Effect of Enviromnental Noise on broadband

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I have noticed that there is virtually no packet noise on my connection between 6pm and 8am. While, at the same time, packet loss increases noticeably during the day, particularly between 8am and 2pm. This seems to be at odds with the fact that my snr decreases slightly in the evenings as opposed to the day time.

Is this a consequence of the fact that environmental noise is a great deal worse in the day time?

(I live in a very noisy built up area, where there is a great deal of environmental noise - building work etc. during the day)

Not audible noise but EMF interference from heavy machinery?

In reply to a post by has:

This seems to be at odds with the fact that my snr decreases slightly in the evenings as opposed to the day time.

That's right! There is more noise on the line after dark. More noise => Less Margin. We are talking here about electrical noise not sound noise, like building sites.

Packet loss occurs not just on your connection, but between you and the servers you are talking to. The routes to them and the servers themselves are busier during the day so you can lose more packets.

Have you looked at whether CRC/ES errors rise during 8am to 2pm? (Or FEC errors if you're interleaved).

Sometimes I get CRC errors as much as 2,000 per 15 minutes, when it's normally 10-15 errors per 15 minutes at other times. SNR doesn't appear to spike downwards though. I am on a new estate and there are still new houses being built about half a km away, was infact wondering if construction work was causing CRC errors to shoot up.

I'm always watching my routerstats like a hawk in fear of interleaving getting kicked in

edit: was meant to be in reply to OP.

Edited by Aaron_01 (Thu 28-Jun-12 00:28:14)

Thank for all your replies - yes I get the point about electrical noise as opposed to other types of noise. Still wondering though why packet loss is worse midday than it is in the evening- when broadband use is at its peak (I think?)

My gut feeling is that it is related to construction/road work, that is worst at that time of day... And yes, that is likely to be emf noise rather than audible noise is something I overlooked.

Thanks again for all your feedback

Edited by deleted (Thu 28-Jun-12 01:53:58)

It may be worth walking round your house with a medium wave radio. When I did this a few weeks back (when my broadband was going through a disconnection spell) I was horrified how much crud there was, particularly on my incoming mains cable. I suspected at the time an issue with a nearby solar panel array - EMC radiation problems are becoming apparent from the inverters used with these, with some models being far worse than others.

With your noise problems peaking at mid-day a local solar panel array may be the cause in your case!

(touch wood, my problems seem to have gone away again).

Which ISP are you using, some have a lot of business customers so there can be two peaks

Using Be - the odd thing is I have two lines in the same street (separate properties) and only one exhibits those symptoms.

That might be the culprit - my partner has some set up in the garden (to power some night lights). Not much I can do about that as she is very attached to them oh well, at least evenings are fine.

In reply to a post by has:

That might be the culprit - my partner has some set up in the garden (to power some night lights). Not much I can do about that as she is very attached to them oh well, at least evenings are fine.

I don't think the small garden light things will cause problems. I was talking about solar panels on rooftops feeding power back into the mains (in significant amounts). Although the inverters used (DC from the solar array to 50Hz mains) have to meet fairly tight specification it seems that some put out more EMC radiation than they should.

It is certainly worth wandering around with a medium wave tranny radio though. I suspect many cases of intermittent broadband dropout may have their roots in these local noise issues (which of course are impossible for the ISP to see on their tests).

Thanks for explanation - I was just about to post back and say that I read that solar panels are unlikely to cause the kind of interference (RF interferenc) which might lead to packet loss.

I have f8lure and thinkbroadband graphs running, both of which show significant packet loss every day between the times of 8am and 4pm - usually between 1% and 5%. In the evenings, the packet loss is almost nil.

When I first reported this problem to my provider (BE), they said that a fault was deteced on the line, and they sent Openreach, who carried out some local repairs, saying they ingress was the likely issue and that they had done the necessary work to eliminate the fault. But the issue has continued.

Not sure what I need to do next, my electric/technical skills are virtually non-existent - so forgive me if I sound ignorant, but what would walking around with a medium wave transistor radio reveal?
And can one still get hold of one at this time and age?

Thanks

The problem has persisted - always the same pattern: packet loss from around 7am onwards, and then from around 2pm, hardly any loss. Seems to be the complete reverse of what most people experience...

In which case you need to try and identify what electrical device it is locally that is generating this radio frequency noise. You will usually here the interference on an AM radio that is tuned off a station

There are loads of cheap MW portable radios to be found. This is very similar to the one I use.

Tune the radio, when you get one, to 612 to 621MW. The issue is that the radio will also pick up noise which isn't an issue for your broadband.
More often than not, it's something with a transformer on it causing the problem.
From the specific times you mention, maybe a neighbour with a duff telly that's only used between those times. Worth also checking it's not something in your place. Switch off everything except the power to the sockets feeding the router/computer at the fuse board, does this cure it ?

Thanks for the help - will give it a go.

Thanks! Will report back once i have got hold of a radio