Will Plusnet be affected by Vodafone move?

Apologies: I don't really understand how it all works and I'm finding it hard to learn from the internet!

I'm changing ISP soon. With Talktalk and considering moving to Plusnet. I've found that Talktalk is unreliable: speed is fine for us but there's a lot of 'red light on the router' time. The internet just seems to be down a lot without explanation.

Plusnet gets good reliability reviews compared to Talktalk and say BT. ( I'm not sure why that would be - I thought all the ADSL (not fibre or cable) providers were just reselling the wholesale BT service?)

However, I've read something about Vodafone broadband being migrated to Plusnet in February. Does this mean a big influx of new users and consequently a poorer service do you think?

Thanks, Kate

Welcome to the forums sadkate .

I would imagine the number of customers on Vodafone is quite small compared to Plusnet's, and that the reason Vodafone are passing them on is because of that. Costing them more than it's worth I expect.

As for Plusnet themselves, they have a good record of providing new capacity when needed. However you need to be sure you are happy with their traffic management policies. Have a read of this page, which includes a link to the primary traffic management info. There are other related pages on the Plusnet site as well, about things like traffic prioritisation running alongside the speed tables.

Are you sure you don't have a fixable line fault? Or have TalkTalk been hopeless at getting it sorted?

if the red light is the ADSL light, then it may be something that changing ISP does not fix.

The TalkTalk routers usually have stats at http://192.168.1.1 and clicking the DSL icon displays them. Posting a copy of those figures will help us judge if issue looks like line, or something ISP side.

Thanks folks.

It's not doing it just now so I can't say for certain but I'm pretty sure it's the 'internet' light rather than the 'DSL' one which goes.

I have contacted them about it but the problem is intermittent and, as their first advice is usually "Switch it off and on again," by the time you do that and phone them back the problem has often gone.

I think at one point they offered to send a guy out but they were so cagey about what they would do for free and what we might have to pay for that I bottled it.

I've just had a look the config page and the DSL summary says:

System Uptime 71:22:00

Modem DSL(Sync) uptime 0:48:01

ADSL Mode ADSL2 PLUS

Interleaving On

DSL Line Speed
up 1018 kbps

down 17291 kbps

Line Attenuation
up 5.6

down 12.0

SN Margin
up 6.2

down 5.9

Ta.

Total Errors Seconds 1

At that Attenuation you should be getting the full 24 Meg.

Good stats.

Are you connecting wired or wireless to the router, and next time it happens please can you confirm the red light? I don't know that router but expect there is a Wireless light as well as the Internet and DSL ones?

Is the router getting very hot?

It feels to me like an external problem, but if it is, whether it is the line from you to the exchange and through to the TT kit, or whether it is that kit, is another question.

You to the exchange would not alter things by migrating. Within the exchange almost everything would change.

OK, I'm connecting wirelessly with laptop and phones but using a wired connection through hotplugs for my telly and PVR. Hotplug setup put in about 10 months ago and didn't seem to alter anything. Wireless light is always on and the signal around the house is good. Router was replaced 18 months ago and again that didn't have any effect. I have even gone back to the old router a couple of times to see what happens but nothing changes.

Will check where the red light is next time. Am 99% certain it's internet as I have concluded over time that it's not my setup that's causing the grief.

The router is ever so slightly warm but not at all hot.

I'm about a third of a mile from the exchange and we are off the main public road so the telephone wires come in on poles through some trees.

Thanks.

Yeah it is 3 or more meg lower than I'd expect.

Also the modem has shown a resync 48 minutes ago, while the router has been up and running for a few days. So may be the DSL is dropping out.

When the internet light is red, go get the same stats out of the modem, I have a feeling you may find the downstream noise margin is very close to zero, i.e. 1 or 2dB. The TalkTalk hardware hangs onto the sync very well, too well sometimes to the point the connection is not working, but there is still sync. If the issue with low margin goes away quickly this can be faster than the modem dropping and reconnecting, but if the issue goes on for sometime it can give the effect of a very bad connection to the ISP, or none.

OK I'm on the lookout for red lights and will come back with more info.

Gives me a good excuse to surf the net all evening...

Thanks for all your help so far.

Hello again. I'm back and obviously I have a more reliable connection than I thought because I've been watching the thing like a hawk and it hasn't dropped for ages!

Just spotted a red light though (on the 'internet' light). Didn't have the computer on and by the time it booted up the light was back to green, however here are the DSL stats from about a minute after:
System Uptime 116:35:35

Modem DSL(Sync) uptime 116:34:39

ADSL Mode ADSL2 PLUS

Interleaving On

DSL Line Speed
up 1020 kbps
down 17340 kbps

Line Attenuation
up 5.5
down 12.0

SN Margin
up 7.0
down 5.9

Total Errors Seconds 276

STRAAANGE goings on though and I have a feeling I have unearthed a right can of worms. I will explain on the off chance that it rings a bell with anyone...

We have a smart telly and PVR which are wired to the router via a hot plug (electric socket thing). One/both of these is misbehaving and it SEEMS to be linked to static. The HDMI connection periodically fails when playing back from the PVR to the telly. The problem can be triggered or solved by touching the telly casing, which usually yields an electric shock. Today, I've been noticing a lot of static. I switched on the PVR and started playing back. After a few seconds the HDMI failed and the internet light went red. When the thing righted itself soon after, the internet did too. Also, from my limited understanding of those DSL stats, it looks to me like they don't recognise that downtime.

Coincidence or some impossibly convoluted connection between static and internet and telly misbehaviour?

Any wisdom would be appreciated! Ta, K

Static can cause RF noise that affects the ADSL2+ frequencies.

Try unplugging the HomePlug units, and see if the static clears up, and reboot the router, it might go faster.

How long is the HDMI cable? Short cables (2 to 3m) almost any cheap brand will suffice, 10m or longer you should be looking at better quality.

The Smart TV is it a plasma unit? We've seen some interfere with ADSL2+ before.

A divide and conquer approach to figuring out what is the main cause of any static/interference.

HDMI cables are 2m tops and basic quality. Yes, it is a plasma. Would one of those ferrite cores on the network cable be of any use? I'm not sure what they're for but I think I have a vague memory of there being one in the box and me not using it because we didn't connect it to the internet at first.

I will disconnect the homeplugs for a week or two and monitor the effects anyway.

Thanks again for the advice.

MIght help - but it is a long shot.

Is there any phone wiring near to the TV?

Hmmm.

No phone wiring, no. Dangling network cable that's sometimes used for the laptop and a network cable to the PVR.

I have all my wiring at the back of the telly clipped close together for tidiness. Please don't tell me that could be a reason. I'll cry.

Today's incidents could have been coincidence of course but it does seem odd. We've had A Lot of lightbulbs going lately so I'm beginning to wonder if we just have terrible wiring or something. This is all too complicated! Too many things involved now.

Ever grateful for your advice.

In reply to a post by sadkate:

I have all my wiring at the back of the telly clipped close together for tidiness. Please don't tell me that could be a reason. I'll cry.

Start crying. (Well, please don't).

If you have power cables and signal cables in that neat bundle that is bad. The signal cables in a bunch could be OK, and power cables in another with the two separated as much as possible.

If any power and signal cable need to cross, try to get the cross at a right-angle.

Power cables create a magnetic field round themselves. If they run parallel and close to a signal cable you get the maximum disruption to the signal. If they cross at right-angles any disruption is minimised.

I think with signal cables in a bunch the quality will matter more than normal. They probably need to be twisted pair even if short.

To help in identifying if a network cable is twisted pair, the ones that have a round profile usually are twisted pair.

I would be taking the wiring apart and spreading around the lounge as a test first, if all works well with reasonable spacing then two bundles and maybe better cabling will help.

Also have you considered the posibility that the static source is from the carpet, it can be worse in winter, particularly as people may be wrapped up in more layers of clothing

Hello again.

Finally got a persistent red light so I noted the summary details again to see if they tallied with your initial suspicions?

Internet light went red first:

System Uptime 333:14:18
Modem DSL(Sync) uptime 0:02:58
ADSL Mode ADSL2 PLUS
Interleaving On
DSL Line Speed
up 1020 kbps
down 17756 kbps
Line Attenuation
up 5.6
down 12.0
SN Margin
up 7.1
down 6.0
Total Errors Seconds 0

Shortly after the DSL light went too:

System Uptime 333:16:52
Modem DSL(Sync) uptime Line Down
ADSL Mode -
Interleaving -
DSL Line Speed
up 0 kbps
down 0 kbps
Line Attenuation
up N/A
down N/A
SN Margin
up N/A
down N/A
Total Errors Seconds -

K

The figures are two minutes apart, so it may be the issue was intermittent noise, i.e. not always showing in the stats, but eventually caused a resync.

How often do these happen? My TalkTalk line tends to have one most nights in the summer, but is happy all winter.

Difficult question. It was September when I lost the rag and decided to change ISP but was still in contract but it's been reasonably well behaved recently, so conceivably yes, it's worse in the summer.

When it has been problematic it would go at least once a night.

What is 'noise' in this context please MrSaffron?

Once a night while annoying is in the normal range for ADSL

Noise anything that is not your ADSL signal, in the 25KHz to 2.2MHz range, or put another way, anything that makes an AM radio squawk, squeak, whistle