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Standard User Tommy2280
(newbie) Mon 07-Dec-20 12:21:01
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Ethernet over Power - gaming related


[link to this post]
 
Hi all

Not sure if this is the right sub to post in, but hoping for some advice really

My office is in the garden and I have ethernet over some Devolo Magic powerlines

I'm on Virgin Fibre and in house, speeds are 200/40+, but in the office its around 60/30

This is should absolutely be enough for online gaming but I see horrible lag at times and input delay etc

So my question is whether my internet connectivity is severely hampered by using these homeplugs? For ref, they technically cross a circuit, in that my whole house is under the one CU but one homeplug is on the circuit for downstairs plugs, and the other end is on on the circuit that powers the office

Anyone able to pass comment please?

Thanks
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Mon 07-Dec-20 12:45:42
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Re: Ethernet over Power - gaming related


[re: Tommy2280] [link to this post]
 
The lag is possibly the combination of virgin media and extra from the power line devices.

That you have such as big drop suggests either older standard plugs or lots of speed loss and lots of error correction which will introduce lag.

You can ping a device in the house from the office i.e. over your internal network to see how much variation the the power line kit is introducing.

Also if the game play is bad when in the house and using pure ethernet then you are looking at issues with ISP.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Zarjaz
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Mon 07-Dec-20 13:24:53
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Re: Ethernet over Power - gaming related


[re: Tommy2280] [link to this post]
 
On top of Mr.Saffron’s advice, could you describe how you have the powerline adaptors set up please.

I have come across incorrectly set up plugs giving really duff speeds before.


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Standard User jelv
(knowledge is power) Mon 07-Dec-20 14:39:10
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Re: Ethernet over Power - gaming related


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
This is using TP-link 600Mbps from upstairs ring main to downstairs:

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C:\Users\John>ping 192.168.1.1
 Pinging 192.168.1.1 with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=3ms TTL=64Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=3ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=3ms TTL=64Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=6ms TTL=64
 Ping statistics for 192.168.1.1:
    Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 3ms, Maximum = 6ms, Average = 3ms


ETA: LAN Speed Test (https://totusoft.com/lanspeed) reports 31Mbps download to the NAS box plugged in to the router.

jelv

AAISP November 2016
(Previous ISP Plusnet November 2001 to October 2016) Why I left Plusnet
Telephone rental: Pulse8

Edited by jelv (Mon 07-Dec-20 14:45:39)

Standard User ukhardy07
(knowledge is power) Mon 07-Dec-20 17:05:00
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Re: Ethernet over Power - gaming related


[re: Tommy2280] [link to this post]
 
The answer is it all depends, they absolutely can cause lag, but that could be the powerline or it could be the connection itself, it could also be usage from other devices at the same time. The only way to test is to try it out connected via Ethernet plugged into the router, see how that goes. It would require moving it inside.
Standard User jabuzzard
(committed) Mon 07-Dec-20 20:40:36
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Re: Ethernet over Power - gaming related


[re: Tommy2280] [link to this post]
 
In short it is highly likely that powerline is doing horrid things to your connection. So here is me pinging first a UniFi AC-LR which is connected via hardwired gigabit ethernet, then a UniFi AC-M out in the shed connected via a powerline

[email protected]:~$ ping -c 5 192.168.16.2
PING 192.168.16.2 (192.168.16.2) 56(84) bytes of data.
64 bytes from 192.168.16.2: icmp_seq=1 ttl=64 time=0.257 ms
64 bytes from 192.168.16.2: icmp_seq=2 ttl=64 time=0.316 ms
64 bytes from 192.168.16.2: icmp_seq=3 ttl=64 time=0.314 ms
64 bytes from 192.168.16.2: icmp_seq=4 ttl=64 time=0.254 ms
64 bytes from 192.168.16.2: icmp_seq=5 ttl=64 time=0.323 ms

--- 192.168.16.2 ping statistics ---
5 packets transmitted, 5 received, 0% packet loss, time 4092ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 0.254/0.292/0.323/0.030 ms
[email protected]:~$ ping -c 5 192.168.16.22
PING 192.168.16.22 (192.168.16.22) 56(84) bytes of data.
64 bytes from 192.168.16.22: icmp_seq=1 ttl=64 time=4.77 ms
64 bytes from 192.168.16.22: icmp_seq=2 ttl=64 time=3.48 ms
64 bytes from 192.168.16.22: icmp_seq=3 ttl=64 time=4.78 ms
64 bytes from 192.168.16.22: icmp_seq=4 ttl=64 time=4.77 ms
64 bytes from 192.168.16.22: icmp_seq=5 ttl=64 time=7.69 ms

--- 192.168.16.22 ping statistics ---
5 packets transmitted, 5 received, 0% packet loss, time 4007ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 3.484/5.099/7.690/1.388 ms


As you can see latency is around 20 times worse, with lots of jitter, The powerline is a temporary setup thrown in this summer so I could sit in the garden WFH, I am not gaming so it's not roo bad, but replacement is on the cards for next year with SWA Cat6a

If you want to game in your garden office IMHO you will need to bite the bullet and get some Cat6 or optical fibre installed.
Standard User Tommy2280
(newbie) Tue 08-Dec-20 09:18:03
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Re: Ethernet over Power - gaming related


[re: Zarjaz] [link to this post]
 
Thanks all! Much appreciated

@Mr.Saffron - I will research how to ping a device from the house and revert

@Zarjaz - Router > Homeplug (directly in wall) > Homeplug (in wall in office) > console & PC
The only other point of note is that whilst I only have 1x CU in the house, the homeplugs traverse 2x rings. Ie the router plug is on the downstairs sockets ring; and the office has its own ring. I don't know how important this is

@jabuzzard - Yes, I think the answer is to run a long ethernet cable. That's not going to be fun



I do have another question please

The broadband monitor tool here, does that give me latency performance at the router or from the machine that it runs on? Just that I've got it set up and did it from the office, so might that be showing latency caused by the homeplugs, or is that taking the connection at the router side?

Thanks again folks
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Tue 08-Dec-20 09:46:52
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Re: Ethernet over Power - gaming related


[re: Tommy2280] [link to this post]
 
The monitor is pinging the public IP address which will be the router in 99% of cases.

Monitor does not run on your machine, if it did then when you switched machine off monitor would go off.

The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
Standard User Tommy2280
(newbie) Tue 08-Dec-20 11:41:59
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Re: Ethernet over Power - gaming related


[re: MrSaffron] [link to this post]
 
That makes sense. Silly question !

So then if I'm seeing latency spikes or packet loss, that's down to Virgin?

Oh can I not post a picture here?
Standard User jabuzzard
(experienced) Tue 08-Dec-20 12:05:15
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Re: Ethernet over Power - gaming related


[re: Tommy2280] [link to this post]
 
If the power is run in a conduit I would consider running a length of preterminated fibre optic cable down the same conduit and using some media converters, or cheap switches with SFP ports at each end. I would go for simplex LC cable with BX optics either end. The simplex cable will be much easier to pull than duplex cable, with a very small additional cost for SFP's. Parts could be done for under £100. Media converters at ~£20 each, BX SFP's about £10 each and £5 for a 30m unarmoured simplex patch cable.

I am sure someone will pop up and say that you are not supposed to run other cables in the same conduit as mains power cables. That's why I suggested unarmoured fibre rather than some Cat5e/Cat6. Its unarmoured fibre the risk is absolutely zero. It's no different than having some extra string in the conduit, which is considered good practice.
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