well first to answer your question, openreach are the ones who will own the installed fibre and be able to sell services again and again on that fibre for the life of the fibre. That is a pretty big reason why they should pay for it. Its a bit like me buying a car but then having to pay to rent it out as well.

However the FTTPoD design is not what I was questioning, simply the size of the costs.

I see its now been explained that costs are apparently much higher when its under a carriageway. I never suggested openreach are ripping someone off (by charging excessive amounts per the cost to themselves), but rather than it seems there is improvements still to be made in efficiencies. Just install that 36m overhead if the underground cost is excessive. Also why is digging up even required? if they have proper underground infrastructure already in place which is well maintained (which it should be), then the fibre can simply be pushed, pulled or blown through.

If it were me I wouldnt even consider paying thousands for infrastructure in which I have no ownership claim to, if the FTTP was essential I would consider installing my own FTTP cable instead that I own (since I am paying the full cost anyway for the works) and then leasing that cable back to openreach or another telco which could be used to provide broadband services on.

Edited by Chrysalis (Sun 14-Jan-18 00:46:40)

It's good to see our national providers got [censored] covered....

In reply to a post by Chrysalis:

well first to answer your question, openreach are the ones who will own the installed fibre and be able to sell services again and again on that fibre for the life of the fibre. That is a pretty big reason why they should pay for it. Its a bit like me buying a car but then having to pay to rent it out as well.

Complete nonsense. If you go to any utility company and ask them to provide a new service, they will check whether the existing infrastructure can support this. If it can't and new infrastructure is needed, they will charge for it.

In reply to a post by Chrysalis:

I see its now been explained that costs are apparently much higher when its under a carriageway. I never suggested openreach are ripping someone off (by charging excessive amounts per the cost to themselves), but rather than it seems there is improvements still to be made in efficiencies.

Where can there be improvements in efficiencies? If the OP went to a public work's contractor and ask for a quotation for the work to be done, I can almost guarantee it would be significantly more expensive and he wouldn't get the £1,000 contribution from Openreach.

In reply to a post by Chrysalis:

Just install that 36m overhead if the underground cost is excessive.

It's not that simple. Planning regulations restrict the use of overhead cables in many areas now, so this is likely to be an issue.

Also, I doubt the home owners in the neighbourhood would be particularly happy with the sudden installation of multiple telegraph poles outside of their properties.

In reply to a post by Chrysalis:

Also why is digging up even required? if they have proper underground infrastructure already in place which is well maintained (which it should be), then the fibre can simply be pushed, pulled or blown through.

Ducting has only really been used in the last 20-30 years for new properties. Before then it was common to lay telecoms cable directly in the earth.

Even new builds, some developers have laid cable directly in earth (presumably to save cost).

In reply to a post by Chrysalis:

If it were me I wouldnt even consider paying thousands for infrastructure in which I have no ownership claim to, if the FTTP was essential I would consider installing my own FTTP cable instead that I own (since I am paying the full cost anyway for the works) and then leasing that cable back to openreach or another telco which could be used to provide broadband services on.

How would you install your own FTTP cable in a public road? The council would never allow this.

If it's private land, then it's a different story and Openreach do allow people to install ducting to their specification. However, when it comes to carriageways, there are a whole list of reasons why a council would never let someone randomly start digging to install ducting and a fibre cable.

Option is neighbour can get it, install at that property and run ethernet across the garden to your house...

Or just order from BT Retail and hope they absorb the cost (I imagine it is likely they would).

If you really don't want BT Retail, you could encourage a neighbour to order/upgrade or place an order with them and cancel within the 14 day cooling off period.

That fact that this has become industry practice and has been going on for decades with government endorsement is precisely why this practice is a disgrace. As I said, it originates with the government-owned monopoly that became BT.

Telecomms companies should never be allowed to charge customers fees for building company infrastructure.
I can see the point that perhaps a realistic charge could be made for providing the connection on the customers' premises but only with the condition that customers were allowed to provide that part of the line themselves.

I guess you would take offence that if you built a new house, the water, gas and electricity boards would all charge you to connect your property to their grids. This charge is essentially to build the infrastructure to connect you to their networks.

You said NEVER, so how will a company ever recoup the cost of rolling out infrastructure?

I wonder also if the poster has considered how much insurance is needed to do things like provide duct through public footpaths and roads ?

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

As pointed out above digging that deep for over 30m on a live carriageway is an expensive process.

Then perhaps they should use any of the myriad of technologies that exist which don't involve digging the road up to get from one side to the other.

Part of the problem with a BT lead FTTP role out is the costs due to a highly conservative approach to doing the civils. When they where first doing FTTP they would insist on putting new ducting to your house because for some reason it was impossible to reuse the existing ducting that your existing telephone line was in. Not sure if this is still the case but the total lack of imagination on the part of BT/Openreach is pushing the cost up much higher than it needs to be.