In reply to a post by zom22:

The FTTC network demarcation point is the lan side of the modem - so the modem in its entirety is part of the network you are not allowed to interfere with (or sell!).

It can't be, it has a nice end user removable connector on the wall socket that it connects to. Also ISPs are now supplying no engineer to fit the service. The FTTC (VDSL) network demarcation is the same as ADSL - the NTE5.

The fact that Openreach loan a box is a financial issue, similar to Virgin Media loaning you a box to receive the "services" under contract. Should you terminate the contract they are at right to recover the box or payment thereof. None of this is "illegal" as its not broken a law, its just contractual terms. (That I suspect the individual probably hasn't signed or agreed to, as its in the ISP to Openreach agreement).

Believe me! Openreach will never asked to return it back! As for Virgin Media they did ASK me to return Superhub 2 which I did!

When my BT/OR Modem died shortly after installation, the Engineer took the dud away so they can send it back for a Warranty Replacement.

Clearly, BT/OR think it's theirs (rightly or wrongly).

Sorry to 'muddy the water' on the issue...

Rather than guess, I asked Openreach. They told me the modem is issued to the ISP and it's up to the ISP what happens to it. The ISP told me it's mine after the initial contract period.

Sorry to spoil the guessing game.

In reply to a post by G3UZF:

When my BT/OR Modem died shortly after installation, the Engineer took the dud away so they can send it back for a Warranty Replacement.

Clearly, BT/OR think it's theirs (rightly or wrongly).

Sorry to 'muddy the water' on the issue...

More likely they removed the dud one to dispose of it in an approved manner, rather than the user send it to landfill. AIUI all electrical item suppliers these days must offer a free disposal service. Link.

Thanks for the clarification.

A handy link for FTTC stuff.

http://br0kent3l3ph0n3.files.wordpress.com/2012/11/b...

In reply to a post by zom22:

The FTTC network demarcation point is the lan side of the modem - so the modem in its entirety is part of the network you are not allowed to interfere with (or sell!).

Care to share the source of this information? It's my understanding that the master socket is the demarcation point, as it is with legacy broadband and phone...

In reply to a post by zom22:

From a legal/contractual point of view it is exactly as per a gas meter/gas pressure regulation device or electric meter/main fuse - not for you to touch in any manner.

There is no law surrounding this area and as such I suspect it's entirely different compared to regulations surrounding gas and electricity. Happy to be proven wrong though, should you be able to supply the source of the information.

Paul

Edited by deleted (Thu 14-Aug-14 10:59:59)

Also if dud under warranty, Openreach may get money back if x% of units fail in first Y months.

In reply to a post by systemx:

A handy link for FTTC stuff.

http://br0kent3l3ph0n3.files.wordpress.com/2012/11/b...

Excellent document, thanks.

It clearly states that the NTE5 (master socket) is the OR demarcation point (page 25 bottom most paragraph).

Paul

Edited by deleted (Thu 14-Aug-14 11:33:22)