In reply to a post by Fido:

We had considerred AAISP but the fact that AAISP insist on an open ended Direct Debit and they make you fully liable in the unlikely event that the system is hacked certainly put me off0.

I assume that's very new.

In the past I've always paid my A&A bill via bank transfer.
Even purchasing hardware from their shop prior to being a regular customer, they would send the items BEFORE receiving payment, and I would do a bank transfer when they invoiced me.

I joined their VOIP for someone about 2 years ago and they still didn't insist on a direct debit then. It's still paid by bank transfer.

What is an "open ended" direct debit?
Direct debits come with a guarantee from the bank, not the vendor.

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

In the past I've always paid my A&A bill via bank transfer.

I joined AAISP with a data SIM in about 2016, and their VoIP service in 2019, the latest invoice says:
Payment by Direct Debit as agreed

Some help pages, the first one mentions that Direct Debit is preferred.
https://www.aa.net.uk/legal/billing-options/

Direct Debit - https://www.aa.net.uk/legal/direct-debits/
Bank Transfer - https://www.aa.net.uk/legal/bacs-payments/

Edited by jchamier (Mon 29-May-23 12:58:24)

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

Direct debits come with a guarantee from the bank, not the vendor.

The T&C with AAISP make you fully liable in the event that your AAISP account is hacked. - (Unlikely but possible).

Therefore, if the AAISP system says that you owe them money for calls you did not make you are on a sticky wicket because you agreed to the T&C and they will simply use the Direct Debit System to claim it.

Why run the risk of a payment dispute?

At least with Voipify you can either pay in advance by putting money in the account, (which limits your liability), or you can pay in arrears, (upon receipt of invoices), up to a monthly buffer price that you set, (so again your liability is limited).

When I checked with AAISP you had to pay by Direct Debit and the AAISP month bill is open ended and cannot be capped.

In reply to a post by Fido:

In reply to a post by j0hn83:

Direct debits come with a guarantee from the bank, not the vendor.

When I checked with AAISP you had to pay by Direct Debit and the AAISP month bill is open ended and cannot be capped.

I'd be a little surprised if AAISP did not also mention in their response to you some of the overspend protection options in their VoIP control panel:
a) There are two separate settings, for national calls and international calls, that limit the maximum cost (in pence) of the first minute of every outbound call. Calls that cost more than those limits will not succeed.

b) The is a settable spend threshold that results in an automatically generated warning email when your total spend in the current billing period reaches that limit.

c) You can specify a list of IP addresses and/or subnets that are permitted to originate calls. Call origination attempts from addresses outwith that list will not succeed.

I can also tell you that payment options other than just monthly Direct Debit are available on customer accounts where AAISP also supply the Internet connection. However when the only product involved is a VoIP service then the customer could potentially be based anywhere in the world and AAISP can hardly be blamed for taking steps to protect themselves from fraudulent use of their services.

In reply to a post by Fido:

When I checked with AAISP you had to pay by Direct Debit and the AAISP month bill is open ended and cannot be capped.

If I understand the Direct Debit rules correctly (as per the Pay UK website which is the official interbank organisation that handles the payment systems) the vendor has to give notice (normally at least 10 working days) before collection of a variable Direct Debit amount. That means that there is time to either reach agreement with the vendor in regard to a disputed payment or for you to cancel the Direct Debit agreement at your bank which will then stop the disputed payment while a resolution is reached.

Not quite as easy as being able to set a cap but it is not correct to assume that your account could be hacked and then you have no way of holding back the payment.