Phil

What is your attenuation?

i assume crosstalk will only effect people on my msan and people with lines in close relation on the msan or will it be people in my local area, im struggling to find out what is considered near end and far end crosstalk.

I have another bt master socket and tempted to give sky a try...they are the latest LLU operator and are very new and i wouldnt think have many users on the msan. I can then cancel my current TT contract.

4 out of the 7 wireless networks i cna see here is TT so guess they are pritty saturated.

Edited by deleted (Sun 19-Dec-10 17:06:17)

Can you hear interference on a MW radio?
What frequencies are affected? Both DMT and Routerstats have a tone graph...

Hi

Cross talk happens mainly in the cable between you and the exchange, your pair eventually at some point joins a big cable that might have 50/100/150 or more pairs of cable all bundled up together. If you have a few pairs that are running smack against yours with ADSL you'll get crosstalk enough to be able to tell if those people have their router switched on or off! Near end and far end just depends on your perspective, but basically you get different levels of cross talk on upstream and downstream.

Changing provider will not change your route back to the exchange. The only option is a pair swap, where BT will put you on different pairs which may be suffering from less crosstalk, but also it might have more! There may be no spare capacity to do this easily and unless you have severe problems like no broadband at all due to a fault, then BT are not going to go to this trouble I wouldn't have thought. Even if you get a swap and it is better, there are no guarantees that the pairs of wire you are now neighbouring don't get broadband in the near future.

My fixed attenuation at 300KHz, the measure BT use, is around 27db, router reported attenuation is 35db and despite the slowdowns that hasn't changed.

My sync speed jumped from 13Meg up to 17Meg during a local power cut, as I have a UPS I was able to stay on line, but of course everyone around me were disconnected and my crosstalk disappeared along with other electrical noise. This is basically the negatives of using decades old technology and cabling, it's a miracle it works at all.

Regards

Phil

i struggle to find any noise on 612 as i get french radio station at that frequency.

here is a screenshot when things are okay
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/dmt201...

and here is when it goes downhill
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/bad.jpg

note the sync speed cheers

In reply to a post by Lemzip:

i struggle to find any noise on 612 as i get french radio station at that frequency.

here is a screenshot when things are okay
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/dmt201...

and here is when it goes downhill
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/bad.jpg

note the sync speed cheers

612 is unaffected according to that graph. The Gaps box - cut off in the picture - shows the affected frequencies that you should monitor.

Gap1 474kHz-479kHz (Tone110)
Gap2 548kHz-552kHz (Tone127)
Gap3 811kHz-815kHz (Tone188)
Gap4 824kHz-828kHz (Tone191)
Gap5 1048kHz-1052kHz (Tone243)
Gap6 1255kHz-1259kHz (Tone291)
Gap7 1501kHz-1505kHz (Tone348)
Gap8 1682kHz-1690kHz (Tone390-Tone391)
Gap9 1755kHz-1764kHz (Tone407-Tone408)
Gap10 1824kHz-1833kHz (Tone423-Tone424)
Gap11 1898kHz-1906kHz (Tone440-Tone441)
Gap12 1936kHz-1941kHz (Tone449)
Gap13 1971kHz-1979kHz (Tone457-Tone458)
Gap14 1997kHz-2001kHz (Tone463)
Gap15 2005kHz-2018kHz (Tone465-Tone467)

These gaps are mostly always present, they seem to be the higher end, any reason why?

My radio only goes up to 1500kHz so those higher frequencies are out of my reach however i cannot be getting so much rein from all those different freqneucies all of a sudden? I can almost remember the day things got bad and its been the same since.

Edited by deleted (Sun 19-Dec-10 18:09:03)

Looks like the noise is affecting you from Tone 243 upwards, with most damage at the top. Is there no audible MW interference at those gaps?

nothing that stands out on the radio that i can find any different to when there is no issue and i cannot tune to anothing above 1500 which is where most of the issues are but that is the higher end of the adsl2+ spectrum

Could it simply be crosstalk or would that show something different on the dmt stats?

Edited by deleted (Sun 19-Dec-10 18:43:50)

I'd imagine that cross talk would affect all frequencies, not just higher ones.

Have you set up a think broadband quality meter? just to see if that shows the problem too, if like mine it will show it as packet loss,due to the error rate, looking at the router stats graph, i can see that your snr has dropped and you say that the sync has also dropped or been capped by tt ? usually the isp will increase the target snr in a bid to increase stability, but this in a lot of circumstances only will decrease the sync speed,the line can still be as bad, mask rather than fix,(call out bt openreach) that's what a lot of isp's are guilty of, i can for an isp's view point see why ,but surely that's one of the downsides of being an isp. take the ruff with the smooth and get it fixed for the customer btw, there is an app that you can also see packetloss with called pingplotter pro, it's free to d/l and you can use free fore the trial period

Edited by tommy45 (Sun 19-Dec-10 18:52:15)

will set that up.

DLM is off on my line and my profile is set to 6db interleaved so thats me seeing the snr drop to low and having to resync as i get no data coming through.

The poor or no throughput could also be down to the isp or it's network as well,

In reply to a post by tommy45:

The poor or no throughput could also be down to the isp or it's network as well,

or the router

no, the snrm drops to under 1.5db and just takes ages to load a page, the router keeps sync but its practically useless.

In reply to a post by Lemzip:

no, the snrm drops to under 1.5db and just takes ages to load a page, the router keeps sync but its practically useless.

Some routers can cope with that. What router do you have?

DG834GT with DGTeam firmware (think 23o)

Hi

Those gaps are due to bit-swapping. The higher frequencies are affected more by noise, at some point perhaps for a tiny period of time they can't carry any data reliably, so they are turned off, those tones will not get re-enabled again until a resync. The data those tones were allocated to carry are moved elsewhere, and this results in your SNR lowering. Over time your SNR can erode enough that the modem drops the line and resync's, the tones come back into use until they are switch off again. This is all completely normal behaviour, and is why quite often ADSL lines drop and resync, it is what they are designed to do.

Looking at your graph and the shape of it, you have cross talk from a neighbouring pair/pairs.

Walking around with a radio isn't going to help, and you'll pick up noise from everywhere, just place it up against your router!

Regards

Phil

well if it is crosstalk i presume there is little i can do about it, i guess getting my other master socket enabled with sky llu with make little change and i will get the same issue as they are all served from the same street cabinet.

Could even make your issue worse.

yep, guess i have to just live with it.

ahh well, i have settled on what seems to be a current stable 14mg so will leave it at that, considering its free i cannot complain

In reply to a post by Lemzip:

yep, guess i have to just live with it.

Well you can manage your own cross talk, but turning one of the two routers on or off appropriately! You'll be able to test this....

the other line is not active and it will end up costing to much for what im loosing out on so will give that a miss

"i struggle to find any noise on 612 as i get french radio station at that frequency."

As I mentioned at the start of the thread, if you are hearing the French station on 612, then it is highly unlikely to be REIN.

Have you located and cleared REIN faults in the past ?

nope, never had this issue before

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

"i struggle to find any noise on 612 as i get french radio station at that frequency."

As I mentioned at the start of the thread, if you are hearing the French station on 612, then it is highly unlikely to be REIN.

Have you located and cleared REIN faults in the past ?

To the BB router that is noise

In reply to a post by Lemzip:

here is a dmt screenshot of what it should look like. Seems to be the higher frequencies effected.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/Lemzip/dmt201...

I guess you are using DGteam firmware and have tried to go for the fastest speed. Unfortunately, that also takes you into the area of least stability. Seriously I would suggest that you back it off a couple of dB to say 5 or 6, you will find that you will get a faster throughput and more stable connection.

Faster sync is rarely fastest throughput. All lines have a limit which no matter what you do or whose door you knock on you cannot improve. That is one of the problems of living in an age that relies on Radio Frequency Transmissions.

Try winding the SNR back and I suspect that life will be easier and throughput will be better.

Merry Christmas, be well be happy.

i do understand about running the line to the limit however it never used to have this dip in snr, hence me noticing it so quickly, i can still remember the day and the time it happened.

these where the previous stats and at around 8pm at night so when snr is struggling.

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 17264 kbps 1017 kbps
Line Attenuation 31.0 db 13.8 db
Noise Margin 4.8 db 9.4 db

Now, 14700 kbps is my stable speed that i can run 24/7, a long drop from 17000 kbps.

In reply to a post by Lemzip:

i do understand about running the line to the limit however it never used to have this dip in snr, hence me noticing it so quickly, i can still remember the day and the time it happened.

these where the previous stats and at around 8pm at night so when snr is struggling.

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 17264 kbps 1017 kbps
Line Attenuation 31.0 db 13.8 db
Noise Margin 4.8 db 9.4 db

Now, 14700 kbps is my stable speed that i can run 24/7, a long drop from 17000 kbps.

Now I wonder if the change happened about last September/October?

No, think it was the 18th November around 12 in the afternoon. Just out of luck we thought our telly was on its way out (1 yr old plasma) as it kept on producing a very bright light at night every so often, no set time etc would just happen. It took us a few weeks to find what was causing it as it happened to quick and felt like it was just in the middle of the room, i told the mrs it was aliens but it turns out we noticed it while watching telly. I just said if it goes we can get anothe rone as its under extended cover. Anyway, just out of interest, the same light happened tonight and i was watching routerstats at the same time and it actually caused the snr to jump back up to normal.

I am certain its not my telly etc as i have done testing with all electric off but im wondering if my telly could be picking up the initial turn on/off or even i was tempted to suggest, the next door neighbour swopping channels on sky tv as i have noticed it looks like he has had a second box installed and instead of the cable running round the house, it runs from the front, over the roof tiling and then to the back room. Im unsure when he had this installed but it is recent and i have read that some sky boxes are terrible...however this is just a wild guess.

I am going to wait till tomorrow and see if the telly does the flashing and i think if you have telly or radio problems ofcom will come out and investigate...i hope im getting closer. We do talk and know each other pritty well however just when we are outside sorting garden out etc so if i do think it could be him i will just ask if i could do some testing.

might be on a solution, not sure but snr is back to normal until tomorrow, this should be the lowest snr time in the cycle but for me its my highest time until morning then it drops again.

Today also had a different pattern suggesting someone has done something different today as its Christmas.

Edited by deleted (Sun 26-Dec-10 00:05:37)

Lemzip,

Thanks, What I suspect is your interference has changed because the height Ionosphere has changed as it does between winter and summer. Radio waves bounce off the Ionosphere hence its height depends on whether they reach you or miss you. In addition, this evening the air pressure has risen quite sharply, this also affects whether you get interference on the TV, hence the bright light, although it could also be a set fault.

I would guess come next May your BB problem will have died and your sync level picked up and come the winter it will be back.

Do you live on the south coast by any chance?

nope far from it, shropshire west midlands.

Radio waves bounce off the Ionosphere hence its height depends on whether they reach you or miss you.



if someone suggests that to me on a job ill faint.

agreed but i do get the french lady at night on 612kHz all the way to shropshire.

However i query my router with routerstats every 5 seconds and the change would not be so sudden as it obviously is. I doubt my issue is anything with the expected drop in snr at night, this is certainly noise caused by a device.

Edited by deleted (Sun 26-Dec-10 00:54:58)

you will need to raise it with your provider and get an sfi job booked.

mention to the engineer you know what you are on about and ask him to raise it with rein department. its a very difficult process though, sometimes taking weeks to track down a source.

In reply to a post by andyboygsi:

Radio waves bounce off the Ionosphere hence its height depends on whether they reach you or miss you.



if someone suggests that to me on a job ill faint.

Ah, so you don�t believe that radio waves bounce of the earth's ionosphere How do you think terrestrial RF transmissions get around the world, and why do some broadcast stations change their frequencies dependant on the time of day.

Remembering that ADSL2+ uses the frequency range 100Khz to 2.2Mhz, any radio frequency transmission within those frequencies that arrives at your router input affects the ADSL2+ signal. One of the worst in the UK is the Droitwich transmitter on 1.5 MHz (199 metres), 612 KHz is 489.5Metres.

When you listen to the French Lady the signal is probably varying in strength, because the Ionosphere layers are changing all the time.

Perhaps this might help

When a radio wave reaches the ionosphere, the electric field in the wave forces the electrons in the ionosphere into oscillation at the same frequency as the radio wave. Some of the radio-frequency energy is given up to this resonant oscillation. The oscillating electrons will then either be lost to recombination or will re-radiate the original wave energy. Total refraction can occur when the collision frequency of the ionosphere is less than the radio frequency, and if the electron density in the ionosphere is great enough.

The critical frequency is the limiting frequency at or below which a radio wave is reflected by an ionospheric layer at vertical incidence. If the transmitted frequency is higher than the plasma frequency of the ionosphere, then the electrons cannot respond fast enough, and they are not able to re-radiate the signal. It is calculated as shown below:


where N = electron density per cm3 and fcritical is in MHz.

The Maximum Usable Frequency (MUF) is defined as the upper frequency limit that can be used for transmission between two points at a specified time.


where � = angle of attack, the angle of the wave relative to the horizon, and sin is the sine function.

The cutoff frequency is the frequency below which a radio wave fails to penetrate a layer of the ionosphere at the incidence angle required for transmission between two specified points by refraction from the layer.

Also this might help

Radio frequencies and their primary mode of propagation
Band Frequency Wavelength Propagation via

VLF Very Low Frequency 3�30 kHz 100�10 km Guided between the earth and the ionosphere.

LF Low Frequency 30�300 kHz 10�1 km Guided between the earth and the D layer of the ionosphere.

Surface waves.

MF Medium Frequency 300�3000 kHz 1000�100 m Surface waves. E, F layer ionospheric refraction at night, when D layer absorption weakens. (ADSL2+ uses upto 2.2MHz)

HF High Frequency (Short Wave) 3�30 MHz 100�10 m E layer ionospheric refraction.
F1, F2 layer ionospheric refraction.

VHF Very High Frequency 30�300 MHz 10�1 m Infrequent E ionospheric refraction. Extremely rare F1, F2 layer ionospheric refraction during high sunspot activity up to 80 MHz. Generally direct wave. Sometimes tropospheric ducting.

UHF Ultra High Frequency 300�3000 MHz 100�10 cm Direct wave. Sometimes tropospheric ducting.

SHF Super High Frequency 3�30 GHz 10�1 cm Direct wave.

EHF Extremely High Frequency 30�300 GHz 10�1 mm Direct wave limited by absorption.

Edited by deleted (Sun 26-Dec-10 10:40:32)

meh, happened again today but times have changed.

Was happening from 22:30 to 12 and now its gone again, most certainly not just the usual snr drop at the evenings. I live in a detatched house by about 2 meters. The next door neighbour is the obvious one and then the house next to him which is a set of 3 semi (which he is the one end) has moved out, the other is occupied.

fed overhead or underground

underground at my property.

this has probably been asked, what real world effect is it having on your connection?

Just the drop in speed, other than that its the same (but annoying)

This happens to me (and my neighbours) 2 or 3 times a week:

http://img43.imageshack.us/img43/6374/screenshot003f...

You can see the effect it has on the connection. (Red line is sync speed.) The neighbours with Sky and BT are permanently DLM'd to 2.5 Mb or less. Two of us on other LLU (TalkTalk and C&W) are able to recover to circa 5Mb.

BT/Openreach REIN engineers are aware but the randomness of the noise burst has defeated them so far. It is very noticeable on an off-tune AM radio and appears to be strongest above the BT junction box next door.

Mine line has been up at 5120kbps for 9 days, just checked the stats and it's gone back down and the router stats graph is all over the place.

Everyone is back at work today. Hmmmm

No overhead lines around here at all.

Edited by wolvesmad (Tue 04-Jan-11 17:32:32)

i have played with the rein aspect and its not easy at all. thankfully the area rein guy is smarter than my wife and usually hits it on the head after a bit of work.

9 mins of noise. you would need to be very lucky to be in the right spot at the right time.

In reply to a post by wolvesmad:

Mine line has been up at 5120kbps for 9 days, just checked the stats and it's gone back down and the router stats graph is all over the place.

Everyone is back at work today. Hmmmm

No overhead lines around here at all.

doesnt have to be power lines, and the source doesnt need to be in your immediate area.

There are no overhead lines around here at all. All lines leaving the exchange are underground.

just noticed something, today my line has been fine (obviously someone back at work etc) anyway its gone downhill again now so either someone turning a device on or crosstalk.

There was no issues with these tones earlier, however they now have issues, is this a sign of crosstalk or noise?

It seems the higher adsl2+ frequencies.

Gap8 1682kHz-1686kHz (Tone390)
Gap9 1751kHz-1760kHz (Tone406-Tone407)
Gap10 1824kHz-1833kHz (Tone423-Tone424)
Gap11 1893kHz-1902kHz (Tone439-Tone440)
Gap12 1966kHz-1975kHz (Tone456-Tone457)
Gap13 2001kHz-2014kHz (Tone464-Tone466)
Gap14 2040kHz-2044kHz (Tone473)

In reply to a post by andyboygsi:

9 mins of noise. you would need to be very lucky to be in the right spot at the right time.

That particular noiseburst lasted 1 hour 35 mins. It was very bad for the first 9 minutes; although the router managed to resync after that the connection was almost unusable (very high error count) until the noise stopped.

Very interested to find this thread...

Early last year we had one of those letters telling us that our electricity supply would be out for two hours or so.

We were out when the switch off happened, but arrived home to find our Sky Box on the blink (it wasn't connected to the 'phone line). I mention this because of the high co-incidence factor with what I'm about to write...

A few weeks after the switch off, II noticed that my sync had dropped from our usual 8128 to around 6500.

I've been unable to re-establish my former 8128, despite trying various routers, connecting to the master socket etc...

So, what precisely did the National Grid (or its contractors) do to mess things up for us...?

Bridgnorth, Shropshire.

SPD.

Has you Target SNR increased? That would explain why your sync has dropped.

My overhead power lines were replaced by EDF in December. My phone line shares the same pole. They managed to 'nick' my phone wire while they were working I had a feeling something would happen! (just my luck)

My stats/errors etc. were all over the shop when it rained(sic - see thread title ) BT changed my cable from pole to house and things seem fine again

On Wednesday, my stats were:

Downstream 6528, Upstream 896. Noise 6.1 down and 11.0 up. Attenuation 23.0 down and 9.0 up. Output power down 19.8 and up 10.7.

I was switched to 21CN on the 5th, but hadn't requested a move to ADSL2+.

Strange that tonight, my downstream connection is now 11534 and my up is 1083.

SPD.

In reply to a post by Hatari:

Lemzip,

Thanks, What I suspect is your interference has changed because the height Ionosphere has changed as it does between winter and summer. Radio waves bounce off the Ionosphere hence its height depends on whether they reach you or miss you. In addition, this evening the air pressure has risen quite sharply, this also affects whether you get interference on the TV, hence the bright light, although it could also be a set fault.

I would guess come next May your BB problem will have died and your sync level picked up and come the winter it will be back.

Do you live on the south coast by any chance?

It has got nothing at all to do with the height of the layer, and there is no real winter/summer change. The layer that reflects MW radio signals is broken down by sunlight, and since the layer over us receives less sunlight in the winter, the destructive effect on the layer is less this time of year. As the amount of sunlight that the layer is exposed to increases as spring/summer approaches, the effects on the layer will increase.

In reply to a post by zebedeee:

It has got nothing at all to do with the height of the layer, and there is no real winter/summer change. The layer that reflects MW radio signals is broken down by sunlight, and since the layer over us receives less sunlight in the winter, the destructive effect on the layer is less this time of year. As the amount of sunlight that the layer is exposed to increases as spring/summer approaches, the effects on the layer will increase.

Sorry to disagree with you, but as someone who made use of the variation of the various layers for communications purposes, you�re not correct. The height of the reflecting layer determines where the signal will come back to earth. It acts similar to the way a mirror reflects light. Hence, the strength of a reflected signal varies.