It used to be speed test results folk bragged about ....

Lol.. my quote is actually lower than that.. so I don't know where I am in relation to the AgNode.
We are deciding currently if we are going to move as otherwise we are likely to get an order in in the next 6 months or so.

For those looking for a low end baseline of the difference between old and new model, here's the cost for an order at a site previously in Band A we have in flight.

Network build cost: £2,078.32
Less exemption: £1,200 (1 x £700 + 10 x £50)
Total Build Cost: £878

In practice, the cost was higher under the old model.
Agg node is 100m away as the crow flies, about 150m route distance.

Old model would have been £350 build cost (band A), but much higher rental contribution over the term (£2,196.00 on Openreach rental) more over 3 years, comparing 330/30 like for like.

To clarify, this was actually surveyed, not desktop estimate.

I think you misread the old pricing .

FTTPoD had a fixed connection charge of £750, plus the distance charge, which at Band A (up to 199 metres) was the £350 you posted. Also subject to ECCs. So a minimum of £1100. Even worse than you suggest .

In reply to a post by Blmcg:

For those looking for a low end baseline of the difference between old and new model, here's the cost for an order at a site previously in Band A we have in flight.

Network build cost: £2,078.32
Less exemption: £1,200 (1 x £700 + 10 x £50)
Total Build Cost: £878

...........................

To clarify, this was actually surveyed, not desktop estimate.

Out of interest how much was the initial estimated quote? (Desktop survey)

In reply to a post by RobertoS:

I think you misread the old pricing .

FTTPoD had a fixed connection charge of £750, plus the distance charge, which at Band A (up to 199 metres) was the £350 you posted. Also subject to ECCs. So a minimum of £1100. Even worse than you suggest .

Not so much misread, just didn't add it to the calculation!
I was just comparing rental in the second half, but of course it's right to compare the difference from a total cost perspective.

Note Wholesale still charge £500 to cover their order management, so it's not far changed for most of the country.
(We can get closer to the £92 for multi-order deployments in our on-net patch).

But you're right, install on the old product was £750 base vs £92 on anything pre-500M today, so another £658 means the TCO difference, again at Openreach level, is £2,854.00.

In reply to a post by baby_frogmella:

In reply to a post by Blmcg:

For those looking for a low end baseline of the difference between old and new model, here's the cost for an order at a site previously in Band A we have in flight.

Network build cost: £2,078.32
Less exemption: £1,200 (1 x £700 + 10 x £50)
Total Build Cost: £878

...........................

To clarify, this was actually surveyed, not desktop estimate.

Out of interest how much was the initial estimated quote? (Desktop survey)

I'll ask OR to do one retrospectively, but I recall they mentioned it was similar.
Less variation at that distance.

Our findings are that anything beyond band D is hitting the recently imposed (beyond £35k so no committed quote) threshold.

It has to be said though that it is understood that the tool is overestimating most of the time, mainly because the vast majority of orders under the old scheme had ECCs identified at survey, and so the preference is to not under-estimate, whilst considering a lot more factors than distance as the crow flies to the aggregation node.

For perspective, estimates for dedicated Ethernet estimates cap out at 1000 meters radius for a T-node, beyond that it's very loose, and really needs a survey to even get a ballpark.
With NGA aggregation nodes being *far* less prevalent than T-Nodes (small towns will have maybe one or two placed logically to feed all the FTTC cabs), it's no surprise it's hard to quote with confidence until boots have gone on the ground to check the state of play.

Edited by Blmcg (Sat 07-Apr-18 01:21:05)

In reply to a post by Blmcg:

It has to be said though that it is understood that the tool is overestimating most of the time

That's interesting. If it is indeed overestimating as you suggest what happens if the order subsequently gets delivered at lower than the quoted charge? Do OR pocket the leftover sum or does the customer see a partial refund?

In reply to a post by Webbs:

In reply to a post by Blmcg:

It has to be said though that it is understood that the tool is overestimating most of the time

That's interesting. If it is indeed overestimating as you suggest what happens if the order subsequently gets delivered at lower than the quoted charge? Do OR pocket the leftover sum or does the customer see a partial refund?

The install costs determined after the survey will be what you get charged, not the estimated costs (if different). I very much doubt any ISP would ask someone to cough up potentially £39000 up front before the survey. £250 up front fee for the survey sounds reasonable which is taken off the build costs if the order was to go ahead.

I think you have picked something up wrong somewhere.
If you get a quick desktop quote and then pay for a survey, the desktop quote goes in the bin.
A full detailed survey will be done and you will be given that quote. At this point you will have only paid for the full survey.
You can choose not to proceed if the full survey cost is too high for you. So there is no leftover sum to be pocketed or refunded.