In reply to a post by squarecrumpets:

Is it possible that both Openreach and an independent company serves the same block of flats?

Any number of full fibre providers can install equipment to serve a block of flats, provided that they have permission to enter. My flat has access to full fibre from Openreach plus two AltNets / "independent companies".

Yes, and there are places with 3-5 FTTP overbuilds in the same MDU!

The problem is that this all depends on the management company and whether they are happy to grant the wayleave agreement.

In my example, my management refused wayleave for Hyperoptic in 2015 but granted wayleave for Community Fibre exactly 2 months after a government legislation was signed to ease wayleave access.

Then most recently last year in June a wayleave was agreed for a 2nd FTTP overbuild Virgin Media (nexfibre). Most of the MDUs managed by my housing estate have now gone live. My building initially was showing as live but is not live again. It seems they haven't yet started working inside my building.

But I know that in June they are working in my street again. Openreach FTTP however, is not yet planned for us. Though, bizarrely other buildings managed by the same company in Mile End for example, would show as planned.

The biggest problem with this wayleave is that we don't have a choice to influence our management what FTTP provider they'll grant wayleave.

I'd always give first preference to Openreach FTTP compared to Nexfibre. Unless Nexfibre really did give more competitive prices. But they haven't yet done any wholesale agreements with anyone else other than Virgin Media and we don't know what those packages will be like. With Openreach I'm already familiar with their prices.

Ultimately most of us 5-10 years down the line are expected to get upgraded to Openreach FTTP. But we have no influence on what Altnet a management company will choose. I'd avoid e.g. OFNL, G.Network as they have bad customer service and are very expensive. But if my management for example, did grant wayleave for any of them I can't stop them from going ahead.

Likewise, there are other Altnets like CityFibre that are even cheaper than Openreach+symmetrical, which I'd certainly be happy to have but I know they won't build in London!

Many places in London also have Community Fibre and Hyperoptic. For example, in Winterton House Shadwell they have Community Fibre, Hyperoptic, Openreach FTTP and Virgin Media Coax. That's 4 FTTP overbuild providers in the same building!

Yet, I know some places where they are still waiting for the very first FTTP provider to go live! And other places like Heron Tower Barbican only have Hyperoptic (No FTTC) and nothing else live or planned. But at the same time 1 minute walk to Willoughby House, Barbican they have Openreach FTTP and 4th Utility.

In reply to a post by squarecrumpets:

Is it possible that both Openreach and an independent company serves the same block of flats? I've just entered my postcode into Netomnia which tells me they are ready to build but require wayleave from the landlord. At the same time, Openreach tells me we're part of their build plans.

I lived in a flat with Hyperoptic, Virgin Media and I think ADSL2+ from OR (I think it may have been a direct to exchange or something. I forget now).

Hyperoptic did a great job with cabling in common areas - very neat.. Virgin... did the opposite.
seb

In reply to a post by seb:

Hyperoptic did a great job with cabling in common areas - very neat..

Nice... and essential for any big blocks.

Virgin... did the opposite.

LOL... here everything is external.

In reply to a post by jchamier:

In reply to a post by seb:

Hyperoptic did a great job with cabling in common areas - very neat..

Nice... and essential for any big blocks.

Virgin... did the opposite.

LOL... here everything is external.

The wall needs to be ripped off due to materials and EWS1 so ... that would get rid of Virgin
It's also 20 storeys tall in some places so don't think that would have worked.

In reply to a post by behuk:

In reply to a post by squarecrumpets:

Is it possible that both Openreach and an independent company serves the same block of flats?

Any number of full fibre providers can install equipment to serve a block of flats, provided that they have permission to enter. My flat has access to full fibre from Openreach plus two AltNets / "independent companies".

Thanks for this info. The landlord didn't object to the large number of splitter cabinets being installed?

In reply to a post by BLaZiNgSPEED:

Yes, and there are places with 3-5 FTTP overbuilds in the same MDU!

The problem is that this all depends on the management company and whether they are happy to grant the wayleave agreement.

In my example, my management refused wayleave for Hyperoptic in 2015 but granted wayleave for Community Fibre exactly 2 months after a government legislation was signed to ease wayleave access.

Then most recently last year in June a wayleave was agreed for a 2nd FTTP overbuild Virgin Media (nexfibre). Most of the MDUs managed by my housing estate have now gone live. My building initially was showing as live but is not live again. It seems they haven't yet started working inside my building.

But I know that in June they are working in my street again. Openreach FTTP however, is not yet planned for us. Though, bizarrely other buildings managed by the same company in Mile End for example, would show as planned.

The biggest problem with this wayleave is that we don't have a choice to influence our management what FTTP provider they'll grant wayleave.

I'd always give first preference to Openreach FTTP compared to Nexfibre. Unless Nexfibre really did give more competitive prices. But they haven't yet done any wholesale agreements with anyone else other than Virgin Media and we don't know what those packages will be like. With Openreach I'm already familiar with their prices.

Ultimately most of us 5-10 years down the line are expected to get upgraded to Openreach FTTP. But we have no influence on what Altnet a management company will choose. I'd avoid e.g. OFNL, G.Network as they have bad customer service and are very expensive. But if my management for example, did grant wayleave for any of them I can't stop them from going ahead.

Likewise, there are other Altnets like CityFibre that are even cheaper than Openreach+symmetrical, which I'd certainly be happy to have but I know they won't build in London!

Many places in London also have Community Fibre and Hyperoptic. For example, in Winterton House Shadwell they have Community Fibre, Hyperoptic, Openreach FTTP and Virgin Media Coax. That's 4 FTTP overbuild providers in the same building!

Yet, I know some places where they are still waiting for the very first FTTP provider to go live! And other places like Heron Tower Barbican only have Hyperoptic (No FTTC) and nothing else live or planned. But at the same time 1 minute walk to Willoughby House, Barbican they have Openreach FTTP and 4th Utility.

Thanks this is good info.

Where I live, the management company can't provide the wayleave but the Landlord does. A while back they contacted the landlord who then contacted Openreach only to be told it's too early to provide wayleave. At least this shows their willingness to help residents.

As far as choice of networks, if I wanted to reduce the number of fibre equipment etc. then I'd allow Openreach as top priority. This is because they have the highest number of ISPs connected to their network (over 650). CityFibre has about 30 but they're decent ones. Netomnia only works with YouFibre I believe. I believe Hyperoptic and Virgin are closed networks.

Yup Openreach is asymmetrical for now but I doubt the landlord will be concerned about that.

You mean the leaseholder of your flat where you're living in who is renting it out?
If it is the leaseholder (landlord) then he/she is still powerless to do anything about it. My parents are leaseholders here but the management is EastendHomes.

In my case it doesn't matter that we pay them service charge or whether my parents own the flat. Wayleave can't be individually granted for specific flats only. It has to be granted for the entire residential building!

This is also one reason why Openreach FTTP on Demand (FTTPoD) does not work for MDU buildings. Because even if you paid Openreach they still can't install without the permission of the landowner/building owner.

If you know your management company and know who is the housing estate officer or technical services manager then contacting them would be more useful. Also, they may be organising leaseholders meetings every 1-3 months in your local estate office. Attending those meetings and raising those concerns can be helpful.

Speaking with your neighbours can also be helpful since I am sure they will want FTTP as well. Of-course if you are still waiting for the first FTTP provider then it is difficult to say, which provider will be granted permission. I'd still be ready to welcome whatever is being offered as it will be better than nothing.

As for the multiple FTTP networks (should it become available), you won't have to worry about the number of equipment going into your flat. If for example, you chose only Openreach FTTP then only Openreach FTTP ONT and its fibre drop cable will enter your flat. If you only separately order in future another Altnet only then you will be having the multiple ONT equipment and fibre cables entering your flat.

For example, Community Fibre is available here last 2 years. I haven't yet joined them as for some reason I have been happy with BT FTTC last 3 years. Because I didn't order their service yet the fibre cable does not yet enter inside our flat and I don't have an ONT yet! But if I did order only then an engineer will come to visit our flat and install the fibre drop cable and ONT.

In reply to a post by squarecrumpets:

Thanks for this info. The landlord didn't object to the large number of splitter cabinets being installed?

The three installations are relatively compact so it's not a big deal. The bigger "problem" is the POE modules above each front door, but even then I'd argue it's better to have multiple POE modules than to have a monopoly on the physical network.

PS: I am assuming that by "landlord" you mean the freeholder of the block (or their agent).

In reply to a post by behuk:

In reply to a post by squarecrumpets:

Thanks for this info. The landlord didn't object to the large number of splitter cabinets being installed?

The three installations are relatively compact so it's not a big deal. The bigger "problem" is the POE modules above each front door, but even then I'd argue it's better to have multiple POE modules than to have a monopoly on the physical network.

PS: I am assuming that by "landlord" you mean the freeholder of the block (or their agent).

Yes Landlord the company that owns the leasehold. It is John Lewis. It’s up to them rather than the management company.