And this reacting continues for the life of the connection.

Training period to many suggests it might change for a while but after that it is fixed, which it is not

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

Long term plan is to remove FTTC in the FTTP overbuild areas and remove VDSL2 in G.fast areas too

Except Prudhoe Cab 5 sprouted a G.fast pod (which is still not active) then sprouted a second FTTC twin at least a couple of months after the G.fast pod was added. I am definitely on board with FTTC removal if FTTP is available, but FTTC removal if G.fast is available will see many people getting poorer upload speeds and be very unpopular to those affected.

Key words - long term and Openreach needs to consult before big changes to the products like this

If you remove VDSL2 you can a chunk of spectrum that will give Gfast better performance of course.

This is more like 2025 and onwards we are talking

Hi

In reply to a post by jabuzzard:

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

Long term plan is to remove FTTC in the FTTP overbuild areas and remove VDSL2 in G.fast areas too

Except Prudhoe Cab 5 sprouted a G.fast pod (which is still not active) then sprouted a second FTTC twin at least a couple of months after the G.fast pod was added. I am definitely on board with FTTC removal if FTTP is available, but FTTC removal if G.fast is available will see many people getting poorer upload speeds and be very unpopular to those affected.

I agree, I can't see they would ever remove FTTC and transfer everyone over to G.Fast, for one G.Fast has much less capacity to serve as many customers, both physically (small attached pod) and electronically due to issues supporting vectoring over large numbers of connections. Besides it is the FTTC cabinet that provides the G.Fast pod with power, backup power and data, so that needs to remain as is in some form.

I suppose they could upgrade the FTTC cabinet to support G.Fast, but the issue there is it adds in many cases many metres of copper distance, greatly affecting the reach, which is why they went for the pod on the PCP approach.

As G.Fast is essentially dead in the water, what is installed will remain until such a time they can move those connections over to FTTP I should think.

Regards

Phil

Be careful using Virgin as an example of demand for faster speeds...

e.g. the bundles where 100 Mbps is often the minimum and period offers with this lifted to 200 Mbps
Also some may be jumping to get better upload

The takeaway to gain from Virgin is the number paying for the top tier

I would also add that many people will upgrade to higher download speeds than they need on Virgin to get better upload speeds. If you take a VIVD100 bundle your upload is only 6Mbps which is pants compared to a 80/20 FTTC which actually gets 80/20 even through the download speed is higher. Personally I would need the VIVD350 bundle to be as useful as my current full 80/20 FTTC connection even though I don't really need all that extra download speed. Though some would be nice.

Given the Openreach long term plan is to just have FTTP and G.fast as the two broadband services .

So majority in a cabinet get FTTP and those with landlord problems e.g. no permission to get FTTP installed get the G.fast.

Except this is going to require a different sort of G.fast than is currently being deployed. Basically they are going to have to stick G.fast cabinets outside every block of flats they cannot get permission to enter.

I think it would make more sense to lobby for changes to the law so landlords cannot refuse permission for a FTTP install. I would imagine there are few MP's who would vote against such a law.

Then again landlords refusing permission for an FTTP install are idiots, and in time will find it very hard to let properties.

Which is exactly what I implied, it's does need a better description though than training. But regardless of what it's called new lines or lines which have had a change in package or DLM reset do have a period where they will generally perform worse than optimum for an unknown length of time

In reply to a post by MrSaffron:

Long term plan is to remove FTTC in the FTTP overbuild areas and remove VDSL2 in G.fast areas too

That's probably the 1 thing I would predict won't happen.

What about everyone out of reach of G.Fast?
With the limited reach of G.Fast it would be madness to remove VDSL2 without a suitable alternative.
Even with the VDSL2 spectrum being freed up for G.Fast the range just isn't there.

Rolling out FTTP for those beyond the G.Fast range and ignoring those within range would be a bit pointless imo.

It sounds like a mad strategy unless they start doing node based G.Fast. That seems an unlikely prospect.