Ah dear, such a good run of decent posts, and now you come out with this one . Seeing as you replied to me I take it to mean you are aiming it at me, though most of it is applicable whether or not.

In reply to a post by tommy45:

If there is an install charge for FTTC then we should expect the job to be done right 1st time
1, engineer fit's OR vdsl faceplate (up to you if you wish to swap back to your own) if you so wish and have a filtered face place ,many on adsl don't

Isn't that what I said, somewhat more clearly?

2, the engineer should perform all tests from the master socket that are standard practise, which should highlight any potential issues at that point, be it a pre existing line fault or something not 100% with the install

Some of that is obvious, some may be open to question. I don't know exactly what the specification of the task is, and neither do you. The rightness or wrongness of the task specification would be another matter, best raised by you in a dedicated thread rather than disrupting this one.

3 only leave once you have a sync( upto customer to enter log on details into router) or wait for the ISP to do it automatically via their inbuilt back door)

See my post. That would be a managed install, simples. The connection to the internet, either through the user's router or direct from a single computer is absolutely not part of the task specification. What is required is that his tests show a satisfactory sync with the DSLAM from his equipment and that the modem also sync's.

I don't think he has to check what sync the modem achieves, but there I would agree he should have to.

4 , possibly re locate master socket if needed due to lack of available power sockets ect all should be performed as they are part of the install process

Not if the Home Wiring Solution has not been ordered. That is free and must involve allocation of extra time to the job, or at least to his schedule for the shift. Without it, IMHO he would be perfectly entitled to abort the job if he thought it would take too long. Even though that would involve undoing anything he had done at the cabinet.

Fine if the isp don't want to send a BTOR engineer, they may as well just send the modem in the post along with the VDSLfaceplate ,and no visit to customers premises required at all, but they could find that these options could tun out to be more expensive long term botched installs ect a recipe for disaster ,

I don't know what you are trying to say there. It's gobble-de-gook. Are you saying Openreach should reverse the policy in this quote:-

Openreach intend to introduce a GEA-FTTC product variant that allows the CP to provide and be responsible for the users VDSL2 modem.

and covered in this News Article? That would be better discussed in the comments to that or again - by your starting a new thread about it.
_{Edit - typo.}

Edited by RobertoS (Fri 18-Jan-13 19:29:22)

Well the job isn't being done properly by Kelly com's and i as a customer would not happy at being charged for such a botched up install , or would be seeking a refund or a fully trained BT openreach to visit to carry out the instal properly

And what kelly com's is doing isn't what they are tasked to do by OR they are cutting corners hence why i would object to them accessing my threshold to carry out their botch it and scarper install (delivering the bt modem) why should anyone pay for this ?

In reply to a post by Bright:

The filtered faceplate isn't mine, it's BT's. They fitted it when they did an engineer install of my original (512kbps) ADSL service.

They have disowned these and it now belongs to you. This change happened fairly soon after self-install ADSL became the norm.
The network termination is the test point behind the SSFP.

I agree fully with that post tommy . Just I got riled at the one before, which maybe I shouldn't have done. Sorry.

Don't forget the OR installation charge includes quite a lot of work at the exchange, possibly at two, plus the "software" allocation/provisioning of the FTTC port at the cabinet, plus the cabinet connection changes. The home visit, (with no HWS), should be well under 30 minutes long even when done properly.

In reply to a post by Jaggies:

They have disowned these and it now belongs to you. This change happened fairly soon after self-install ADSL became the norm.
The network termination is the test point behind the SSFP.

That's interesting... thanks!
So now I'm rather more peeved that the Kelly engineer didn't fit the correct VDSL faceplate.

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

Don't forget the OR installation charge includes quite a lot of work at the exchange, possibly at two, plus the "software" allocation/provisioning of the FTTC port at the cabinet, plus the cabinet connection changes. The home visit, (with no HWS), should be well under 30 minutes long even when done properly.

Just out of curiosity, are there any changes to the voice path at the exchange when upgrading to FTTC? Or does the E-side pair just continue to terminate (via the MDF) on the MSAN, and that gets re-programmed to just provide voice service on that line? (at least I assume how it's wired).
If so, what work is required at the exchange, since I assume there will already be a logical path between the street cabinet MSAN and the ISP gateway router via BTW?
I've never seen this properly explained... any idea if there's a good diagram of it somewhere?
Many thanks!

Re the voice line, I'm not entirely sure what happens, but you've got one bit wrong way round, which won't help you .

On a voice only line that has never had broadband it gets from the premises to the MDF by pure phone-line equipment. When it gets broadband it is routed instead to the CP/ISP's MSAN or DSLAM and jumpered from there to the MDF, if SMPF/WLR. What happens from the MSAN for LLU/MPF phone I'm a bit lost on.

So it isn't via the MDF to the MSAN, it is via the MSAN to the MDF.

When there is an ADSL cease, I believe it is left in situ attached to the MSAN for the next occupant of the premises unless the ADSL port is needed. At least for BT Wholesale-based ADSL.

At what point the ADSL physical connection on a line is ceased when FTTC is installed for the premises is a further question. I believe the filtering at the cabinets isolates it from the d-side even if still there.

I think you are right that the background linking at the exchange for FTTC is done at cabinet installation time, at least for the number of cards initially installed. Then it's just a question of software control/allocation of the subscriber to the port and from the MSAN into the correct backhaul network. There's a chunk of switching kit at the exchange between the subscribers and the MSANs/GEA cable links.

Thanks for the clarification, Bob. I'd forgotten the bit about the line terminating on the DSLAM first then back to the MDF for connection to the voice switch. Although I think, strictly speaking, all copper lines come in through the cable chamber and terminate on the MDF before being jumpered to the DSLAM via a hand-over frame, so maybe we were both right

It's getting pretty complex now... life was so much easier when you could hear the location of a fault by listening to the two-motion selectors

SNAP !
Was provisioned today (21/1/13) on the 40/10 and I've ordered and paid for 80/20. Took a couple of calls to CS. Asked them to check what was ordered from BTOR and lo and behold, its the capped product.

I was advised it'll take 24hrs to sort out. I'll update after that.

Also any one used a Draytek 2830 (or similar) in place of the Plusnet Thomson router ?

Cheers
FS

I had my fibre installed by bt today and now I get an even slower speed than I had with ADSL 4.5 megs when the BT bloke checked the line before going he said that his tests showed the line was capable of 80 megs so what has happened now i don't know.

Plusnet telling phone users that there is 1 hours delay before phone is answered. waited so long for fibre to come to yeovil and now am so disappointed.

BTW package is unlimited top speed