In reply to a post by equiton:

The staff told me today that its a fibre cable? but they are still only getting 2-4mbs? I can make no sense of it.

At my previous job one of the offices had ISDN supplied over fibre. They were getting about the same kind of speed. I think it was PRI ISDN.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Primary_Rate_Interface

I think they used it for voice comms and their mail servers. Their main internet connection was dual-bonded ADSL like ours at the time. ADSL was faster but unstable so business critical function was better on fibre.

Anyway everyone on that site now has FTTSR (Fibre To the Server Room )

ISDN30 for switchboards is supplied over fibre (amongst other delivery mechanisms). It simply delivers voice circuits.

Thanks for all those answers. Slowly I am building a picture of the situation.
Currently the residence of the villages believe that FTTC is not far away for them due to the information Digital Derbyshire gave the parish council. If I can get a clearer answer or at least get the Parish Council to see that nothing is likely to happen for a few years. Already the Head of the Council who initialy said the situation was been dealt with is talking about the possibilities of FTTP to the sub cabinet been privatly financed.
For the council leased line, they have put fibre in, does that line need to go back to where it can connect with other fibre or can it mix with existing copper systems?

Leased line fibre has no diret relationship with "broadband". They may use some of the 21CN backhaul but it does not have any relation to residential broadband availability (leased line fibre has been available pretty much everywhere in the country for decades).

Leased lines are totally distinct and separate from the fibre systems used for the FTTC services. For leased lines it not unusual for a council or business to specify things like start and end point too.

Your issue is best shown on a map and there are two

http://www.coolwebhome.co.uk/images/alvaston.jpg simple dot per postcode
http://www.coolwebhome.co.uk/images/alvaston-text.jpg flag with postcode and estimated speed

Shows clearly your issue, i.e. served by a cabinet so ticks fibre based broadband box, but does not tick the superfast broadband box. Council may not understand the difference.

Their targets are likely to be such that they can afford to not worry about the few hundred out of around 10,000 on that exchange who are not getting decent speeds. If you cannot get 2 Mbps via ADSL or the FTTC service then some funding to boost to USC 2 Mbps speeds might be available, but that might be given out as a cheap 4G dongle looking at where you are, i.e. close to a central Derby.

Fibre leased lines have existed for well over a decade.

You are aware you can order FTTPoD in your village.

No convinced by that but that's what the checker says ... Interesting....

Also where the hell is cab 7?

Regards,


Gareth

I spotted that this lunchtime. Its a very recent development. I have been trying to get some indication of prices. With it been approx 3.3kms from cabinet 7 to our premises its likely to be more than i can currently afford and way beyond any requirements we have. It may make a joint community effort more viable though but that will not happen untill there is a clear answer about FTTC.
Cabinet 7 is on shardlow road opposite Coronantion Avenue. http://goo.gl/maps/T67Cs

Was the picture of Bill a contractual obligation? Nice.

http://www.derbyshire.gov.uk/business/community_broa...

Every council seems to have one!

Anyway, you're basically on Cab 7. So it sounds like you're line is too long. The good news is that you are in a commercial area and should be able to order FTTPoD.

However, BT are looking at what to do with long lines. One of the solution is micro DSLAMS AKA FTTDP or some form of FTTC sub-cabinet.

However, the first deployment of FTTDP (i will bet you on this) will be to flats within FTTP areas not FTTC.

Why? Because there are some complexities with having FTTPD gear within FTTC areas which require vectoring and I think might required additional processing capabilities within each exchange - so isn't yet being considered. A normal FTTC cabinet within the footprint of a FTTC also has exactly the same issues.

What this means is that BT will probably provide something in the next few years. But what they provide isn't yet clear.

I guess the area is commercially viable if you have 150+ houses and they all go to the same DP/sub cab.

People seem to think Vectoring / fibre to the DP will be used to increase speeds for people with 60+Mbps connections - I doubt this. I think it more likely to be used to extend the reach of the network to include areas like yours.

Regards,


Gareth

In reply to a post by garethr:

However, BT are looking at what to do with long lines. One of the solution is micro DSLAMS AKA FTTDP or some form of FTTC sub-cabinet.

However, the first deployment of FTTDP (i will bet you on this) will be to flats within FTTP areas not FTTC.

Why? Because there are some complexities with having FTTPD gear within FTTC areas which require vectoring and I think might required additional processing capabilities within each exchange - so isn't yet being considered. A normal FTTC cabinet within the footprint of a FTTC also has exactly the same issues.

People seem to think Vectoring / fibre to the DP will be used to increase speeds for people with 60+Mbps connections - I doubt this. I think it more likely to be used to extend the reach of the network to include areas like yours.

Removed a few bits.

The smaller DSLAMs aren't for DPs. They are 64 line units and will be used on things like 100 pair trunk cables.

I know you think that MK's flats are getting FTTDP, last I heard there were no plans for FTTDP to be released on a commercial basis any time soon. Openreach will continue to throw money down the privy deploying FTTP in MK, just takes longer due to having to get building owners, etc, on board for FTTP in MDUs.

FTTDP does not bring any complexities within FTTC areas which require vectoring, either the two are simply not going to be used together, no FTTC at all on DPs with FTTDP , or the FTTDP will have complete power masking to ensure it doesn't use anything at or below 17MHz. FTTDP doesn't require additional processing capabilities within an exchange, it's a miniature DSLAM really close to the customers that'll use an Ethernet backhaul, nothing more. One could be backhauled via GPON or via direct Ethernet, indeed one thought for prolonging the life of the FTTC cabinets is swapping out VDSL cards for FTTP OLT cards and using them to backhaul FTTDP, in cases where they aren't being used to deliver directly to premises.

In any event it isn't being considered anywhere for a commercial deployment. It is not in the ANFP, it has not been considered for the ANFP, and has not gone through any kind of consultation process. G.Fast itself hasn't even been ratified as a standard yet. BT have never jumped out of the blocks to release commercial products first based on unproven standards, no reason to think otherwise here.

The first instances of FTTx that isn't cabinet or building look like they'll be the mentioned FTTRN, quite possibly these, as featured here, in areas too far from the cabinet for FTTC.

EDIT: Yes I'm aware that BT plan on trialing G.Fast in the field, they also trialed both BPON and GPON FTTP and VDSL/VDSL2 in the field a long time before they were deployed as commercial products.

Edited by deleted (Sun 23-Mar-14 18:00:24)

Got some clear answers today. It was just as many here had predicted.
It is not seen as viable to provide FTTC commercialy due to distances and aluminium cabling. At the same time Digital Derbyshire are treating the area as covered by existing and exspected commercial coverage.
I enquired about getting a quote for FTTPod, its not realy a viable option at costs looking likly to be a minimum of 7-8k before the price rises at the end of next month and it could easily be double that with the price rise. lt may a reasonable deal for somebody with those requirements and predominatly office based. We do not need anything like that and are often site based so the one plan is what i am now using. Combing that with my landline I am getting upload speeds of 2-2.5 megs and i found some good 4g upload spots just a couple of miles away if there is a rush
Next part of the plan is to make sure digital derbshire know the status of the area and get that corrected. will also try and find out how much of a demand there is for better boadband in the community.