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Standard User techguy
(experienced) Thu 16-Jul-15 19:51:58
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Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[link to this post]
 
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/07/16/windows_10_w...

No bad thing but ISP networks are likely to be hit hard I reckon.

Virgin (ADSL) => Namesco => Newnet => O2 => Plusnet => Zen => Newnet => Zen => Freeola => Vivaciti (using O2 Wholesale DSL) => Xilo (C&W Wholesale) => Xilo (O2 Wholesale) => Xilo (TT Wholesale due to O2 Wholesale closure) => Zen LLU
Router: Billion 8800NL
Note: I don't lay turf for anyone. astro or otherwise, all views and opinions expressed are my own based on experience.
Standard User bobble_bob
(fountain of knowledge) Thu 16-Jul-15 19:58:30
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: techguy] [link to this post]
 
Be fun when MS release an update that breaks something major and you wont know until its too late. Its happened before
Standard User Chrysalis
(legend) Thu 16-Jul-15 21:14:14
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: techguy] [link to this post]
 
which I predicted months ago smile

applocker and other stuff been removed from non enterprise ouch

http://microsoftstrategy.azurewebsites.net/wp-conten...

also

http://www.microsoftlicensereview.com/?tag=windows-c...

Plusnet Fibre Unlimited BQM - IPv4 BQM - IPv6

Edited by Chrysalis (Thu 16-Jul-15 21:23:34)


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Standard User herbgold
(member) Sat 18-Jul-15 07:13:25
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: bobble_bob] [link to this post]
 
I think that's only for Windows Home. It's not clear, but I think Windows Pro users will be able to defer updates - see here:

http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/0...

which says

"Windows 10 Pro users will have a little flexibility; they'll be able to switch from the mainstream release to the Current Branch for Business (CBB). This will give some control over when updates are deployed. While the CBB will essentially track the consumer release, it will allow feature updates to be held back for some amount of time; Anderson quotes a Microsoft executive saying that companies will have around eight months to prepare for each new feature update. Delay the feature update any further and they'll also be prevented from receiving security updates."

I certainly hope that that's the case!
Standard User herbgold
(member) Tue 21-Jul-15 06:28:23
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: herbgold] [link to this post]
 
That is correct. The authoritative answer is here:

http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/win...
Standard User Banger
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 21-Jul-15 20:34:20
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: herbgold] [link to this post]
 
MS is describing win 10 as a service and is going to be so locked down will in the future we have to pay a subscription to continue use as a service?

Tim
www.xilo.net & freenetname
Billion 7800 on 24 Meg LLU
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/speedtest/results.html...
Standard User Pipexer
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 21-Jul-15 20:55:48
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: Banger] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Banger:
MS is describing win 10 as a service and is going to be so locked down will in the future we have to pay a subscription to continue use as a service?

That might come eventually but I suspect not anytime soon. People who have upgraded from Win7 and Win8 would get extremely angry if 1 year down the line they are told to start paying a subscription for updates, MS aren't gonna do this anytime soon. They would also get totally shot down by the security community if they stopped updates to people's systems unless they paid.

That's my prediction.

AAISP Home::1
Standard User Sark
(legend) Tue 21-Jul-15 21:10:33
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: Pipexer] [link to this post]
 
I agree. No other consumer operating system even charges for major feature updates never mind patches. So my guess is MS will just keep on updating your install to the latest and greatest until the device dies of old age. They still charge OEMs for the initial purchase which is where all the money is anyway.

John.
Standard User zyborg47
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Tue 21-Jul-15 21:53:21
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: herbgold] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by herbgold:
I think that's only for Windows Home. It's not clear, but I think Windows Pro users will be able to defer updates - see here:

http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2015/0...

which says

"Windows 10 Pro users will have a little flexibility; they'll be able to switch from the mainstream release to the Current Branch for Business (CBB). This will give some control over when updates are deployed. While the CBB will essentially track the consumer release, it will allow feature updates to be held back for some amount of time; Anderson quotes a Microsoft executive saying that companies will have around eight months to prepare for each new feature update. Delay the feature update any further and they'll also be prevented from receiving security updates."

I certainly hope that that's the case!


Not as much flexibility as we have with windows 8 and below.
windows 10 seems to want us to be linked in, to Ms account all the time. Cortana will not work if you are not signed into the MS account.
I have disabled cortana and blocked most of the other stuff Windows 10 want to know, like location, not that the location is correct, it thinks I am in Sheffield.

Adrian

Desktop machine now powered by windows 8 pro 64bit, no dreaded metro and Linux , laptop by Linux

Plusnet FTTC
Standard User ian72
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 22-Jul-15 10:25:46
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: Sark] [link to this post]
 
The other main OS provider that used to charge is Apple.

Whilst they now provide updates free (they did charge for them a while back) they tend to only do so for "supported" models - they don't allow the update for older models. If you want to get the new version when you have an older model then the only option is to buy a new Apple Mac. The support is not bad by the looks of it as Yosemite is supported on hardware back to 2007 - so about an 8 year support lifecycle.

I suspect MS will do the same. If your kit is older than that then the updates will stop and you either keep running that version or you buy newer hardware.
Standard User herbgold
(member) Wed 29-Jul-15 07:11:29
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: ian72] [link to this post]
 
Leo Kelion on the BBC web site says "But on the eve of Windows 10's release, Microsoft told the BBC it had added an option to defer all Home Edition updates, security fixes aside."

Will Windows 10 prove a winner for Microsoft?
Standard User johnjburness
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Jul-15 09:18:03
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: techguy] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by techguy:
No bad thing

Why do you reckon that it isn't a "bad thing"??

Just to summarise, Microsoft has now built in the ability for an external source being able to take control of my Operating System & provide it with "updates" without my being able to prevent it!

It sounds like a "Hacker's-Dream" to me (& a nightmare for anyone who has the slightest concern over Security)!

Regards,
John
Standard User herbgold
(member) Wed 29-Jul-15 10:31:46
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: johnjburness] [link to this post]
 
See my post below (you can elect not to have automatic updates).
My post

Edited by herbgold (Wed 29-Jul-15 10:34:48)

Standard User johnjburness
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Jul-15 11:15:41
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: herbgold] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by herbgold:
See my post below (you can elect not to have automatic updates).
My post

Acknowledged!

However, this certainly appears to be a late change of tactic - but even then, it appears to only be an option to opt-out of the "additional-Features" aspect, since it indicates that you won't be able to opt-out of the Security-Updates - hence, it DOESN'T appear to let you stop an outsider (albeit the intention that this is Microsoft) taking over your PC & updating the Operating System to its heart's content - allegedly in the name of Security!

Historically, that (IMHO) has been one of the bug-bears of Microsoft - it has always allowed "back-doors" to enable further development - just unfortunate that it is usually the "Hackers" that exploit these "further developments!

Regards,
John
Standard User herbgold
(member) Wed 29-Jul-15 12:32:46
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: johnjburness] [link to this post]
 
I take your point, but aren't those Microsoft Security Updates in the same category as antivirus updates, which are also automatic and which one also needs to take on trust?
Standard User camieabz
(sensei) Wed 29-Jul-15 12:37:48
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: techguy] [link to this post]
 
Well that's a good reason to wait for SP2 or its modern day equivalent. Public sector bodies tend to lag behind the rest. Partly out of costs/hardware, but mostly out of not forcing untested software on systems.

If Win10 forces the issue, public sector systems (IT dept aside) will give it a miss completely. This ever-increasing mandatory linking to on-line and cloud systems is going to end in tears one day.
Standard User DavidFinbarr
(freechataholic) Wed 29-Jul-15 12:57:50
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: herbgold] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by herbgold:
See my post below (you can elect not to have automatic updates).
My post


Any tec site reporting that info?

Save a bird,
eat a cat.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Wed 29-Jul-15 12:59:48
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: camieabz] [link to this post]
 
Cloud systems for anything but non-important non-confidential stuff are the biggest hacker danger on the planet.

The indispensable man or woman passes from the scene, and what happens next is more or less the same thing as was happening before.
My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet UnLim Fibre (FTTC). Sync 57676/14040kbps @ 600m. - BQM
Standard User Sark
(legend) Wed 29-Jul-15 13:32:41
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: johnjburness] [link to this post]
 
Not patching your system is like leaving your front door wide open and going out for the day. WAY WAY more risky than letting a highly trusted tradesmen in once a month to fix the locks.

John.
Standard User herbgold
(member) Wed 29-Jul-15 14:12:47
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: DavidFinbarr] [link to this post]
 
Not in the first two pages of Google results (lost patience at that point).
Standard User DavidFinbarr
(freechataholic) Wed 29-Jul-15 14:41:06
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: herbgold] [link to this post]
 
MS has released tool that lets you block an installed program from installing again once you uninstall it.

But can't see anything about having to option to stop the update from installing in the first place.

Save a bird,
eat a cat.

Edited by DavidFinbarr (Wed 29-Jul-15 15:03:12)

Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Wed 29-Jul-15 14:57:06
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: DavidFinbarr] [link to this post]
 
Aren't auto-correctors wonderful? smile

"uninsulated"

As I read the blurb there, it is to stop manufacturer updates that aren't fully W10 compatible, after W10 install or update has installed its own drivers. Or of course a cruddy W10 version.

The indispensable man or woman passes from the scene, and what happens next is more or less the same thing as was happening before.
My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet UnLim Fibre (FTTC). Sync 57676/14040kbps @ 600m. - BQM

Edited by RobertoS (Wed 29-Jul-15 14:59:40)

Standard User johnjburness
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Wed 29-Jul-15 15:02:14
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: Sark] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by Sark:
Not patching your system is like leaving your front door wide open and going out for the day. WAY WAY more risky than letting a highly trusted tradesmen in once a month to fix the locks.

Who says I don't patch my system?

I don't have a problem with "trusted" updates &, when I download them I can double-check the validity of the source.

However, even if I am expecting a "highly trusted tradesmen", I don't leave the doors open for him - just in case it is someone else who takes advantage!

Regards,
John
Standard User DavidFinbarr
(freechataholic) Wed 29-Jul-15 15:09:10
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: RobertoS] [link to this post]
 
Corrected smile

It "corrected" a word that I spelt right to start with.

Save a bird,
eat a cat.
Standard User RobertoS
(elder) Wed 29-Jul-15 15:10:45
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: DavidFinbarr] [link to this post]
 
Quite. Happens to me several times a day crazy. Hence the wording of my post.

I assume you saw my edit? About what the tool may be for.

The indispensable man or woman passes from the scene, and what happens next is more or less the same thing as was happening before.
My broadband basic info/help site - www.robertos.me.uk. Domains, site and mail hosting - Tsohost.
Connection - Plusnet UnLim Fibre (FTTC). Sync 57676/14040kbps @ 600m. - BQM
Standard User Sark
(legend) Wed 29-Jul-15 18:08:13
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: johnjburness] [link to this post]
 
It's up to you. But consider that if anyone else is able to take advantage of automatic updates then your system is already compromised. Windows Update is not like an open door, it's a door with the world's most complex lock on it and only Microsoft have the key. If someone else can get in through that door then they've already broken in through a window and changed the locks from the inside.

But more importantly the automatic system cannot be tricked into installing malware in the same way a human can nor can it forget about or overlook an important patch or put off installing it for months on end. That's why it's "no bad thing" that Microsoft is making security updates mandatory.

John.
Standard User broadband66
(fountain of knowledge) Thu 30-Jul-15 16:15:56
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: Sark] [link to this post]
 
What happens if an update causes an issue?

Was Eclipse Home Option 1, VM 2Mb & O2 Standard
Now Utility Warehouse (up to 16mbps) via Talk Talk
Standard User ian72
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Thu 30-Jul-15 16:25:32
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: broadband66] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by broadband66:
What happens if an update causes an issue?


Windows bricks? That is a definite possibility and has happened with bad updates before. In reality most users probably leave updates on auto anyway so Win 10 would be no worse for them - the people it hits are those that control their updates and only update after either a period of time or after testing on other kit.
Standard User broadband66
(fountain of knowledge) Fri 31-Jul-15 12:41:38
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: ian72] [link to this post]
 
I control my updates and have never had an issue. A friend (on Vista) has had 3 issues with auto updates and her internet connection was lost until I found the cause and removed a particular update.

No need to apply updates that are not required.

Was Eclipse Home Option 1, VM 2Mb & O2 Standard
Now Utility Warehouse (up to 16mbps) via Talk Talk
Standard User martinsq
(member) Sat 01-Aug-15 23:37:53
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: broadband66] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by broadband66:
I control my updates and have never had an issue. A friend (on Vista) has had 3 issues with auto updates and her internet connection was lost until I found the cause and removed a particular update.

No need to apply updates that are not required.


Ditto smile
Standard User zyborg47
(eat-sleep-adslguide) Sun 02-Aug-15 10:08:33
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Re: Windows 10 updates to be automatic and mandatory


[re: ian72] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by ian72:
Windows bricks? That is a definite possibility and has happened with bad updates before. In reality most users probably leave updates on auto anyway so Win 10 would be no worse for them - the people it hits are those that control their updates and only update after either a period of time or after testing on other kit.


I normally have notify me but do not download and install, I like to wait and see if there are any issues with updates before I install them. Windows ten do not give you that option and will download security fixes right away, The only updates you can defer are ones that add extras, like no doubt in October when they decide to integrate Skype more into Windows


I used 10 as a second OS, not sure if I really want it as a main OS to be honest, I think I will stay with windows 8.1, I have it set up to the way i like it.
I just wish MS stopped nagging me to get windows 10

Adrian

Desktop machine now powered by windows 8 pro 64bit, no dreaded metro and Linux , laptop by Linux

Plusnet FTTC
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