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  >> Wireless Broadband ISPs (not wireless ADSL routers)


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Standard User Yaz
(experienced) Sat 17-Mar-12 04:57:25
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Re: What next for WISPs


[re: slimj] [link to this post]
 
+1 with Darren and SlimJ

Nobody has forced me to take up VFast.

I'm very happy to be with a company that has provided me with a brilliant customer service and, on the whole, a brilliant service.

There are always going to be people who are going to ignore those companies unknown to them, afraid to change, or just plain stuck in a rut with the big boys (BT, Talktalk, Sky). If they fail to see beyond that then sometimes they deserve to have their slow connections.

I always mention VFast to friends and family if they are looking to get a better service. Unfortunately a most are afraid of change (loosing existing ISP email accounts, bundled packages etc.) or in a few cases have not been able to get a service through no line of sight.

vFast Ltd
Downstream ~24336.33 kbit/s - ~2970.74 KB/s
Upstream ~10224.86 kbit/s - ~1248.15 KB/s
Standard User Yaz
(experienced) Sat 17-Mar-12 04:58:37
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Re: What next for WISPs


[re: vfast_tim] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by vfast_tim:
Hi slimj and Yaz

I'm sure you'll be the first to know when we have something new to trial smile.

Kind Regards,


Cheers Tim!

vFast Ltd
Downstream ~24336.33 kbit/s - ~2970.74 KB/s
Upstream ~10224.86 kbit/s - ~1248.15 KB/s
Anonymous
(Unregistered)Sun 18-Mar-12 04:36:57
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Re: What next for WISPs


[re: Yaz] [link to this post]
 
.


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Standard User WFarren
(newbie) Wed 21-Mar-12 01:00:51
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Re: What next for WISPs


[re: Anonymous] [link to this post]
 
I'm personally glad to see WISPs investing in laying fibre to local areas and then using Wireless for the last mile. It's the most logical and cost effective way of strengthening their networks.

In the future though i'd like to see the WISPs become just more flexible ISPs, willing to use whatever viable connection methods they can to provide to the areas that currently have no viable alternative, be that microwave, 801.11ac, copper, fibre, whatever. There is a proven market for this as they have demonstrated.

As for the cost and whether or not they have a monopoly; removing the emotional element that some of the gutless anonymous people have brought to the table, I do think the prices of WISPs are higher than they could be, VFast, who I use, are actually quite well priced and throughout the many years i've been with them my speeds have increased almost bi-yearly.

At the moment I feel that 24/10 being the best package availiable doesn't quite justify the £36.99 a month and I feel that 15/2 for £24.99 a month doesn't provide enough upload (yes I am well aware that most ADSL connections have 256kbps-512kbps upload, but why does wireless have to be asyncronous, genuinely would like to know if there's a technical limitation as to why), unfortunately there's no mid point between them.

It may not be technically possible to realistically provide these speeds to people but I would like to see VFast offer a 100/100 connection for £42.49 (this is still more expensive than Scandinavia and the Netherlands), a 50/20 connection for £34.99, a 20/5 for £24.99 and a budget 10/1 for £14.99, all with unmetered bandwidth. I feel that these tariffs would be able to strongly compete with not only the ADSL Max/3g that most of the areas served are limited to, but also the very best fibre connections around.

This may not be possible to deliver with current tech and individuals would probably be very easily able to adversely effect the rest of the people around them, but with new tech around the corner this is probably possible.

It'd certainly show that the WISP industry is able to truly compete with the big boys and if people were actually able to consistently get those speeds at those prices, it would definitely dispel any notion that these WISPs provide an inferior service to traditional cabled solutions.

Hopefully these companies are able to retain the "local" feeling with support staff having local knowledge and an intimate connection with their network, rather than just having a call centre with little to know actual influence or attachment to the ntwork.
Standard User slimj
(member) Sat 24-Mar-12 21:27:36
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Re: What next for WISPs


[re: vfast_tim] [link to this post]
 
In reply to a post by vfast_tim:
Hi slimj and Yaz

I'm sure you'll be the first to know when we have something new to trial smile.

Kind Regards,


Thanks Tim.

Is this the new tech being talked about but not available in the UK for a while? http://www.ubnt.com/airfiber

Damn, 1.4Gbps would be pretty incredible for wireless! (price per unit looks equally incredible, lol!).

VFast Wireless Broadband.
My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User vfast_tim
(newbie) Sat 24-Mar-12 22:02:50
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Re: What next for WISPs


[re: slimj] [link to this post]
 
Hi Slimj

Yes, this was only launched on Friday!

airFiber (that should be airFibre for the UK market wink) is for point-to-point backhaul, not customer connections. Still if/when we can make use of them it'll mean significantly increased capacity at remote (non-fibre) pops.

Just goes to show what can be done with wireless smile

Tim Higgs
Vfast internet | Technical Support
0845 121 1257 | support (at) vfast.co.uk | twitter: @vfast_net
Standard User gr0mit
(learned) Sat 21-Apr-12 17:49:24
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Re: What next for WISPs


[re: vfast_tim] [link to this post]
 
I must say that the complaints about WISP pricing are a bit harsh. I run a small WISP to fill in for parts of the town that BT have left out of FTTx upgrade. I need to make a living!

To be honest, with all this FTTX about, it actually makes filling in small communities quite viable. A leased line with fibre could be £10k installation plus £10 to £20K per annum. That just doesn't cost in if you want to provide a remote village, where the excess construction charges for several km of fibre can be many tens of thousands too!

Also BTW have announced Etherflow delivered over FTTx. This means leased line resilience without significant installation costs. So FTTx could in fact be a huge opportunity for WISPs like me to fill in using multiple cheap FTTC tails for backhaul, which is what I'm currently doing, and the model is relatively repeatable. I'm happy to chat if anyone wants ideas.

Best Regards
Tim Robinson
TxRx Communications Ltd
Fast wireless broadband for Basingstoke www.hiwifi.co.uk
Standard User anglianbroadband
(newbie) Sat 05-May-12 11:22:34
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Re: What next for WISPs


[re: kijoma] [link to this post]
 
Totally spot on. None of the ADSL providers include the cost of the landline rental except perhaps ones using LLU packages.

I have experienced government broadband funding going to BT. When we are competing with BT because BT don't offer as good a service as us, it is very unfair of the government (EEDA and local councils) to give our competitor £40k to put us out of business in an area.

I think you are correct that this latest government handout will go to keeping BT ahead of their competition. If us WISPs had done a bit better in 2003 then there would not be this massive problem with UK broadband speeds by now. The modest £100k that most WISPs needed to kick start them into profit would have been a massive saving on the millions that they are going to end up giving BT this year.

It matters little to BT if a few people don't have good service, as long as no competitor is gaining ground off the back of that lost business. So much so that BT would rather be awarded the money and fail to deliver broadband than have someone actually supply the service.

The WISPs in my area are trying to get hold of this government money. I say, let them knock themselves out trying, whilst I put up more repeaters and connect more subscribers.

Connecting you to 2meg or more in rural Essex
Standard User kijoma
(committed) Sun 06-May-12 01:09:41
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Re: What next for WISPs


[re: anglianbroadband] [link to this post]
 
Hi,

Indeed it is a mess and the chances of getting public money are zero at this point. Not even Defra RCBF funding is allowed to be used for FWA.

Here is something of interest as many consider Kijoma's concerns are unjustified and just "whining".

This is an extract from a Q/A response between Myself and The Broadband Program manager for West Sussex County Council. This is where Kijoma is based (West Sussex) and where we have the most extensive coverage, including the three "non ADSL" unviable exchanges. (for over 7 years)

Kijoma response/point in Italics, WSCC response in quotes.

WSCC Leader:-

"Funding is not easy to find but we have sought funds for infrastructure projects from both UK government and European sources. I am informed by my officers that the current bids for funding that there was a requirement for projects to be based on “open access” networks."

I agree funding is not easy to find, Our primary grievance is with WSCC's drive to spend funding aimed at improving broadband not spots on areas which are NOT notspots , this would be depriving other areas that are notspots from using this revenue wisely. You have plenty of not/poor spots in the county still in desperate need that could better utilise those funds and to far greater effect.


WSCC Broadband manager :-

"In the limited time allowed for this specific funding bid, WSCC took the view that the ADSL upgrade was something that would open up competition in those areas with no open access to broadband. It is unlikely that the offering in the areas would be as fast as the Kijoma closed access offering so would be more likely to appeal to those wanting minimal level of service. "

"My view of "not-spot" is that strictly speaking there is nowhere in the UK (or for that matter Western Europe) that has no coverage for broadband It is possible (although potentially very expensive) to access a broadband service by satellite, wireless or ethernet absolutely everywhere. "

"In my interpretation, I have taken that a not-spot is any location where there is no open access, reasonably priced service provided. I am aware that hard to reach and less commercially viable locations demand a premium from ISPs and the phrase “reasonably priced” would normally exclude bi-directional satellite,
Ethernet (“leased line”) or synchronous services. "

Broadband speeds of less than 2Mbps should probably be included in the definition but I have created the phrase "not-a-lot spots” for those areas.

In the case of the non-ADSL exchanges, I accept that Kijoma has coverage in those areas and that the prices are appropriate. However, a closed access service does make these locations, in my view, “not-spots” by the definition I am using.

----------------

I have emboldened significant statements that raise more questions about the decision process and why one persons view is allowed to define a LA strategy without sufficient research.

This extract of a 3 page Q/A response from the Council Leader and the Broadband Program manager at WSCC is from 2010 . Dialogue after this was limited and numerous offers to discuss what Kijoma provides, see it in action, talk to customers etc.. were declined.


Who would "want a minimal service" , i.e. one slower than 2 Mbps . Why are they able to fund ADSL exchanges, especially if the potential benefactors will receive under 2 Mbps (Especially the case for the East Marden and Sutton exchanges as they cover a wide area and possibly via aluminium cables).

We have had to have them remove at least 6 statements from their pages since 2010 that intentionally degrade our service , including :-.

"Although some areas have access to a wireless service, they do not have the benefit of a fixed line service"

"Wireless is available in some areas but the pricing is similar to Ethernet"

Publishing a complete county coverage map that omits ALLkijoma coverage.


The mention of Virgin Cable by name on the http://www.westsussex.gov.uk/living/broadband_west_s... website has been removed recently so even they have been filtered out of the equation, in name at least. Kijoma never has been named or quoted.

Understandably the 7 or is it 14 or is it 24 Million (it varies) they are going to spend on Broadband in the county is causing a lot of uncertainty with those commercial providers excluded from the equation such as Kijoma.

Our response at the moment is to see what happens and reduce or freeze any expansion/investment that has a lengthy ROI in West Sussex until we see what comes out of this public spending fiasco.

Meanwhile we will concentrate on installing new network demand outside this county in places that don't have a closed shop attitude so we have less eggs in one basket , i.e. reduce the risk, as any sensible business would do.

This of course will slow the installation of customers in West Sussex as we divert resources elsewhere. But that's the inevitable product of the uncertainty presented by the current BDUK/WSCC Broadband Framework and strategy.

So like Anglia Broadband, we will carry on installing where demand requests it. Where the risks are manageable and preferably without the uncertainty. element. Just like a profitable commercial company should smile

Cheers

Bill Lewis - MD
Kijoma Broadband - (Division of Kijoma Solutions Ltd)
Fixed wireless ISP - ISPA/CISAS/RIPE members
http://www.kijoma.net
My Broadband Speed Test
Standard User anglianbroadband
(newbie) Sun 06-May-12 10:20:08
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Re: What next for WISPs


[re: kijoma] [link to this post]
 
Based on previous experience I take a cynical attitude to these government schemes. I assume there is a great deal of corruption which must result in the users and small operators being the losers and those in charge and those big companies being the winners. Once you understand the outcome it is easier to work out the game plan they are using.

If chasing the funding will drain your resources then they will encourage you to chase the funding. If including you on any coverage maps would help you then they will exclude you. If people are crying out for broadband then funding will be made available, if they get broadband then the funding dries up.

If you look at what they are doing it's obvious that they plan to keep the broadband away from people who don't have it and keep those people from finding your service. If they went much further than this then we could have them put in prison.

The council man is obviously a very smart politician who knows exactly what he is doing. By chasing the funding you are playing his game. Unless you are equally good a liar, sorry politician then you will not only lose but will have lost valuable installation and marketing time in the process.

The only democratic way of running this is as a business. The market wants broadband so the market better pay what it costs to connect it. Individual people can spend their own money how they chose. It is up to us to tell them what we can do for them and up to them to get their wallets out. Hoping some crooks and liars are going to do something good for you is an insane delusion if you are one of the good guys.

Connecting you to 2meg or more in rural Essex
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