partial

what are you on about

The future should be done properly. - properly as defined by the openreach rules and policies and decisioning process or properly as defined by you (who has no input knowledge or involvement in the above)

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

Who's direct burying nowadays?

Shallow yes, direct buried no.

Virgin media did my street with FTTP around 9 months ago.
It isn't the 2-3 inches deep horror stories that I keep hearing about but nearer a foot deep.

It's definitely not direct buried.

Partial is fixated with that the 250mm minimum cover they have to deliver in footways is shallow burying, and that microducts don't count as duct but direct burying of fibre cable.

See comments under name 'Fibre Bubble' on ISPR.

To be fair, a bit of nylon tube 6 or 8mm in diameter isn't going to protect the contents from a spade or fork, and Virgin Media have a bit of a reputation for just laying it under the surface from the Toby to the property.

It's worse than that as the most widespread cable detectors that utilities and their contractors use will not pick up the shallow direct in ground fibre tubes.

Whereas the shallow shoddy traditional drops Virgin did across peoples gardens are detectable. Albeit many times because they are now on the surface and visible.

Possibly the biggest problem is not the cutting of the shallow tubes but the damaging of them. This has always been the biggest problem for buried copper. Not the cutting the damage. Shallow unreported damage to tubes will quickly fill with water and shortly after silt.

Damaged fibre tubes full of silt and no option to expand the network without further extensive shallow trenching. The future deserves better.

In reply to a post by Fastman3:

partial

what are you on about

The future should be done properly. - properly as defined by the openreach rules and policies and decisioning process or properly as defined by you (who has no input knowledge or involvement in the above)

Experience that tells me to treat BT planning rules with extreme caution. For example, it wasn't that long ago that BT planning rules were prescribing 0.8 pairs per plot on new builds in an age of second lines in the back bedroom. More problems than you can shake a DACS at.

We sorted it but luckily we had the duct space to do it.

Edited by deleted (Wed 12-Aug-20 21:36:42)

I know what your saying but all to often jobs in all trades have corners cut to save time and money, most don't care about potential problems in the future.

Not to mention that in the 70's DIG and aluminium was considered a good idea, although obviously ally was pretty god for phone calls, it still corroded quicker.

These are commercial rollouts we're talking about, and choices are made for commercial reasons, which includes both cost and how quickly they can be deployed.

Cityfibre and the like have chosen to spend some of their money on narrow trenching and microducting. They *could* spend more on traditional ducting, which *might* be better in the long run, but it might not. Traditional ducting is still subject to blockages and breakage of course, as Openreach's own network testifies.

It will be interesting to see what happens in the long run. If an individual microduct becomes blocked, or a bundle of microducts becomes damaged, will they reinstall the whole runs, or just abandon those customers? And how often will this occur in practice? I think we are too early into these deployments to have any idea.

I am aware of the reasons and fully appreciate what your saying.

VM started installing in our area around two to three years ago, I often look on one.network due to the on-going FTTP rollout and often see VM roadworks stating rectify blocked duct, so yes it's all ready happening and they do seem to be fixing at least some of them.

PS it's only nylon tubing, they probably cut it and use speed fit fittings to fit a new section of tubing.

Edited by R0NSKI (Thu 13-Aug-20 13:33:51)