Zen 2Gb service

Hey all - long time lurker and first time poster..

Had the offer to upgrade my Fibre900 to the new 1.6/1.8/2Gb service (depending on marking speak, ethernet overheads etc) which will hopefully happen before christmas.

No, I don't need it but I want it as an early adopter since about 1995 of dual 64k ISDN (yes, I am that old!) I've always tried to stay at the bleeding edge.. also helps that I run an IT company so can sort of justify it as an expense..

Will be fed back into my Unifi network rather than than use the Eero 6e that they will ship.

Painless process so far - agree the upgrade, agree to the 18month term, pay £9.99 for a BT engineer to come and switch out my ONT for a 2.5Gb one.

Will keep you posted on progress and what actual speed I see once the service is deployed

Interesting.

I have just been looking at the Zen 1.6Gbps offer which I can have for £15 install fee. I will keep an eye on this thread because I too am also wanting it - it will be a step up from the 900 I have now. I'd be going from £318 a month to £65 a month so I can 100000% Justify the cost lol

Cheers

Edited by VMDIAPunter (Wed 11-Dec-24 11:55:38)

In reply to a post by VMDIAPunter:

I have just been looking at the Zen 1.6Gbps offer which I can have for £15 install fee. I will keep an eye on this thread because I too am also wanting it - it will be a step up from the 900 I have now. I'd be going from £318 a month to £65 a month so I can 100000% Justify the cost lol

Are you also on BT fibre? What is the difference between your £15 connection fee and the OP's £9.99 I wonder. (I'm waiting for advancement on City Fibre.)

In reply to a post by TwiggyLobster:

of dual 64k ISDN (yes, I am that old!) I

300 baud is old, you're just a youngster. And I am sure there are people here who used two tin cans connected by a taut string.

Sounds interesting, which Unifi router do you have?

Thanks
Dan

In reply to a post by danielhyde:

Sounds interesting, which Unifi router do you have?

Thanks
Dan

ONT -> UDMP-SE -> 10Gb DAC -> USW-Ent24 and then off to various AP's and smaller switches.

Works lovely! very rarely have an issue - sits at a solid 900/110 connection as advertised. See a little bit of packet fragmentation as the network utilisation increases close to the top end but have put a smart queue in to solve that. They seem to be nicking some good ideas from the proper enterprise vendors (hello Palo Zones!). Would deffo recommend if you are thinking about them as a brand...

Edited by TwiggyLobster (Wed 11-Dec-24 15:19:49)

In reply to a post by Rhynchelma:

In reply to a post by TwiggyLobster:

of dual 64k ISDN (yes, I am that old!) I

300 baud is old, you're just a youngster. And I am sure there are people here who used two tin cans connected by a taut string.

I can go back further to a 300baud acoustic coupler and a BBC model B but yeah, those tin-can guys really had it hard.....

No I don't have any FTTP It literally went live last week. I don't know - In the end I got a deal with EE for 12 months for £45 gamer package so I took that

No install fee, no upfront cost.

In reply to a post by Rhynchelma:

In reply to a post by TwiggyLobster:

of dual 64k ISDN (yes, I am that old!) I

300 baud is old, you're just a youngster. And I am sure there are people here who used two tin cans connected by a taut string.

That's how I used to connect to the tree house from the bedroom.

Ordered my re-grade to 1.6Gb yesterday. The order process was relatively painless. The e-mail notifications could be better. Take this example of the quoted broadband speeds.

Normally available download speed (Mb/s) 1600.0 and 1600.0
Normally available upload speed (Mb/s): 112.0 - 112.0
Minimum guaranteed download speed (Mb/s): 1300.0
Minimum upload speed (Mb/s): 115.0
Max download speed (Mb/s): 1620.0
Max upload speed (Mb/s): 112.0
Advertised download speed (Mb/s): 1600.0
Advertised upload speed (Mb/s): 110.0

Not the best laid out and some of the speeds appear to be contradictory.

Then there was this beauty:

We're delighted to confirm that an appointment has been scheduled for an engineer to visit your premises and install the required equipment.

Your Install Appointment
Date:
Time Slot:

Yep, the details were as shown with no date or slot listed. Plus the message was duplicated twice in the body of the e-mail. Had to phone them to find out when I could expect the ONT to be swapped.

So, your "Minimum upload speed" will be "115.0 Mb/s", but the "Max upload speed" is "112.0Mb/s"?

.

If it makes it any better - I ordered EE 1.6Gbps today and got something the same - seems to be a generic script that someone is meant to fill out.

I ordered full fibre max. 5 mins later zen phoned me back and said because I have digital voice I would lose if I upgraded because it's not compatible with the new router. I said that's ok I've been using my own hardware anyway. The Zen operative checked with his supervisor but said I would still not be able to keep digital voice. I said what difference can the speed make to the SIP server they use for digital voice. He then said my only option is to move my number to a VoIP provider and then upgrade. I'm sure this can't be right.

In reply to a post by isar:

I ordered full fibre max. 5 mins later zen phoned me back and said because I have digital voice I would lose if I upgraded because it's not compatible with the new router. I said that's ok I've been using my own hardware anyway. The Zen operative checked with his supervisor but said I would still not be able to keep digital voice. I said what difference can the speed make to the SIP server they use for digital voice. He then said my only option is to move my number to a VoIP provider and then upgrade. I'm sure this can't be right.

When I left them - BT were the only ones allowing people to take VOIP to them from another provider. Zen suggesting you take it third party is the standard move. It's better than way anyway because then you are not tied to the provider

In reply to a post by isar:

I ordered full fibre max. 5 mins later zen phoned me back and said because I have digital voice I would lose if I upgraded because it's not compatible with the new router. I said that's ok I've been using my own hardware anyway. The Zen operative checked with his supervisor but said I would still not be able to keep digital voice. I said what difference can the speed make to the SIP server they use for digital voice. He then said my only option is to move my number to a VoIP provider and then upgrade. I'm sure this can't be right.

Whomever it was you spoke to is a very confused bunny. It certainly is possible to port a number that is currently hosted by BT (Digital Voice). Number portability is mandated by OFCOM. How that number is hosted / platform or technology is irrelevant.

Of course porting will apply a cease request to all other bundled products (broadband etc) that form part of the same BT service agreement. But that's not the point.

So no, not right at all.

Info on Zen's site seems to say you lose your static IP if you go to the fastest speed. Any know for sure?

https://www.zen.co.uk/broadband/broadband-results?s=...

I explicitly asked about keeping my static IPs, as it'd be a pain to get all the trusted IPs reconfigured for work, and was told nothing would be changing. I guess I'll find out in a bit over a week.

I've asked them via email for clarification, will report here if I find anything out.

That’s almost a dealbreaker for me - I did ask and was told that my current ip would remain as its *just* a line update/ont change..

I’ve got the 23rd as an installation date so let’s see

All good, they emailed me back with:

"Thank you for your email.

You retain your same static IP address with the upgrade.
"

👍

I hope no one is going to be relying on the eero Pro 6E for their shiny new 1.6Gb connection. At least not if they prefer a wired connection. Mine's just arrived, I almost fell over laughing at it. It's got 2 ethernet ports, a 2.5Gb and a 1Gb.

From Shamazon "More bandwidth, gigabit+ speeds: supports network speeds up to 2.3 Gbps, when using both wired (up to a gigabit) and wireless (up to 1.3 Gbps) client devices."

Glad I've already got my own OPNsense router with several 2.5Gb ports. I'd be [censored] if I was having to use this thing.

In reply to a post by Noolah:

I hope no one is going to be relying on the eero Pro 6E for their shiny new 1.6Gb connection. At least not if they prefer a wired connection. Mine's just arrived, I almost fell over laughing at it. It's got 2 ethernet ports, a 2.5Gb and a 1Gb.

It looks like a poor show all around. Yes, you can control it with an app, but it doesn't have a web interface of its own. So you can manage it on a phone, which you could with a web page, but you can't manage it on anything else. I hope this does not become the fashion with other manufacturers, because we will have to go back to asking whether kit has a web interface.

In reply to a post by DFScale:

It looks like a poor show all around. Yes, you can control it with an app, but it doesn't have a web interface of its own. So you can manage it on a phone, which you could with a web page, but you can't manage it on anything else. I hope this does not become the fashion with other manufacturers, because we will have to go back to asking whether kit has a web interface.

The configuration options via the app are minimal. Even the WiFi 7 version, for an extra £120/year, with 2x 2.5G and 2x 10G ports is lacking a USB 3 port, which most current routers have. And even worse, you have to sign up to Amazon so they can handle all your communications. Wouldn't touch either version with a barge pole (or a telegraph pole?). What on earth are Zen thinking?

Not even taken mine out the box; It will sit there, unopened until I get forced to connect it to prove that the fault is at their end of the cable...

It's a bit of a poor choice and the price of the 'upgrade' to the eero7 is a joke. I guess its slightly better than the TP Link routers that seem to be creating a storm over in the US

1.6Gbit regrade went without major issue. Engineer had to phone up the call centre to get the ONT registered and speed upped as the phone app didn't work. Other than that, the PPPoE session re-established itself without issue, and static IPs are still the same. First speed test came in at 1593/115Mbps.

Edited by Noolah (Sun 22-Dec-24 18:02:09)

Is the upcoming 2gb upgrade for those only on non OpenReach service?
My hyoperoptic contract ends in Feb so thinking about joining Zen but I will miss a sync service but Hyeroptic not doing any speed upgrades so stuck on 1gb

In reply to a post by nekr0mant1k:

but I will miss a sync service

You mean a symmetric service?

You are in the lucky position of being able to choose 1G/1G with Hyperoptic, or 1.8G/120M with EE or Zen. So basically it boils down to: which is more important to you, download speed or upload speed?

Personally I wouldn't notice the difference between 1G and 1.8G download, but I'd definitely notice the difference between 120M and 1G upload (if it were available to me, which it isn't)

Aside: Openreach has announced that they will start selling symmetric services from April, but only in certain areas to start with. They have said they will use existing GPON ONTs, which implies the upload speeds won't be any faster than 1G.

ONT swapped in 10 mins. Got a nice 2.5Gb link back to my UDMP-SE

Line update is apparently automatic once the KCI3 is sent (closed the call).. still waiting!

My engineer hates upgrades - they don’t have the kit to test as their Flukes/Laptops are all Gbe so they just don’t know what’s working or not.. they are also dependent on the supplier (Zen) to actually make the cutover which left him feeling a bit frustrated as he was walking away without it all working…

So, if you do update then have some sympathy for your OpenReach engineer!

yup meant async
true however Zen only offering 1.6 for my area not 1.8.
currently use the 500/500mb service.
It does make a big difference between my old BT 500/90 service.

In reply to a post by TwiggyLobster:

ONT swapped in 10 mins. Got a nice 2.5Gb link back to my UDMP-SE

Line update is apparently automatic once the KCI3 is sent (closed the call).. still waiting!

My engineer hates upgrades - they don’t have the kit to test as their Flukes/Laptops are all Gbe so they just don’t know what’s working or not.. they are also dependent on the supplier (Zen) to actually make the cutover which left him feeling a bit frustrated as he was walking away without it all working…

So, if you do update then have some sympathy for your OpenReach engineer!

Fingers crossed for you. When they upgraded ours with EE back in May, the provisioning got fudged and it took them many weeks to un-fudge it and deliver a working service.

Have sympathy for the Openreach engineers they kept sending out in the meantime, who could do the square-root of feck all squared.

Still the service credit from EE was nice and we didn't have any EE broadband charge to pay for around 3 months after paying for the initial month.

In reply to a post by nekr0mant1k:

yup meant async
true however Zen only offering 1.6 for my area not 1.8.
currently use the 500/500mb service.
It does make a big difference between my old BT 500/90 service.

Delivered via Openreach the 1.8Gbps service is *exactly* the same service as the 1.6Gbps service. Exactly the same.

..and surprise surprise, had the email through from Zen but despite a couple of reboots, no joy at accessing the higher speed. Can't really play tonight as it will interrupt the 'household' (really need to get better at negotiating change windows!)

Will give it a reboot tomorrow and then start to diagnose - link between ONT and UDMP-SE is showing 2.5Gb so pretty sure its not my cable

Ours at the time simply wasn't being authenticated on the PON after the upgrade. The PON light was blinking rather than solid.

If your PON light is solid, then I dare say your issues are with Zen rather than OR.

If you have a lit/flashing LAN light then your Ethernet cable to your router is fine.

Edited by Pheasant (Mon 23-Dec-24 20:10:55)

That's different to how mine went. Engineer connected the new ONT, phoned (app didn't work) up their the call centre to register it. 10 minutes later and I've got 1.6Gbps, with no further involvement from Zen.

In reply to a post by nekr0mant1k:

yup meant async

The terms you are looking for are "symmetric" or "asymmetric". The terms synchronous/asynchronous are nothing to do with this (they are about clock recovery FWIW).

In reply to a post by nekr0mant1k:

true however Zen only offering 1.6 for my area not 1.8.

Openreach sells a 1.8G service, but Zen markets it as a 1.6G service. This is the same as the 1000M Openreach service being sold as 900M: it's to keep Ofcom (and customers) happy. Even though the bits on the ethernet cable run at 1000M, by the time you've removed ethernet, IP and TCP headers, a "speedtest" which measures data payload will only show ~940Mbps (for IPv4, a bit less for IPv6)

In reply to a post by nekr0mant1k:

currently use the 500/500mb service.
It does make a big difference between my old BT 500/90 service.

Then I think you've answered your own question as to which you want!

Ok - question time:

Have contacted Zen but curious as to the hive mind...

My ONT -> UDMP-SE is showing a solid 2.5Gb connection. If I put my 10Gb Mac into PPPoE mode and connect to the ONT I also see a 2.5Gb connection.

However despite Zen saying that they have done everything their end I can't get more than 940Mb down..

They are happy to send an engineer but obviously it comes with a cost if the fault is found to be my end.. Before I agree has anyone got any suggestions as to things to try?

Zens last email:

We’ve now exhausted the line tests we’re able to complete remotely which have not found a fault on the service but the speeds do seem to remain maxed out at 990mbps
...
Though the testing we’ve carried out does minimise the likelihood of an issue being found with your equipment, I just wanted to check you’re happy to proceed?

.. it can’t be my cables otherwise I wouldn’t see 2.5Gb links (all set to auto negotiate) on multiple devices..

Do you have a Zen-supplied router that can be swapped in?

Yeah. A cheapo Eero with a single 2.5gb port. Have tried with that and the supplied cable and no joy, hence why I’m 99.9% sure it’s not my end (downstream of the ONT)

940 Mbps throughput sounds very much like something is capping at a nominal 1Gbps line rate.

From the initial tests you've done, it sounds like it may be a profile issue with BTW. I have had this in the long distant past when migrating from 330/30 (was a weird FoD tier) to the full Gig tier with Cerberus at the time. T'was a provisioning issue with the backend systems at BT Wholesale.

That’s what it feels like but thought I’d double check!

Well if you're absolutely certain that your link rate on the copper port is 2.5G -> then ISP-land is the next/only logical place to start sniffing around.

How much longer before Openreach wake up and get rid of PPPoE and asymmetric profiles.

Openreach don't insist on PPPoE on their GEA-FTTP. That's a BTW thing.

Symmetric on Openreach GPON is coming in a few months.

As Pheasant said. If you don't want PPPoE then Sky and TalkTalk can give you that today.

Openreach are also not going to get rid of the old profiles as low end GPON-delivered services are where the majority of the market is. Anybody expecting to be able to buy symmetric 150Mbps for £25 is going to be disappointed.

Edited by jpm (Thu 02-Jan-25 12:10:13)

Anybody expecting to be able to buy symmetric 150Mbps for £25 is going to be disappointed.

From Openreach at least

I see that Briant Broadband (https://briantbroadband.com/), who I'd not previously heard of, have been added to the list City Fibre suppliers. They will, they say, give me a symmetrical 2Mb service for £45.99 a month, instead of £54.99. They are based in Worthing and have a dog on the customer service team.
My Zen contract expires on 22 February.

As another option, Aquiss will do you 2G symmetric for £52 per month, reduced to £26 for first 3 months, on a 12 month contract with static IPv4/IPv6; it works out slightly cheaper over the initial 12 month period. But you have to provide your own router. And you'll need to check if they have Cityfibre coverage in your area.

https://www.aquiss.net/cityfibre-home-fttp-packages/

That's not necessarily correct. If you're in a CityFibre GPON area you can only get the Aquiss CityFibre 2000 product, which is 1800/900 Mbps. To get the CityFibre 2500 product - symmetric 2200/2200 Mbps - you need the XGS-PON service. I know because I asked and was disappointed with the answer.

Oh yes, sorry. The symmetric XGS-PON 2.5/2.5 service is £56 (discounted to £28 for first three months).

In reply to a post by candlerb:

As another option, Aquiss will do you 2G symmetric for £52 per month, reduced to £26 for first 3 months, on a 12 month contract with static IPv4/IPv6; it works out slightly cheaper over the initial 12 month period. But you have to provide your own router. And you'll need to check if they have Cityfibre coverage in your area.

https://www.aquiss.net/cityfibre-home-fttp-packages/

Thanks for that. Aquiss will allow me to order 'Family Unlimited CityFibre 2500'. And I have a decent router.

Can report that after a 30 sec visit from an engineer that as expected it was a profile thing..

Once updated then line resync'd to the new speed and I'm showing 1.6Gb down and the [censored] (but expected) 120Mb back up.

Now what to do with all that bandwidth....