In reply to a post by derby13:

Hi. Thanks for the replies. Yes it seems like it is indeed an FTTP setup. VM customer service previously told me that it wasn't FTTP, but it looks like they were wrong.

Technically it a not FTTP... although the fibre hits the premises it is converted to Coaxial before being connected to modem.

So not comparable to BT FTTP, but certainly a step closer.

Unfortunately the terms are a bit too loose, and can be mis-interpreted.

In reply to a post by mlmclaren:

In reply to a post by derby13:

Hi. Thanks for the replies. Yes it seems like it is indeed an FTTP setup. VM customer service previously told me that it wasn't FTTP, but it looks like they were wrong.

Technically it a not FTTP... although the fibre hits the premises it is converted to Coaxial before being connected to modem.

So not comparable to BT FTTP, but certainly a step closer.

Unfortunately the terms are a bit too loose, and can be mis-interpreted.

It's FTTP. It arrives at the premises on fibre optic cable. What happens after that is irrelevant.

The fibre actually goes into a unit, an R-ONU, that both outputs an RF signal over coax and also has an output for an optical PON network. For now the RFoG port only is being used but doesn't change that it's FTTP.

I'm not aware of anyone who refers to RFoG as anything other than FTTP. Or, at least, I wasn't until now!

Post deleted by Check_T

Virgin won't be likely to say it's FTTP as it could be considered mis-selling.

As I said previously though, I personally think BT mis-represents it's FTTP... As the fibre terminates in the CPE not just at the P (premises)

As far as I'm aware all Virgin has done is send it's DOCSIS RF signals over fibre, I am however intrigued yo see what differences this has over the hybrid network currently in wide use.

Specially in the bandwidth sharing area and latency/jitter ..

In reply to a post by mlmclaren:

As far as I'm aware all Virgin has done is send it's DOCSIS RF signals over fibre, I am however intrigued yo see what differences this has over the hybrid network currently in wide use.

Well that's what RFoG means of course. The reason will be so Virgin can use the same SuperHub and TV6/Tivo boxes and not have to offer different products in different parts of the country. That would be going backwards to when we had 10+ cable companies in the analogue days (pre Telewest/NTL mergers).

I suspect it may mean limitations on products in RFoG areas, with the benefits that the PON is "passive" no powered equipment in the cabinets - making it cheaper to maintain/install.

Edited by jchamier (Mon 09-Apr-18 05:11:55)

In reply to a post by mlmclaren:

Virgin won't be likely to say it's FTTP as it could be considered mis-selling.

As I said previously though, I personally think BT mis-represents it's FTTP... As the fibre terminates in the CPE not just at the P (premises)

Virgin don't call it FTTP because there's no point. They are selling the same services on both so why bother drawing attention to that you've millions of customers you're selling 'fibre optic' broadband to on a hybrid network?

You're entitled to personally think whatever you wish.

If you're defining CPE as the customer's equipment exclusively then you're claiming B4RN, Gigaclear, many leased lines, obviously Openreach, Verizon FiOS, AT&T, Google Fibre, the municipal and private networks in Sweden and Switzerland, etc, etc, etc, aren't FTTP.

You're also wrong. CPE in the context of WAN circuits refers to whatever terminates those circuits, and can include whatever terminates the services riding on those networks also. It's equipment that's at the customer's premises, not just the customer's own equipment at the premises.

For B4RN, Gigaclear, etc, that'd be the media converter at the premises, for BT FTTP that'd be the ONT, for VM's RFoG solution the R-ONT. VM provide in-home installation support as they control everything customers connect to the network however the demarcation between network and home installation in the RF network is the isolator on the outside of the home and the R-ONT in the case of RFoG.

Openreach support the optical network and their responsibility ends at the ONT, from there on it's the customer's problem. Ditto Verizon, AT&T and others. B4RN and other point to point solutions' networks end at the media converter.

I'm not aware of any definition of FTTP that states that it requires a fibre to be presented to the end user's equipment. Again you're entitled to your opinion, it's just not one shared by the world's standards bodies, the advertising authorities, the regulators or network operators.

In reply to a post by mlmclaren:

As far as I'm aware all Virgin has done is send it's DOCSIS RF signals over fibre, I am however intrigued yo see what differences this has over the hybrid network currently in wide use.

Specially in the bandwidth sharing area and latency/jitter ..

In terms of both sharing of bandwidth and latency/jitter absolutely none. It improves signal quality, allows use of higher order modulations, allows use of more spectrum in both directions without needing to modify anything as the network is all passive from the virtual hub.

It allows for much easier node splits as each node is now the size of an optical split but apart from that it's DOCSIS.

The FTTP network is FTTP because it's cheaper to build than normal HFC, it's future proof in that 10Gb+ EPON / XGPON signals can be placed on the same fibre and has better signal characteristics than an HFC network as there are no RF amplifiers involved.

This isn't some unique thing VM are doing. Cable companies all over the world are using RFoG for new builds, and aren't advertising it as fibre to the premises even though they're delivering a fibre to the premises.