Have BT Fibre, but can't seem to move/get Vodafone Fibre

Hi,

I currently have BT Fibre (FTTP) installed and just about at the end of the initial 24 month contract with BT, so looking to move to a more cost effective provide, but finding a lot of the cheaper options will not or can not (according to there signup checkers) provide a connection.

OneStream (who apparently use Vodaphone)
Vodaphone (who use Openreach so would assume OneStream do to)
NowBB

So what I am trying to figure out is do these providers only have selective access to Openreach's network or can they reach every customer that has an Openreach fibre connection? i.e. if there is a database issue or they really can't provide a service here.

Out in the sticks and my line was physically put in by OR when I ordered it with BT, so also wondering if BT have any claim on the line while it's still under the initial 24month contract or something similar.

Exchange page:
https://www.thinkbroadband.com/broadband/exchanges/e...


Also my property is on an old farm and I don't have a proper postal address for the building, this caused a lot of fun initially placing the order with BT but they got there in the end. What I have noticed is that some checkers have a full list of addresses for my post code but some only have the older houses that existed back in PSTN days, wounding if this messes things up? But I don't think I can talk directly to OR to check (and not sure why BT would have any interest in looking into if I'm looking to move from them). OR's service checker has my building and reports up to 1000MB/s fibre available as expected.

Little miffed as I had assumed any of the providers could supply a service on an OpenReach fibre.

Any info/thoughts etc appreciated.

m

Providers don't have national access.

Some providers have their own network while others
will use another providers "backhaul".
The backhaul is basically beyond the exchange.

The main backhaul providers are BT Wholesale and Talktalk Business, who smaller providers use instead of running their own network.

In order to run their own backhaul from an exchange a provider needs to buy a GEA Cablelink. These cost over £1000 for each 10Gb/s GEA Cablelink.

Some providers won't buy a 10Gb/s GEA link for FTTP until an exchange has a certain level of FTTP coverage.
Alternatively their current GEA Cablelink could be full, meaning they may withdraw FTTP products from sale (much less likely).

Vodafone also sell FTTP over Cityfibre and can exclude specific areas from sale for Openreach FTTP because of this.

It's either Vodafone aren't selling FTTP in your exchange, it's a database issue, it's a Cityfibre exclusive area or something else I can't think of.
It's down to Vodafone whatever it is though.


Nobody has any claim on your line while in contract and no provider gets any exclusivity on Openreach.
The day Openreach goes live any provider is free to sell you FTTP, provided they install their own kit or use an existing backhaul provider.
You are free to migrate that to any provider selling over Openreach at any point you wish.

Edited by j0hn83 (Thu 19-Jan-23 16:16:20)

You would have to contact Vodaphone and ask them to update their database from the OR database. Some are 'lazy' in that they take one upload and do not refresh it to get updates, this often affects new builds in old postcodes but also odd database corrections like yours.

It is extremely unlikely that Cityfibre have built to your area if you are in the sticks.

There is no point talking to OR if their checker shows your address correctly.

You may like to check the post office data for the address as some providers will use that as the 'master'

.

.

In reply to a post by kitcat:

You may like to check the post office data for the address as some providers will use that as the 'master'

Royal Mail please, not post office. Post Office and Royal Mail have been separate businesses for many years now; Post Office covers the retail side of things with some Crown Offices and many franchised operations while Royal Mail handles the collection and delivery of packets and letters. Royal Mail maintains the PAF (Postcode Address File) as the database is integral to the mechanised sorting of the packets and letters.

Thanks, Makes sense then.

Is there anywhere to look up if an exchange has non Openreach backhaul and who's provided it? For some reason I had thought with fibre any provider (offering FTTP) could access it but does make sense for them to make there own offering cheaper not renting the Openreach connection to the exchange...Just a shame it's not that obvious who can and can't supply a service to a given line/area.

Cheers,

m.

In reply to a post by HOB:

Thanks, Makes sense then.

Is there anywhere to look up if an exchange has non Openreach backhaul and who's provided it? For some reason I had thought with fibre any provider (offering FTTP) could access it but does make sense for them to make there own offering cheaper not renting the Openreach connection to the exchange...Just a shame it's not that obvious who can and can't supply a service to a given line/area.

Cheers,

m.

Long post. I'll go in to a bit more detail here.

There is no Openreach backhaul.
Openreach control everything from the home to the exchange. From the exchange onwards (backhaul) it's handled by other companies.

As I said the main 2 backhaul players that wholesale out to other ISP's are BT Wholesale and Talktalk Business.

There aren't all that many backhaul providers. The main ones are...

BT Wholesale (serve hundreds of providers including BT, Plusnet, EE, Cerberus, Zen, AAISP and many more).
Talktalk Business (serve hundreds of providers including Talktalk, Zen, AAISP and many more).
Zen (Zen, IDNet, and a few others)
Sky (Sky and Now Broadband only as far as I know)
Vodafone (Vodafone and I believe a few others)

As you can see from my not very detailed list there can be cross over on who uses what backhaul.

Zen use a mix of BT Wholesale, Talktalk Business and their own backhaul, depending on what's available at a particular exchange.
AAISP use either BT Wholesale or Talktalk Business.
BT, Plusnet and EE only use BT Wholesale.
Sky and Vodafone only use their own backhauls.

There is no list anywhere showing what's available at what exchange. That's mainly because it's a constantly changing landscape with providers having to buy new links/upgrade links at exchanges meaning availability can come and go as capacity limits are reached.

You just need to do an availability check with the provider of your choice. If they aren't available then pick another provider.

Without Vodafone specifically telling you why they aren't available to you there is no way to know why or when they are likely to become available.

When Openreach FTTP became available at my address only BT Wholesale could offer FTTP (so I could use ANY provider that uses their backhaul).
It took a few months for Talktalk Business to become available and a few months more for Sky to become available.
It was over a year before Vodafone showed availability.
That was a couple years ago and Openreach FTTP is a bit more mature now with slightly better availability nationwide.

Edited by j0hn83 (Sun 22-Jan-23 12:58:54)

You say Vodafone have their own backhaul then?

I'm with Sky and want to move to Vodafone for a better deal but im affraid to move incase the connection quality isn't up to scratch.

I'm on FTTP with sky and dont have any issues with it.

Any ideas how Vodafone do their routing from the exchange?
How can i get some insight as to whether my connection would be better or worse than it is now?