Openreach to perform Pair Quality Test on line without ADSL

Hi folks,

I'm currently without an internet connection at home - there's no ADSL signal apparent on the line.

After various tests (different routers/filters/cables inserted via the test socket), my ISP has organised Openreach to come out and perform a 'Pair Quality Test' on the line.

Can someone please tell me if this test just checks the physical telephone cable, or will it pick up ADSL faults too?

If the line passes the test, the visit will be chargeable - so I'm concerned that I'm going to get a bill for a test which won't have any chance of detecting the fault.

Also, apparently if the engineer carries out any other work on the BT network, this would be considered an 'enhancement', meaning the visit would still be chargeable. Does this mean I get charged if the fault is say in the local junctionbox/exchange?

Many thanks.

If you normally have ADSL on the line then

1. They test at the test socket
2. If nothing then test at cabinet with their test kit
3. If nothing look in the exchange

Only if on (1) they find the signal present but when reconnecting your hardware and wiring would they raise a charge. It is different if you INSIST on a specific test being done, rather than follow the usual slow pattern of fault diagnosis.

If voice calls are clear of noise, then you know both legs of the pair are connected and ADSL will work even with just one of those, so has to be a big issue to get no ADSL at all. More common is someone messing up configuration/wiring in the exchange or a cabinet.

Resolving ADSL faults always seems hard work

As the customer, you shouldn't need to know (unless you want to) what type of tests BT are going to perform. After proving your ADSL isn't working using the TEST socket and alternate router etc. which you've done then the ISP should take whatever steps are necessary to get you back online.

For those without a test socket the problem is even worse!
If you are happy the router isn't syncing in the test socket then you should be fine...

How did you get involved in the type of test to be carried out?

Edited by b4dger (Fri 31-Jan-14 17:13:51)

Thanks for your replies which seem reassuring.

Firstly, sorry, I should have explained that I do normally have ADSL!

The type of test was mentioned by the ISP when the engineer booking was made.

I suspect the fault is at the cabinet as neighbours have had trouble last year when water got in there.

Funnily, the routers I have tried are the ones in b4dger's sig... All show no DSL on the line.

The only other concern I should probably have is the strange looking external wiring that we inherited with the house. It has always looked suspect to me (as in did the previous owner tinker?), but has worked fine for the past couple of years.

Not sure I'm going to cope with this flaky 2G signal until the test on Tuesday!

Thanks again.

Sounds to me as though your ISP are being cute, and not wishing to pay for an SFI visit. Sounds much more like a CDTA appointment. (conscious design to appoint) This means the line tests OK on remote tests, but the CP is requesting a test carried out anyhow. These are usually the result of noisy, line tests OK, type faults or bell not ringing, that kind of thing.

Although a PQ test might highlight a minor issue on the pair, it would be highly unlikely that this would cause the no sync fault you are attempting to report.

On the other hand, the bit about network enhancement smacks of an SFI visit, in which case the engineer will be testing for sync also. There is no way I'd think it justified for ISP to pass on charges to you for network enhancement. Time to name and shame your ISP I reckon.

Just to make perfectly clear, any charges raised by Openreach will be to the service provider. If the service provider wants to pass some, or all of them, on to you, then that is entirely their doing.

OK, so I'm not so reassured now!

To be fair, I don't understand what other option I have.

I either don't have an internet connection ever again, or I get the ISP to call an engineer out.

Either way it's out of my hands.

In reply to a post by rich_jtg:

I either don't have an internet connection ever again, or I get the ISP to call an engineer out.

That's the bottom line. ISPs wording is often pretty scary - but eventually you have to bite the bullet.

As I said, if you are happy that there's no sync in the TEST socket then you should be fine.

I see in your signature it says you are with Freeola - I'm with them.
Their rep visits TBB so he may be able to comment on why the engineer callout has been so specific.

I would not worry too much about it. For sometime now open reach charge for pretty much anything and like to have as many outs as possible.
If you have no sync and the engineer comes out and there is no sync, and he has to fix that then there will not be a charge as long as the fault is not caused by you or any internal wiring. A PQT is unlikely to pass if there is no sync anyway.

Ah, thanks for your replies... they put my mind at rest a little.

As you say, it's a case of see what happens due to the number of variables involved.

Hopefully we will be back in the land of the connected soon!

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

If you normally have ADSL on the line then

1. They test at the test socket

What happens when there is no test socket - ie the old BT junction box?

A PQT is unlikely to pass if there is no sync anyway.

How do you figure that then ??? The PQ test only tests the copper pair, and makes no test for sync what so ever ?

Then the visiting engineer should be replacing that FOC.

If you have carried out all the tests that our Support have advised you to do then I would say you probably won't get a charge.
I've not idea why whoever you spoke to in Support gave you such specifics without a little more detail from you (PM me your line number if you like). It may be that they were just reading out what the BT system was displaying from diagnostics/engineer booking.
As b4dger said, I can look into this if you wish.

Rob

Ah think I've found your account.
To add a little more detail, you are having and SFI where a PQ test will be carried out. From the sound of things this should fail, which should mean no charge.
BT diagnostics returned 'The circuit is not in sync. Circuit is not TAM-enabled.'

Thanks again for all your replies, and to freeola for the extra info.

Just thought I should give an update after a (friendly) engineer came yesterday ...

He checked the exchange on the way, which showed an ADSL signal was present on the line.

On arrival, and a few questions, he said he would look at some of the cabling on the outside of the house 'which didn't look right' - the previous owner had had two lines which they had later had changed to one line and an extension.

Apparently, part of the cabling looked like it was 'looping back on itself', and he just re-routed the cable that was there so it went directly into the master socket and back out.

After this was done, and a new Openreach-branded master socket fitted, a router was plugged in, and it was able to detect a ADSL signal and sync. He then carried out many tests which showed the line to be fully operational.

I asked what had caused the fault, and he said he wasn't sure... so I guess I'll have to just wait to see if there's any charge to pay.