New property, slowww internet

Hello,

I just moved into a new property and the internet is very slow.

I orderd an AdslNation XTE-2005 faceplate and a new RJ11 cable to see if this speeds up things. Due for delivery tomorrow.

I took the faceplate off the BT master socket today to have a look and there doesn't appear to be any wires connected to the faceplate itself, and the colour of wires are a bit confusing.

Images:
http://i562.photobucket.com/albums/ss67/nicktopmotor...
http://i562.photobucket.com/albums/ss67/nicktopmotor...
http://i562.photobucket.com/albums/ss67/nicktopmotor...

There is a black and green wire that seems to be connected to a resistor, what is it?

and there is an orange and white wire connected to A and B of the inner section of the BT box.

I've been reading this guide http://www.adslnation.com/downloads/docs/XTE-2005_Gu...

Do i just connect the orange and white cable to the new XTE-2005 faceplate? And where abouts do i connect them?

or do i also need to do something with this green and black wire?

Sorry for all the questions, i was recommended to this forum by a friend who said its full of very tech savvy people

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

Nick

Edited by deleted (Tue 27-Aug-13 21:46:01)

No idea on the resistor never seen that before and if this is a brand new house why does it have a very old master socket?

Wires to a and b are fine, you have no extensions based on pictures shown. The key is what are the lines stats? And how far do you think you are from the telephone exchange?

You do NOTHING to any of those wires. The Orange and White stay exactly where they are and the faceplate plugs on to the front.

As for the resistor across the Green and Black - they are a second pair and unused by your installation. What value is the resistor? The only thoughts are that it was put in to simulate Out of Service or to kill noise on that line. Wait until your faceplate is installed and get your line stats and use Router Stats Lite to get a 24 hour plot of Atten and SNR, then remove the resistor and repeat. You will then have two sets of figures to compare.

Im using a LinkSys x3000 router and the stats are follows

- - - - -

DSL UpStream Rate (Kbps):448
DSL DownStream Rate (Kbps):4832

Down Up
DSL Noise Margin (0.1 dB): 59 200
DSL Attenuation (0.1 dB): 550 315
DSL Transmit Power (0.1 dB): 195 121

- - - - -

Pretty sure those figures are x10, i seem to recall reading that on the linksys forum.

You are approximately 3.95km from the exchange. Note that this is the straight line distance - the actual cable length will be longer!

Bummer, that's a long distance from the exchange

Nick

I suspect the 2nd picture shows a diode connected across the 2nd (spare) pair, I believe sometimes used to mark pairs which have been proved but not connected .

Oh dear...

You are approximately 3.95km from the exchange. Note that this is the straight line distance - the actual cable length will be longer!



My linksys x3000 stats report the following:

DSL UpStream Rate (Kbps):448
DSL DownStream Rate (Kbps):4832

Down Up
DSL Noise Margin (0.1 dB): 59 200
DSL Attenuation (0.1 dB): 550 315
DSL Transmit Power (0.1 dB): 195 121

Those figures are x10 according the people on the linksys forum, but they're still high even at 10 times the value.

Nick

You do NOTHING to any of those wires. The Orange and White stay exactly where they are and the faceplate plugs on to the front.

As for the resistor across the Green and Black - they are a second pair and unused by your installation. What value is the resistor? The only thoughts are that it was put in to simulate Out of Service or to kill noise on that line. Wait until your faceplate is installed and get your line stats and use Router Stats Lite to get a 24 hour plot of Atten and SNR, then remove the resistor and repeat. You will then have two sets of figures to compare.

To get the LINE Distance to the Exchange-

http://windows.mouselike.org/be/?DoAction=BrasChecker


If it does not cover your phone number, then give Andrew the line-of-sight/crow's flight/point-to-point distance and also the apparent road distance, using Google Earth or similar.

Typically, the actual line length will be about 1.5 times the point-to-point distance and around 1.25 times the road distance; although there can be distinct variations.


==============================

You should also access your Router's Admin stats, looking for particularly the Downstream and Upstream Attenuations; and any thing else on that part.

I used that website.

The current Downstream BRAS rate is: 4.26 Mbps
The current Upstream BRAS rate is: 0.45 Mbps
BT Recorded Line Length to Exchange (m): 4442
BE LLU: Not Activated

Nick

Attempt 3 to post - the two previous have disappeared!


You do NOTHING to any of those wires. The Orange and White stay exactly where they are and the faceplate plugs on to the front.

As for the resistor across the Green and Black - they are a second pair and unused by your installation. What value is the resistor? The only thoughts are that it was put in to simulate Out of Service or to kill noise on that line. Wait until your faceplate is installed and get your line stats and use Router Stats Lite to get a 24 hour plot of Atten and SNR, then remove the resistor and repeat. You will then have two sets of figures to compare.

Attempt 4


You do NOTHING to any of those wires. The Orange and White stay exactly where they are and the faceplate plugs on to the front.

As for the resistor across the Green and Black - they are a second pair and unused by your installation. What value is the resistor? The only thoughts are that it was put in to simulate Out of Service or to kill noise on that line. Wait until your faceplate is installed and get your line stats and use Router Stats Lite to get a 24 hour plot of Atten and SNR, then remove the resistor and repeat. You will then have two sets of figures to compare.

Ok i fitted the new XTE-2005 faceplate and didn't have to do anything with the wires, just left them as they were.

LinkSys stats:
Down Up
DSL Noise Margin (0.1 dB): 68 170
DSL Attenuation (0.1 dB): 550 315
DSL Transmit Power (0.1 dB): 194 123

x10 ofcourse, wonder why LinkSys does it times ten?

Will see how it goes

Thanks for your help.

Nick

Why Linksys choose to display values in cB (centiBels) I will never know.


What speeds are shown by the Linksys? and what hoes the TBB speedtest give?


Can you get RSL installed? and running?

Post deleted by MHC

In reply to a post by S3xYH3xY:

Pretty sure those figures are x10

Yes, it says they are:

(0.1 dB)

In reply to a post by S3xYH3xY:

You are approximately 3.95km from the exchange. Note that this is the straight line distance - the actual cable length will be longer!

From your attenuation your cable length is about 4 km.

You are getting as good speeds as you can from your connection.

As you have no extensions, you will gain nowt by spending money on filtered faceplate, except cosmetically.

Lazy web interface, the numbers are stored internally as integers and the multiple by 0.1 is missing for the web display that is all.

Is it? I can see it!

In reply to a post by XRaySpeX:

In reply to a post by S3xYH3xY:

Pretty sure those figures are x10

Yes, it says they are:

(0.1 dB)

In reply to a post by S3xYH3xY:

You are approximately 3.95km from the exchange. Note that this is the straight line distance - the actual cable length will be longer!

From your attenuation your cable length is about 4 km.

You are getting as good speeds as you can from your connection.

As you have no extensions, you will gain nowt by spending money on filtered faceplate, except cosmetically.

So around 4.5mb is the best im ever gonna get ?

The connection drops now and again too which is very annoying as i work online.

Will i be able to get faster when they rollout BT Infinity at my exchange?

Thanks.

Nick

FTTC depend on your cable length from your cabinet (not like ADSL which is on length from exchange).

I suspect the 2nd picture shows a diode connected across the 2nd (spare) pair, I believe sometimes used to mark pairs which have been proved but not connected .

Why go to all that bother to tag a proved pair ???? Tag it with a tag, loop it out if you fancy.

It is odd though. I wonder if the OP might describe or photo the external feed to the property ?

There is a black and green wire that seems to be connected to a resistor, what is it?

That's the strangest thing I've ever seen.

The way those jelly crimps usually work is like this. Say the wire gets damaged you can use one to rejoin the wire.
I haven't a clue what it's doing BUT from the looks of it the green wire, will then connect to the resistor thing, which then goes into the other jelly crimp and is joined to the black wire. So it's kind of creating a little loop.
Essentially it's going green wire - resistor - black wire (all connected together) or it's the other way around. WHY?

They may as well have connected the green wire to the black wire directly. Even then why? 99% of installs would just leave them with nothing attached, it's all screaming of an install that's been messed with.

I just don't get why anyone would bother to 1) pay for whatever that is and 2) set it up like it currently is.
I'm suspect here a little bit.

The white and orange cables look like standard incoming lines. If that resistor wasn't there I would say it's 100% cool but that's making me unsure.

Can you trace the incoming line from outside? Are there any other sockets in the house? If so can you get pics too.

Edited by ukhardy07 (Sun 01-Sep-13 01:47:55)

Exactly my thoughts.

..... and you don't tag a pair in the back of a socket any way, you tag it on the 66, or the DP ????

We are in agreement All a little odd.

Given the drop-outs causing the disconnections, have you tried the "Quiet Test", using only a phone (with splitter) in to the Master Socket, everything else disconnected?

17070 - Option 2.

If there is noise, particularly but not necessarily around a disconnect, getting that repaired may give a slight improvement in your speeds.

The noise could be literally a noise, hum, intermittent or continuous; or as I encountered, BT Engineering Test Tones.

The longer the line, the more joints in it, so the greater the likelihood of problems, from various sources, including possibly electric fences in fields, trees with overhead lines going through them etc etc.

If the disconnects are caused by a problem between and including your house, and the cabinet, this would also affect any future installation/improvement such as FTTC, so well worth checking now.

Would that pair have been linked with a known resistance if any checks were made on it from, for example, the cabinet?

Thanks for all your help guys

I used the wholesale bt broadband checker tool on our phone number and it says this...

http://s562.photobucket.com/user/nicktopmotors/media...

So does that mean ill be able to get a faster connection around March 2014?

I just uploaded that image and the internet died which forced me to reboot the router to get it working again, i think it happens when uploading more than downloading.

Is it worth contacting BT and ask them about the problems im having with the line and disconnections etc?

Thanks!

Nick

Try a quiet line test with a corded phone in the test socket - if there is noise on the line then report a line fault to your line rental provider (do not mention any broadband issues.)

If the line proves to be quiet then try an alternative router in the test socket - if the broadband connection is still unstable then report the problem to your ISP.

When FTTC becomes available it's imperative that your line from the house to the cabinet is in good condition.

Good luck

To answer the first question.

Yes looks like you will have option of FTTC around that time, and the speed represents their estimate based on what they know about your phone line.

Thanks for all your help guys.

Here are my current router stats after fitting a new ADSLNation faceplate:

DSL UpStream Rate (Kbps):448
DSL DownStream Rate (Kbps):4288

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Down - Up
DSL Noise Margin (0.1 dB): 75 - 170
DSL Attenuation (0.1 dB): 550 - 315
DSL Transmit Power (0.1 dB): 192 - 123

Don't think i can get anymore than 4.5mb with those stats, am i correct?

Is it worth contacting BT and asking them to do something at there end or should i just wait till next year when FTCC is enabled on our local cabinet?

Thanks.

Nick

http://www.coolwebhome.co.uk/calc/index.php?param=RG...

Suggests you are getting a very good sync speed now for the length of line. So unlikely to push things faster on the standard ADSL services.

No point in wasting time contacting BT.

In reply to a post by S3xYH3xY:

Don't think i can get anymore than 4.5mb with those stats, am i correct?

Yes, you'd already been told you were getting as good as you can get. You had best figures before you fitted filtered faceplate. Nowt BT can do to make it any better.

So the AdslNation XTE-2005 faceplate was a waste of money and actually made the speed worse. Unlucky.

Looking at old stats the noise margin is a little higher now and sync speed slightly lower.

So maybe the old DLM systems have imposed a 9dB target margin, or user was just unlucky with the last sync and resyncing now might get a better speed.

With RF there are so many uncertainties that the certainty sometimes stated is pushing reality to its edge.

Yes, it was probably a waste a money, but most likely made not a blind bit of difference. The change of speeds and NMs were likely to state of line at diff times and DLM reacting to OP reconnecting router a few times.

The effort and expense could have been avoided by connecting to the test socket as a first step, then.

You previously said that the connection "drops now and again" hopefully there may be some improvement in that regard now that you have fitted a filtered faceplate - it is possible that the micro filters that you were using before were not adequately filtering voice frequencies and that would occasionally cause the dsl to drop.

It has no place being there, end of.

To the OP, despite others saying it's not worth contacting your ISP, I reckon it's worth a punt, just to see if they can get to the bottom of the intermittent disconnections, and maybe, just maybe, there's a shorter E-side you could be on.

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

It has no place being there, end of.

Would you remove that resistor or what ever it is - could be done as part of the investigations that you are suggesting below?

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

To the OP, despite others saying it's not worth contacting your ISP, I reckon it's worth a punt, just to see if they can get to the bottom of the intermittent disconnections, and maybe, just maybe, there's a shorter E-side you could be on.

It looks more like a choke or a diode than a resistor but it should not be disconnected, except by Openreach.

Damn tootin' Why have summat not required across a pair, even if it's a spare pair.

What generally happens with a spare pair, are they even connected up at the cabinet or do they connect right through to the exchange?

Spare pairs go as far as they go, spares within internal wiring very rarely go beyond the external feed to the property.

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

..... and you don't tag a pair in the back of a socket any way, you tag it on the 66, or the DP ????

We are in agreement All a little odd.

Placing a resister on a pair at the far end on a new build is a well known method for newbuild. Jointers can then confirm what dside is going to what house using a meter and measuring the value at the cab without the need for tones or labels.

Newsite planners will often specify spare pairs at houses rather than stumped pairs at underground distribution points.

In this case a second pair has been planned to this house.

It is not something that a BT or contract installer will be familiar with. It also will have no bearing on broadband speeds.

I'm impressed. Most jointers will be confident of their schedule and thier jointing and won't be putting resisters on. This is a professional network build. The resister confirms spare pairs are going where they should be and records are correct.

Edited by deleted (Thu 12-Sep-13 22:12:46)

In reply to a post by Zarjaz:

It has no place being there, end of.

Nonsense. If you don't know what it is, hold your counsel and wait for someone that does before stirring up the punters.

Edited by deleted (Thu 12-Sep-13 22:00:32)

Can't say I've ever seen this in gals work with bellway housing. Interesting...

I still don't think it should be there. It seems like a typical situation of builders taking measures into their own hands and history has proven quite well that builders are not BT openreach engineers & often provide sub satisfactory internal wiring.

Lets not forget this is behind the master socket faceplate and its BTs property, so whatever the builders are doing should be to BT spec. If a BT engineer doesn't know what it is then in my view it isn't meeting BT spec.

Nonsense. If you don't know what it is, hold your counsel and wait for someone that does before stirring up the punters.

OK, thanks for the top advice there.

Thanks again for your help.

Not had any disconnections past few days and my DSL Noise Margin has settled between 58 and 68.

Think the ADSLNation faceplate has helped

That's good news - it does seem that you were perhaps having issues with the filters that you were using previously, SNRM only varying between 5.8dB and 6.8dB (58cB and 68cB) is very good