Upto Speeds

I currently have Upto 76 Mbps with BT but generally get around 40 - 50Mbps

I'm thinking of switching to Vodafones Upto 38Mbps

Should I get close to the 38 as the line can obviously handle more or would I expect a similar % drop in speeds ie maybe 20-30?

You "shouldn't" experience a proportional drop in speeds.

What are the VDSL A and B lines in the table from this phone number query please?

VDSL Range A (Clean) 64.2 44.6 17.9 11.7 39.8 Available -- -- Yes --
VDSL Range B (Impacted) 53.7 33.9 15.4 8 27.6 Available -- -- Yes --

From those figures I think your best move may be to see if BT will downgrade you to Infinity 1 (55/10 maximum connection speed) free of charge if saving a bit would be good, of course ending up on the lower tariff.

Before asking them about that though we should look at how your connection is organised in the house. It can make several Mbps difference.

Are you connecting through an extension socket ot the master socket? If the master, using a filtered faceplate or a dangly filter?

Are there any extension sockets on the premises? It is irrelevant whether you use them or not. Just their existence matters.
_{Edit: Typo.}

Edited by RobertoS (Sat 09-Dec-17 23:44:26)

My Vodafone 38mbps service has a down speed of 40mbps and a max attainable of 48131.

Late evening speed tests from this site often show download speeds of about 36mbps.

The BT Broadband availability checker for my line shows a lower expected speed than yours.

In addition to RobertoS's advice, you should also carry out the Quiet Line Test , dialling 17070 on (hopefully) your Land-Line Phone.

Have you any idea what length your phone line is, from your modem, out to your PCP (assuming you are not on an Exchange-Only line); and onward to your FTTC (local VDSL source), which should be under 100 Metres from the PCP and may be adjacent to it.

Be wary, "my" FTTC is 10 Metres from my front door; and 40 Metres from "my" PCP, but the original phone wiring from PCP to house, the show-house on a green-field site and second nearest to the PCP, wanders 250 Metres to get to the house, so for FTTC-VDSL purposes, my phone line is about 300 Metres long!

Thanks,

My modem is connected straight into a new bt master socket with built in filter and there's no extensions running from it. My pc is connected to the modem via powerline adapter. Even when connected via Wi-Fi with mobile devices in the same room as router the speed test results can be as low as 30.

I had openreach out as I complained about speeds after bt advised they were upping my speed to upto 76mbps and I was only getting 30-40. They said the line was fine but had been capped at the cabinet for some reason. I haven't seen a great improvement since then and do notice a lot of fluctuation on speeds.

In reply to a post by scootymack:

My modem is connected straight into a new bt master socket with built in filter and there's no extensions running from it. My pc is connected to the modem via powerline adapter. Even when connected via Wi-Fi with mobile devices in the same room as router the speed test results can be as low as 30.

You need to do a speed test connected directly to the router/modem, not via a powerline adapter or wi-fi, that is the only way to measure the true speed.

Call BT go to cancellations, speak with retentions on getting switched to Unlimited BT Infinity 1, it should bring down the price considerably and is 55Meg ie not much reduction in speed.

Let us know how you get on - number to call 0800 800150 and reason for call "cancellations." Once through to cancellations let them know the price is too high, if they cannot bring the price down you will switch to Vodafone. Make it clear you are happy to go to Unlimited Infinity 1. Don't be afraid to ask for a manager if they say this is the best price, it usually isn't the best price the manager can do

I appreciate that my internal connections wont give me true speed indications. However when we first moved in 9 months ago and got fibre connected on upto 55mbps I was getting 45-50 speed results regularly while still using wifi or powerline adapters.

I will defo phone BT and see if they will downgrade me and see what price they offer

I'm pretty sure the cabinet and PCP are next to each other on the street and would say easily within 200m from my house. I know the main BT cable comes up from the street through my neighbours garden to the pole just at the rear of my garden

That about 200 Metres does not seem to stack up against your actual speeds and the "Impacted Speeds".

It looks as though the phone line distance is significantly greater.

The Line Attenuation figures from your Modem would be useful.

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In one case I am aware of, the user thought he was about 250 Metres from his known and identified PCP and FTTC.


Measuring it, he was at least 650 Metres minimum, up to 950 Metres - possibly more.

Those distances tied in reasonably with his Line Attenuations.

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When talking to BT, make sure you avoid giving the impression that you are "cancelling" there and then - you could be left without Broadband for some weeks, partly depending how many of the slots in the FTTC are occupied.

If you do decide to change ISP, leave it to the new/receiving ISP handles that aspect.

Line Attenuation is 19.1dB

My Line Attenuation at a relatively accurate length of 300 Metres from the FTTC is 13.4 db.

Your Line Attenuation of 19.1 db, suggests that it is substantially longer, thus greater losses leading on to lower speeds.

So although there is little or nothing that you can do about its routeing etc, worth getting a more accurate idea of how it travels to get to your house.

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I know of two similar blocks of flats, basically each block being built on three sides of a rectangle, the fourth sides being unbuilt and facing one another across a service road.

I was parked between them and noted that each block had a central phone pole, with overhead wires to each of their respective flats, typical of such places.

The westerly block is about 150 Metres further from the PCP etc, than the easterly block.

So generally that Westerly block has slower VDSL speeds than the Easterly block.

I suddenly realised that there was a solitary overhead wire passing above my car, from the Westerly Pole to the flat in the Easterly block, directly - not via the Easterly Pole.

That one Easterly flat is likely to have a significantly lower VDSL speed than the Westerly flats; and significantly less than all the other flats in the Easterly block, given that the line must be approaching 300 Metres LONGER than those other Easterly flats.

300 Metres = 150 Metres going beyond to reach the Westerly Pole plus another 150 Metres to get back to that solitary Easterly flat.

No obvious reason for that routeing.

I also know of much worse, in another location - although there is a simple historical reason for it, affecting about 5 houses. Distances involved are very significant.

Edited by deleted (Tue 12-Dec-17 07:21:09)

BT weren't interested in downgrading my package and the best they were willing to do was £28.99 to recommit for another year so have now placed my order to move to Vodafone 38Meg Fibre their estimate is minimum 35meg with activation on 2nd Jan.

We won't be home on the 2nd so does anyone know if it's best to connect the router on morning of the 1st before we leave or wait till evening of 3rd when back?

So I've managed to move things around and when I connect my PC to the router by cable I'm getting 60meg down and 20meg up which is what BT reported I should get.

I understand the limitations of the powerline adapters but wonder why when literally a few feet away from the router using my mobile phone the wifi only gets around 30 down and 15 up?

Once I move to Vodafone on 38meg service do you think there will be much difference in speeds that I get with the powerline adapters or Wifi?

I think that you are unlikely to see much difference on the WiFi.

The WiFi is effectively a different comms link from the Broadband over the phone line.

Just as the Fibre to the FTTC is a different comms system technically from the electrical signals produced in the FTTC to feed in to the extended phone line

It is rather like travelling on a bus or train, and then having to change to a local bus service.

I almost said an express service; but depending on the quality of your phone line from the FTTC via the PC to the modem at your house, that part may be motorway or dual carriageway or a main road or ...

The phone line, although basically from another era when broadband did not exist, has known characteristics etc; and to a considerable degree, the equipment is designed around those - with surprising improvements already and more coming along.

Then looking at the WiFi, particularly in small devices such as laptops, it is specifically very low power, in the radio bands chosen to maximise absorption, so as to minimise interference with other services.

The Low Power also is to minimise the load and discharge of the battery when away from the mains - hence also being able to switch the WiFi off.

Try checking how far outside your house, you can detect your own WiFi signals.

You've already noted the variability within your house.

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Changing your ISP will not change your laptop's WiFi circuitry, in a small unit about 1.25 inches by 1 inch by 0.2 inches "thick" in size, generally feeding two aerials built behind the LCD screen, each only about 0.75 inches square.

The few WiFi "bits" I have extracted from scrapped laptops etc, all appear to be made by the one manufacturer.

That leaves the corresponding part in the modem - which I am less familiar with.

There may be greater variability there; and modems with obvious short aerials protruding are likely to be better than those with aerials similar to the laptop variety, inside.

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Then the permanent characteristics of each and every house varies.

Is it an ancient house with thick stone walls?

Is it a brick house with brick internal walls?

Is it a brick house with timber stud walls and plasterboard with metal backing?

Is it a concrete house?

All those aspects can drastically affect WiFi performance, before even considering the precise locations of the both modem and laptop within.

I obtained a WiFi Repeater for a lounge that we added on many years back, "outside" the original house.

There are only two locations within the lounge where the Repeater works successfully.

It is in the normally better location - but I noted that dropping a typical metallic foil crisp bag in a near-by waste basket, can cut off the primary WiFi signal from the modem!

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Re your mobile phone, assuming you are holding it, your hand and flesh may be absorbing the WiFi signal, just as meat in the microwave cooker absorbs the 2.4 GHz RF from the magnetron at the heart of virtually all microwave cookers (and most RADAR sets).

When used as a mobile phone conventionally, it works on a significantly lower frequency, less affected by such aspects.

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Only experimentation can prove whether you can improve your own WiFi.