No FTTC available in new build?

Hi everybody,

I am currently connected using Virgin Media but for over 6 months the latency on my connection has been absolutely terrible, any online gaming has been impossible during the day. Looks like over utilisation in my area, which will obviously not be fixed by Virgin as they keen pushing the "fix" date. My whole estate looks to be connected via Virgin.

I have been looking to switch providers because I don't mind having slower speeds as long as my latency is low and stable. I currently do NOT have a phone line installed so I have been using the address checker to find available speeds. To my surprise, I can only get up to 8 Mbps and no FTTC is available. My house has been built in 2018.

Would having a phone line installed change the speeds estimates? I also cannot find my cabinet on the Telecom Tariffs website, which is weird.

I'm worried that my developer signed a deal with Virgin Media and then connected everybody to a slow cabinet so nobody can leave as all postcodes around me seem to show the same speeds on that cabinet.

Does anyone have any suggestions on what I can do apart from moving?

Does the address checker know your exact address, i.e. you selected your actual house number? Then it's quite likely correct - you're not on an FTTC cabinet. You might want to post an image of the address checker results, with your address blanked out obviously, to be sure.

Yes I can select my actual address. I do have two options though, one of them includes my plot number but the other is just the address. Both show the same speed estimates.

Here is the screenshot of the results.
https://i.imgur.com/4ekXVFQ.png

What's your 4G mobile signal like? Quite a few people on these forums have gone to mobile broadband now. Including myself.

Though quite a few are seeing what is probably lockdown-pressure on that as well.

Did the developer build at least 30 homes? If so, then really strange they chose Openreach copper instead of Openreach FTTP as they could have had the latter for no extra cost - despite any deal they signed with Virgin Media.

the developer wouold have had to dual source the site for that -depends when the site was called off - site migth have been called off 2 or 3 years before the resident moved in - what exchange is this and how big is the development

copper only sites - probably virgin already as you already advise - assume that cab now wont be enabled as very little if any FTTc outside of specific programme will be done - no commercial crtiera to overbuild existing network provider

In reply to a post by Fastman3:

copper only sites - probably virgin already as you already advise - assume that cab now wont be enabled as very little if any FTTc outside of specific programme will be done - no commercial crtiera to overbuild existing network provider

That got me a little confused, as a reply to me . My only post in the thread has been about the possible alternative of mobile broadband .

Post on end of thread...

Cab 64 Duston just copper, no VDSL2 likely down to first postcodes being of 2013/14 era i.e. before the Openreach FTTP new build deals were a thing. So likely developer did a deal with Openreach.

If copper network is in place and ducted then might get lucky and see FTTP in the next couple of years. This is happening on a number of new build estates that had just ADSL or FTTC.

If roads have not been adopted by local authority it is still private land and developer may have given way leave for copper but extra work is being blocked.

Cab 57 south of Weedon Road is a similar story

new pcp - copper deal no deal with developer - looks like from openreach perspective as far as i can see

Thank you for those details.

It's very annoying that I'm stuck with VM for the forseable future and they don't even want to fix the over utilisation issues happening right now. The speeds are fine it's just the latency that is a massive issue.

I don't think 4G is an option as that also has not ideal latency.

Here is my live BQM graph https://www.thinkbroadband.com/broadband/monitoring/...

Another option could be getting a Virgin Media business connection but I'm pretty sure traffic goes via the same cabinet. Would a business connection be any different in terms of latency?

I also believe I could get a leased line to my house, which I could possibly share with my neighbours.

Does anyone have any other ideas?

In reply to a post by PaddyS:

I also believe I could get a leased line to my house, which I could possibly share with my neighbours.

Does anyone have any other ideas?

FTTPoD or community funded fibre. Both won't be a quick fix though.

Unfortunately you can only order FTTPoD if you already served by an FTTC-enabled cabinet:
https://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/products/ultra...

That leaves CFP as only viable option.

I think your estate is a prime candidate to get Openreach FTTP: no FTTx, only 1 provider which offers fast speeds but is heavily subscribed and perhaps the most important factor of all: new build estate = clear ducts = relatively fast to roll out FTTP. I'd be very surprised if you didn't see Openreach FTTP within 5 years, probably a lot sooner.

In the meantime it might be worth trying a high quality VPN service such as AAISP's L2TP service to see if it improves latency. Stay away from mass el-cheapo providers such as NordVPN etc. With AAISPs service, you pay £10/m then setup a L2TP connection on your router (most third party routers support this) using your AAISP username & password. You are given a static ipv4 address by AAISP and this always remains the same whenever you connect via AAISP. A router such as the Asus RT-AC86U would be perfect to setup a L2TP connection - simply plug this into Virgin's router. The downsides of AAISP service are that its capped at 1 TB per month and speeds are limited to 100 Mb/s to keep the freeloaders away.

https://www.aa.net.uk/broadband/l2tp-service/

Edited by deleted (Thu 18-Jun-20 12:56:26)

AAISP isn't a VPN, as the L2TP is not encrypted. They explain this on their website.

My bad on the FTTPoD requirement to have the vdsl cab standing..

Edited by Taras (Thu 18-Jun-20 12:59:28)

In reply to a post by jchamier:

AAISP isn't a VPN, as the L2TP is not encrypted. They explain this on their website.

Yeah I'm well aware that its not encrypted but it may improve latency if the OP gives it a try. Its certainly a far better option - wrt speeds - than mass commercial VPN providers with their heavily loaded VPN servers.

Edited by deleted (Thu 18-Jun-20 13:05:38)

Your traffic still has to go via VM's network to AA's network to terminate the L2TP service, before going to the final destination. If you can reach AA's network with low latency, you can probably reach most of the UK Internet with low latency, so it's unlikely to help much.

AA may have have better international transit though. Also, they will give you a static IPv4 address and IPv6 block.

In reply to a post by Highland76:

Yeah I'm well aware that its not encrypted but it may improve latency if the OP gives it a try. Its certainly a far better option - wrt speeds - than mass commercial VPN providers with their heavily loaded VPN servers.

Yes it might work, but without encryption, if there is any "deep packet inspection" on the path that is slowing things down, it may still slow it down.

Thank you for all of your suggestions. I'm not sure a VPN will solve my latency issues.

I have came across something interesting. I ran a availability check on the SKY website and apparently I am able to get download speed 18-37Mb/s with 16 MB/s minimum guaranteed.

Is this a mistake in their database or is this actually accurate? Based on the BT search website I will not be able to get more than 8Mb/s.

Screenshot:
https://imgur.com/dWmrobQ

Thank you

What does the checker here say for your property?? If no FTTC, then its likely to be an error on Sky's website, ie you're limited to ADSL2+.

Edit: just seen your earlier post, where FTTC isn't shown on the BT checker - so highly unlikely to get more than ADSL2+ with Sky.

Edited by deleted (Mon 22-Jun-20 12:32:30)

It might be a mistake since one address within my postcode is connected to a different cabinet (22).

This is so annoying since that property is less than 30m away from my house and they can get FTTC/FTTPoD where as I am stuck with [censored] Virgin Media connection that has crazy latency spikes.

why woudl openreach want to invest in an area where these is already blanket virgin coverage

Maybe to give residents a choice of ~ 700 CPs who use Openreach infrastructure instead of just 1 CP which is heavily subscribed and congested as a result?

Edited by deleted (Mon 22-Jun-20 21:47:35)

I'm sure they don't want to compete unless they have to. More about market share and customer base.

In reply to a post by Fastman3:

why woudl openreach want to invest in an area where these is already blanket virgin coverage

Because Virgin have helped educate the market of the benefits of high speed broadband?

The old saying goes: if you want to start a Chinese restaurant, the best place to do it is in Chinatown.

In reply to a post by Fastman3:

why woudl openreach want to invest in an area where these is already blanket virgin coverage

To get users back on their network who currently use Virgin.

In most non Virgin areas there's less incentive for OpenReach to roll out FTTC or FTTP as they effectively have a monopoly over the area.

In Virgin areas with poor OpenReach availability a large proportion of users will be on Virgin.
Bringing SuperFast/Ultrafast will encourage customers back to their network.

OpenReach could possibly even get a better return on investment in Virgin areas as they make more from new customers they didn't have than they do from upselling existing customers.

There's plenty examples of OpenReach actively targeting Virgins Project Lightning areas with FTTP.

Within a few months of Virgin rolling out to my area OpenReach have come along and installed FTTP.

the commercial case will be poor probably - there will be some overlap on recent new build and probably in areas such as fibre cities -- the business case will have been very targeted in areas that are good and worthwhile - so - openreach only gain the line rental - that about about circa £10 a month -- that all - you had to be very sure of any investment over a significant period of time (probably in a number of tens of years) to cover your investment

you might have be in the right area, at the right time in the right situation

In reply to a post by Fastman3:

openreach only gain the line rental - that about about circa £10 a month

That's for ADSL LLU. For FTTC and FTTP Openreach make more, as they're providing more than just the copper pair.

e.g. for FTTP 80/20 they get £207.36 per year, which is £17.28 per month. OR pricelist:
https://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/products/prici...

In reply to a post by Fastman3:

Why would openreach want to invest in an area where these is already blanket virgin coverage/

Why wouldn't they want to do it? Virgin had the monopoly for speed in my area until FTTC came along. Quite a few of the Neighbours in my road have switched away from Virgin now there is competition. We've now got FTTP so no reason to stop with Virgin anymore if it was speed you needed.

Why aren't Virgin rolling out in every area that BT are in - surely they should just get on and rollout 100% coverage?

Why for both firms...when you have a certain number of staff you can only do so much in a year.

Plus the costs of building etc

I was pointing out the inverse - if Virgin can't build a case for rolling out 100% then why would people expect Openreach to? There are many people who complain about Openreach saying why aren't alternative networks available and the economics are the same the other way around. We have many people wanting just 1 superfast supplier but then we get some people insisting there should be 2 because they don't like the one they have.

Openreach FTTP overlap with Virgin RFOG is running at only 11,000 premises