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Standard User ChrisWilson
(newbie) Tue 23-Jul-13 17:05:42
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Re: Avonline / Tooway / Skylogic


[re: ToowayUK] [link to this post]
 
It sounds complicated, and probably if I had time to re-read it properly, arbitrary in its meaning. Wouldn't you be better having a clear and concise data limit ruling? It sounds to me that both current and new users may now be chasing moving goal posts?

I can perfectly understand how a service provider may have consumers who take the proverbial, and you need to address this, but you need to do it in a way that is not open to misunderstanding, and can be seen to be a proper contract. To me it is all as clear as mud I am afraid, and biased towards you doing what the heck you feel like smile Sorry, it would put me off as a potential new subscriber.

Best regards,
CW.
Standard User ToowayUK
(newbie) Tue 23-Jul-13 18:27:53
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Re: Avonline / Tooway / Skylogic


[re: ChrisWilson] [link to this post]
 
Sorry to hear that Chris. The policy is basically designed to ensure that the majority of users get the best possible experience from the resources available. I wish you luck in your search for a provider.
Standard User wingco1
(legend) Tue 23-Jul-13 18:31:43
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Re: Avonline / Tooway / Skylogic


[re: ToowayUK] [link to this post]
 
Have these changes to contract been introduced recently? Do you agree that the changes are detrimental to existing customers?


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Standard User ToowayUK
(newbie) Tue 23-Jul-13 18:42:42
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Re: Avonline / Tooway / Skylogic


[re: wingco1] [link to this post]
 
The aim of the policy is to ensure all Tooway customers have fair use of the network capacity. Eutelsat's Tooway contracts with all resellers have always included this clause.
Standard User wingco1
(legend) Tue 23-Jul-13 18:45:44
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Re: Avonline / Tooway / Skylogic


[re: ToowayUK] [link to this post]
 
Have the same limits always been in place or have these been reduced recently?
Standard User mah
(newbie) Tue 23-Jul-13 18:58:39
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Re: Avonline / Tooway / Skylogic


[re: wingco1] [link to this post]
 
We're not a Avonline customer, our Tooway service is via Bentley Walker but our experience is exactly the same as people who have posted above.

The Fair Use policy posted by ToowayUK has only just been introduced. Prior to this there was just boilerplate language that bolied down to "we can do anything at any time" (not that is different from the FUP language of any other ISP).

Of course what is really a joke here is that the "unlimited" service actually has a 60GB cap - the traffic management policy works just the same way if we go beyond 60GB, as when a capped customer goes beyond their cap.

After the first month we have not been able to make any use of the Tooway service at all - we found that it was literally grinding to a halt, seemingly at random, so I had to swing normal use back to ADSL to avoid getting lynched. Although Skylogic have been improving matters and the catastrophic slowdowns have not been occurring lately, we are still only getting a real throughput of 3-4Mbps during the evening peak.

There is of course an inherent problem with any satellite system, which is latency. Every network packet has to to get to a point above the equator, and then back to earth again, and physics cannot be cheated. So any satellite service is going to less than optimal for anything interactive (e.g. voice, or AJAX web services like Google Docs). There would be no problem with data streaming - except that the performance problems and aggressive throttling policy make that pretty pointless too.

As an IT professional what I have found most frustrating as a customer of Skylogic is their refusal to accept that there are problems and to deal with them. I still hope that ToowayUK and other representatives of Skylogic will yet prove me wrong, but the way we have been treated so far is nowehere near the service we get from our other ISPs BE and PlusNet.

So were we are now is stuck with an expensive, capped, throttled service for the duration of a 24 month contract. I should be fired!

Edited by mah (Tue 23-Jul-13 19:01:38)

Standard User ChrisWilson
(newbie) Tue 23-Jul-13 22:59:22
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Re: Avonline / Tooway / Skylogic


[re: ToowayUK] [link to this post]
 
Can you state your name and position in posting this reply please? I am still somewhat unclear in how your terms and conditions have changed, and where I can see your terms and conditions of usage, both previous and current. I am still VERY sympathetic to your side of things, but this needs putting on an official basis, with contractual agreements made clearer. Thanks.

Best regards,
CW.
Standard User Tel3koN
(newbie) Wed 24-Jul-13 03:02:55
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Re: Avonline / Tooway / Skylogic


[re: ToowayUK] [link to this post]
 
@Tooway

I have not gone over the monthly bandwidth quote/limit "30GB" within the peak hours "7AM/11PM UTC" (4PM/12AM).

Although with every new monthly bandwidth quote/limit "30GB" It's still giving speeds below 1MBIT during those peak hours and even into the non-peak hours up until 1AM UTC where it magically jumps back to 20MBIT.

Yet you have said "No traffic management is applied outside of peak hours".

11PM to 1AM UTC is outside peak hours is it not?, again roll on 1AM UTC and the speed magically jumps back to 20MBIT.

You can look at my previous posts which confirm the above speeds multiple times.

I've used around "12GB" this month within the peak hours and it's the 24th, in 9 days I will get a new monthly bandwidth quote/limit "30GB".

In 22days I've used "12GB" during those peak hours mentioned above. I'm somehow meant to use "18GB" during these peak hours within the 9 days (6 days peak hours) remaining?

Could you also sort out the monthly bandwidth meter @ http://checkportal.skylogicnet.com/ because it looks like someone with little or no web developement knowledge has made that botched bandwidth meter.
Standard User JamJamJam
(newbie) Wed 24-Jul-13 09:47:09
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Re: Avonline / Tooway / Skylogic


[re: Tel3koN] [link to this post]
 
Tooway?

Again, the explanation is tailored to the situation / person asking the question.

Tel3kon has demonstrated that the supposed explanation does not fit his case. I can do the same.

I am aware of the contract formed when I signed up - it was based on Avonline's agents discussions with me, any terms referred to form the contract, any terms not referred to do not form part of the contract, I was not directed to any part of a website to read any further terms, I have not since been notified of any changes, I still have not been told of any alterations to my package as referred to in the forum post above.

Avonline have several phone numbers and email addresses for me, I have never been contacted other than to be sent an invoice.

If it is proposed to alter my service and downgrade it to anything less than what I can reasonably expect to receive for the advertised rates, speeds and data limits then you are open to legal challenge by the customer and if appropriate by a group of customers.

My contract is with Avonline, just as others may be with Bentley Walker, my terms and conditions remain unchanged until I am notified by the company concerned.

My service remains affected and this is not what I could reasonably expect from the original contract.

I suggest that a definitive answer is given to customers affected, that is robust and sets out clearly what a customer can expect to receive and what the company promises to deliver. It is Tooway and their resellers that wish to move the goalposts, so it is clearly necessary to tell the end user what they are getting for their £££ and to be open honest and challengeable if you step outside of these boundaries by not delivering what you promise.

Whilst it is ok to spill the beans on a forum, I along with other customers require formal contact if you seek to alter my terms and conditions. It is also necessary to clearly state and to warn new customers on the resellers sites in plain english what they are signing up to BEFORE they sign up to it.

I can travel 50 miles in several ways - it can take 1 hour at 50mph or 50 hours at 1mph. The first is reasonable, the second is not. In the case of the speeds received, the first is usable, the second renders it useless for all but basic tasks which we would not be paying a premium for anyway.
Administrator MrSaffron
(staff) Wed 24-Jul-13 09:53:34
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Re: Avonline / Tooway / Skylogic


[re: JamJamJam] [link to this post]
 
There was a PR push earlier in the year about Tooway removing throttling which will have led many to believe it was removed, not simply dialled down for a short period.

If customers think the terms have changed unfavourably and their retailer is not helping, then CAB/Trading Standards are the port of call for advice on where to take the case. Particularly for those who have purchased outright the expensive hardware or still tied into long contracts.

Andrew Ferguson, [email protected]
www.thinkbroadband.com - formerly known as ADSLguide.org.uk
The author of the above post is a thinkbroadband staff member. It may not constitute an official statement on behalf of thinkbroadband.
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